by liberal japonicus
Another short thread as I try to write a much longer one. Most of us realize that things are going to be different and this is your thread devoted to telling us what will be different and how different it will be. Two articles that might give a nudge:
all that was needed Brexit and a dash of RNA, whoda thunk it?
There will be a lot of broken habits that will slow if ever, to recover.
If Millinals survive the stress of learning how to cook, they may be slow to return to eating out. Both because of the perceived, even if a reduced risk and some of them wanting to cook now that they’ve learn how.
And there may be fewer kids returning to public schools. Some parents are no doubt dying to get their kids back in school. But some parents will have discovered other ways for their kids to get educated. They will discover that schooling is not necessarily the same as educating. They’ll find alternatives like homeschooling, online schooling, unschooling, ala carte schooling.
Disasters often hit the reset button for a lot of things. Before Hurricane Katrina, New Orleans had some of the worse schools in the country will little hope of meaningful improvement. Now their schools are almost 100% charter. Not the best schools in the country but a lot better than what they replaced.
A lot of people will discover that they like working at home and will resist returning to offices no matter how safe.
There will be a lot of broken habits that will slow if ever, to recover.
If Millinals survive the stress of learning how to cook, they may be slow to return to eating out. Both because of the perceived, even if a reduced risk and some of them wanting to cook now that they’ve learn how.
And there may be fewer kids returning to public schools. Some parents are no doubt dying to get their kids back in school. But some parents will have discovered other ways for their kids to get educated. They will discover that schooling is not necessarily the same as educating. They’ll find alternatives like homeschooling, online schooling, unschooling, ala carte schooling.
Disasters often hit the reset button for a lot of things. Before Hurricane Katrina, New Orleans had some of the worse schools in the country will little hope of meaningful improvement. Now their schools are almost 100% charter. Not the best schools in the country but a lot better than what they replaced.
A lot of people will discover that they like working at home and will resist returning to offices no matter how safe.
Off topic, but since this is the most recent post — numbers for US and UK updated in the “For hsh” graphs through 5/3.
Off topic, but since this is the most recent post — numbers for US and UK updated in the “For hsh” graphs through 5/3.
I’ve owned Berkshire Hathaway stock several times thru the years ….. just got back in a few weeks ago.
Warren Buffet decision to invest heavily in airlines stocks was one of the head-scratchers of his career.
For decades, he had sworn he would never put money in the airlines. It is the most cyclical industry going and when tough times hit their totally leveraged assets sit on the ground, moldering as their bankers fidget.
He would figuratively spit on the floor when the subject came up in interviews.
Then around 2015-16, he changed his mind, saying the airlines, like the Chicago Cubs, had just, he hoped, put a bad century behind them and seemed to have become more of a value growth industry.
My theory is that as Buffet and Munger began to bring younger money managers on board during the last decade to groom them for the inevitable succession in the Berkshire conglomerate, he got talked into something.
Now, like the Cubs, he’s changing the lineup again.
I’ve owned Berkshire Hathaway stock several times thru the years ….. just got back in a few weeks ago.
Warren Buffet decision to invest heavily in airlines stocks was one of the head-scratchers of his career.
For decades, he had sworn he would never put money in the airlines. It is the most cyclical industry going and when tough times hit their totally leveraged assets sit on the ground, moldering as their bankers fidget.
He would figuratively spit on the floor when the subject came up in interviews.
Then around 2015-16, he changed his mind, saying the airlines, like the Chicago Cubs, had just, he hoped, put a bad century behind them and seemed to have become more of a value growth industry.
My theory is that as Buffet and Munger began to bring younger money managers on board during the last decade to groom them for the inevitable succession in the Berkshire conglomerate, he got talked into something.
Now, like the Cubs, he’s changing the lineup again.
1. From lj’s 2nd link (with the usual disclaimer that I haven’t read the whole thing carefully…yet):
The border county of Cavan now has the highest number of cases relative to its population, even though it is only the 25th largest county by population in Ireland.
Is there any logic to this sentence at all?
2. And then, good luck figuring out what a “caretaker taoiseach” is, a concept that seems to render the Irish even more convolutedly verbose than they normally are. E.g. here and here.
3. Other than that, if Warren Buffett says (in lj’s first link) that the outbreak could have an “extraordinarily wide” range of possible outcomes, who am I to prognosticate?
4. Clearly I’m getting punchy, so it’s time to stop.
1. From lj’s 2nd link (with the usual disclaimer that I haven’t read the whole thing carefully…yet):
The border county of Cavan now has the highest number of cases relative to its population, even though it is only the 25th largest county by population in Ireland.
Is there any logic to this sentence at all?
2. And then, good luck figuring out what a “caretaker taoiseach” is, a concept that seems to render the Irish even more convolutedly verbose than they normally are. E.g. here and here.
3. Other than that, if Warren Buffett says (in lj’s first link) that the outbreak could have an “extraordinarily wide” range of possible outcomes, who am I to prognosticate?
4. Clearly I’m getting punchy, so it’s time to stop.
Even the mighty sage of Omaha blunders now and then, I mean he’s ONLY 89 years old. Give him time.
Gives me hope.
The airline play is rather odd. Buffet made a big name (and lots of money) on fundamentals analysis…good solid earnings growth, Low P/E, solid undervalued assets, stolid but sound management vision, nothing fancy. The airline industry has historically been the exact opposite…remember the days of Howard Hughes? I’d have rather bet the farm on cocoa futures.
But even Buffet can run out of investment opportunities as the ginormous size of his portfolio made it more difficult to distinguish his strategy from that of an ordinary index fund.
A pity Pablo Escobar didn’t go public. Now there was a value play. Strong sales, fantastic earnings, no debt, free cash flow off the charts, and when the end came…a great short opportunity.
There will be salvage in the wreckage….always is. I confidently predict the market will go up or down.
Even the mighty sage of Omaha blunders now and then, I mean he’s ONLY 89 years old. Give him time.
Gives me hope.
The airline play is rather odd. Buffet made a big name (and lots of money) on fundamentals analysis…good solid earnings growth, Low P/E, solid undervalued assets, stolid but sound management vision, nothing fancy. The airline industry has historically been the exact opposite…remember the days of Howard Hughes? I’d have rather bet the farm on cocoa futures.
But even Buffet can run out of investment opportunities as the ginormous size of his portfolio made it more difficult to distinguish his strategy from that of an ordinary index fund.
A pity Pablo Escobar didn’t go public. Now there was a value play. Strong sales, fantastic earnings, no debt, free cash flow off the charts, and when the end came…a great short opportunity.
There will be salvage in the wreckage….always is. I confidently predict the market will go up or down.
Now their schools are almost 100% charter. Not the best schools in the country but a lot better than what they replaced.
Really?
Ya’ don’t say!
Grifters gotta’ grift!
You can’t be serious.
Now their schools are almost 100% charter. Not the best schools in the country but a lot better than what they replaced.
Really?
Ya’ don’t say!
Grifters gotta’ grift!
You can’t be serious.
I keep thinking about the “How does one become a janitor?” scene in Breakfast Club. One thing I think will be different is that the value of sanitation will be more appreciated. I’ve mentioned it before on this blog, but I ponder the value of effective cleaning practices in shared spaces, be it in offices buildings or public places. What unnecessary costs have been avoided over, I don’t know, the last century or so by janitorial work?
I can imagine custodial jobs becoming more technical in nature, with more training and knowledge being required and more rigorous standards applied. I would like to think more pay would come with all of that.
Perhaps a similar line of thinking would apply to other jobs as well. “Working people” (a debatable term, I know) should be paid better for a number of reasons. Maybe I’m just looking for silver linings.
I keep thinking about the “How does one become a janitor?” scene in Breakfast Club. One thing I think will be different is that the value of sanitation will be more appreciated. I’ve mentioned it before on this blog, but I ponder the value of effective cleaning practices in shared spaces, be it in offices buildings or public places. What unnecessary costs have been avoided over, I don’t know, the last century or so by janitorial work?
I can imagine custodial jobs becoming more technical in nature, with more training and knowledge being required and more rigorous standards applied. I would like to think more pay would come with all of that.
Perhaps a similar line of thinking would apply to other jobs as well. “Working people” (a debatable term, I know) should be paid better for a number of reasons. Maybe I’m just looking for silver linings.
Just a couple initial items off the top of my head.
I expect a lot of business travel to get reconsidered. Initially, companies stop doing hardly any of it — hey, it’s a big plus for the sacred-to-MBSs bottom line. (Except the part that is just an executive perk, of course.) Then, after a few years, they start to figure out that some kinds of team building/networking/etc. just work better in person. Especially the stuff that comes out of serendipitous side conversations. The organizations which figure it out first will tend to be the ones that thrive.
In addition, lots of companies discover that they don’t really need all the office space they have. Lots of jobs can be done just fine from home, and maybe the employee comes in a couple times a month. But it will take some major adjustments on the part of low level managers. Because they can’t watch how people work; they’ll have to manage by objective.
Commercial office space becomes a drug on the market. At least until it gets repurposed.
One up side to more virtual meetings? Race becomes less of a factor in evaluations and promotions, just because a voice alone is less likely to set off unconscious biases. (And it’s far easier to cultivate a different accent than to change your looks.)
Just a couple initial items off the top of my head.
I expect a lot of business travel to get reconsidered. Initially, companies stop doing hardly any of it — hey, it’s a big plus for the sacred-to-MBSs bottom line. (Except the part that is just an executive perk, of course.) Then, after a few years, they start to figure out that some kinds of team building/networking/etc. just work better in person. Especially the stuff that comes out of serendipitous side conversations. The organizations which figure it out first will tend to be the ones that thrive.
In addition, lots of companies discover that they don’t really need all the office space they have. Lots of jobs can be done just fine from home, and maybe the employee comes in a couple times a month. But it will take some major adjustments on the part of low level managers. Because they can’t watch how people work; they’ll have to manage by objective.
Commercial office space becomes a drug on the market. At least until it gets repurposed.
One up side to more virtual meetings? Race becomes less of a factor in evaluations and promotions, just because a voice alone is less likely to set off unconscious biases. (And it’s far easier to cultivate a different accent than to change your looks.)
A lot of people are discovering that they have from 1-3 hrs more in the day–not commuting. For many this will be hard to give up.
I think a lot of business travel will go away, and a lot of meetings (especially if it is “here is our speaker”) move online. I’ve just observed one that in its original form might have have 200 people, instead got 4000 worldwide.
A lot of people are discovering that they have from 1-3 hrs more in the day–not commuting. For many this will be hard to give up.
I think a lot of business travel will go away, and a lot of meetings (especially if it is “here is our speaker”) move online. I’ve just observed one that in its original form might have have 200 people, instead got 4000 worldwide.
bobbyp, yes. The thing is, with charter schools, upper class families are able to negotiate the system and make sure that their kids don’t lost out. But for the ones who do not have that privilege, it doesn’t happen, except for the rare case that then ‘proves’ that people can pull themselves up by their bootstraps if they just pull hard enough.
And I don’t mean to crap on wj’s optimism, but I’m teaching here in Japan and I’m amazed at how many teachers are demanding that students turn on their videos. I see the same dynamic happening in evaluations and promotions because not seeing faces means that the power relationship is diminished and people who would have the largest unconscious biases are not going to want to give up being able to see their subordinates.
bobbyp, yes. The thing is, with charter schools, upper class families are able to negotiate the system and make sure that their kids don’t lost out. But for the ones who do not have that privilege, it doesn’t happen, except for the rare case that then ‘proves’ that people can pull themselves up by their bootstraps if they just pull hard enough.
And I don’t mean to crap on wj’s optimism, but I’m teaching here in Japan and I’m amazed at how many teachers are demanding that students turn on their videos. I see the same dynamic happening in evaluations and promotions because not seeing faces means that the power relationship is diminished and people who would have the largest unconscious biases are not going to want to give up being able to see their subordinates.
This is a development
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/may/03/coronavirus-health-passports-for-uk-possible-in-months
I joked that this would be a nice little earner for the UK government, you charge people for their immunity passport. Of course, this presumes a lot of things, like people don’t get reinfected, transmission is contained. Honestly, if there is a way to monetize it, I’m sure some shithole will do it.
This is a development
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/may/03/coronavirus-health-passports-for-uk-possible-in-months
I joked that this would be a nice little earner for the UK government, you charge people for their immunity passport. Of course, this presumes a lot of things, like people don’t get reinfected, transmission is contained. Honestly, if there is a way to monetize it, I’m sure some shithole will do it.
the company i work for has already unnecessary canceled biz travel through all of next year.
the company i work for has already unnecessary canceled biz travel through all of next year.
oh proof reading…
…has already canceled unnecessary biz travel …
oh proof reading…
…has already canceled unnecessary biz travel …
Regarding the subject of lj’s link:
The presumptions are monstrous from the getgo, considering this:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/24/health/coronavirus-antibody-tests.html?smid=tw-nytimesscience
This is going to be a long, hard slog during which Casey Stengel’s peculiarities of the mind will manifest.
All of us are going to turn out like Jimmy Piersall, running the bases backwards exhibiting facial tics.
National Jewish Hospital in Denver just down the street from me is offering Covid-19 antibody tests for $92, as of late last week.
You must have an appointment and they can only be made online. No phone calls.
They open up appointments every few days for the few following days.
Thus far, no luck, and in fact a friend of my ex wife said she was putting her credit card information in when the site informed her all of the appointments were taken.
The total lack of a mediating human voice, even one dispensing false comfort, as a result of the now fully and forcibly (What? Because it’s not government, but instead the “free” market that forced this “efficient” change upon us, it’s somehow NOT force without choice? Pure American dog shit drivel!) intact technological trend (and it’s going to get worse) to eliminate verbal interaction and then call the technology “interactive” is Orwellian, Kafkakian and Joseph Helleristic all rolled into one.
This waiting for, what, resolution, while fucking crazy malign animals in the White House rampage their ideological fetishes while using Covid-19 as cover.
Before any other “changes” are made to our lives, the one change that is going to happen is that those ilk will be fucking stopped, one way or the other.
And the less pretty that way is will be fair warning to any follow-up republican filth about governing going forward.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADxFPQZAlJw
Meanwhile, just to IMAGINE getting a blood test to MAYBE supply some possible scientific footing for KNOWING something about one’s own medical condition, and that without some unacceptable margin of error is, well, the stress I can only compare to the pilots and crews manning the bombing missions in Joseph Heller’s “Catch-22”.
You think you are nearing some end, or even possibly a vague outline pointing toward an end of uncertainty, and then disembodied words on a screen tell you, the whys and wherefores left to your own vivid imagination, that your possibly fatal missions have been extended yet again.
The only possible soothe is to move cocktail hour to yet again an earlier time during the day, but so as not to interfere with exercise hour, the reading hours, etc.
Anyway, I’m about to don my masked, gloved, and hooded ninja assassin get-up and venture out for provisions.
The elevator (now limited to one person or one family per ride) in my building now sports sanitary soap dispensers. I’m thinking of hanging my tooth brush in there too to remind me to brush before I leave home, the leaving routine being so unfamiliar from recent disuse.
Maybe they’ll install a vanity mirror in there too.
How about a bidet? I fear the landlord may be thinking in the long term that the elevators could double as fully equipped bathrooms and wondering if they could save money by removing the bathrooms IN the apartments.
After all, things will change, won’t they?
This time, I hope to remember to wash my hands before dressing, so I don’t have to turn around in the hallway and take everything off, wash them, and then re-dress, like some chimerical combination of the hapless Inspector Clouseau and the art thief he is tracking.
Dressed as I am, I feel that I should be sneaking into Target via a skylight and lowering myself via Mission Impossible spider cable into the aisle of cleaning products, and taser a grandmother as she tucks the last box of Kleenex under her arm, repair to the bathroom to strip and reveal the tuxedo I’m wearing underneath, and then box of tissue in hand, waltz out the front door like David Niven heading to his villa in Monaco with the stolen Renoir.
Yes, things could be much worse.
I could be a mother in Africa slogging eight miles to the under-supplied, under-doctored clinic to petition someone regarding which of seven deadly diseases my children are near dying of.
Regarding the subject of lj’s link:
The presumptions are monstrous from the getgo, considering this:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/24/health/coronavirus-antibody-tests.html?smid=tw-nytimesscience
This is going to be a long, hard slog during which Casey Stengel’s peculiarities of the mind will manifest.
All of us are going to turn out like Jimmy Piersall, running the bases backwards exhibiting facial tics.
National Jewish Hospital in Denver just down the street from me is offering Covid-19 antibody tests for $92, as of late last week.
You must have an appointment and they can only be made online. No phone calls.
They open up appointments every few days for the few following days.
Thus far, no luck, and in fact a friend of my ex wife said she was putting her credit card information in when the site informed her all of the appointments were taken.
The total lack of a mediating human voice, even one dispensing false comfort, as a result of the now fully and forcibly (What? Because it’s not government, but instead the “free” market that forced this “efficient” change upon us, it’s somehow NOT force without choice? Pure American dog shit drivel!) intact technological trend (and it’s going to get worse) to eliminate verbal interaction and then call the technology “interactive” is Orwellian, Kafkakian and Joseph Helleristic all rolled into one.
This waiting for, what, resolution, while fucking crazy malign animals in the White House rampage their ideological fetishes while using Covid-19 as cover.
Before any other “changes” are made to our lives, the one change that is going to happen is that those ilk will be fucking stopped, one way or the other.
And the less pretty that way is will be fair warning to any follow-up republican filth about governing going forward.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADxFPQZAlJw
Meanwhile, just to IMAGINE getting a blood test to MAYBE supply some possible scientific footing for KNOWING something about one’s own medical condition, and that without some unacceptable margin of error is, well, the stress I can only compare to the pilots and crews manning the bombing missions in Joseph Heller’s “Catch-22”.
You think you are nearing some end, or even possibly a vague outline pointing toward an end of uncertainty, and then disembodied words on a screen tell you, the whys and wherefores left to your own vivid imagination, that your possibly fatal missions have been extended yet again.
The only possible soothe is to move cocktail hour to yet again an earlier time during the day, but so as not to interfere with exercise hour, the reading hours, etc.
Anyway, I’m about to don my masked, gloved, and hooded ninja assassin get-up and venture out for provisions.
The elevator (now limited to one person or one family per ride) in my building now sports sanitary soap dispensers. I’m thinking of hanging my tooth brush in there too to remind me to brush before I leave home, the leaving routine being so unfamiliar from recent disuse.
Maybe they’ll install a vanity mirror in there too.
How about a bidet? I fear the landlord may be thinking in the long term that the elevators could double as fully equipped bathrooms and wondering if they could save money by removing the bathrooms IN the apartments.
After all, things will change, won’t they?
This time, I hope to remember to wash my hands before dressing, so I don’t have to turn around in the hallway and take everything off, wash them, and then re-dress, like some chimerical combination of the hapless Inspector Clouseau and the art thief he is tracking.
Dressed as I am, I feel that I should be sneaking into Target via a skylight and lowering myself via Mission Impossible spider cable into the aisle of cleaning products, and taser a grandmother as she tucks the last box of Kleenex under her arm, repair to the bathroom to strip and reveal the tuxedo I’m wearing underneath, and then box of tissue in hand, waltz out the front door like David Niven heading to his villa in Monaco with the stolen Renoir.
Yes, things could be much worse.
I could be a mother in Africa slogging eight miles to the under-supplied, under-doctored clinic to petition someone regarding which of seven deadly diseases my children are near dying of.
Yeah, it could be worse, or better:
I could be John Wilkes Booth:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-whine-treated-worse-abraham-lincoln-assassinated
What a shit show nightmare.
First, disinfect the Lincoln Monument. It hasn’t been so misused in all its history by viral vermin.
Then, tear down the monument and the Statue of Liberty.
Allow one last viewing and entry before the destruction for real Americans, but keep conservatives and republicans at savage gunpoint from participating and further shitting on us.
The monuments are disgraced, ruined by the subhuman anti-American conservative movement.
Give me a fucking break, or give me Death!
Fuck off conservatives. You will be punished.
Yeah, it could be worse, or better:
I could be John Wilkes Booth:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-whine-treated-worse-abraham-lincoln-assassinated
What a shit show nightmare.
First, disinfect the Lincoln Monument. It hasn’t been so misused in all its history by viral vermin.
Then, tear down the monument and the Statue of Liberty.
Allow one last viewing and entry before the destruction for real Americans, but keep conservatives and republicans at savage gunpoint from participating and further shitting on us.
The monuments are disgraced, ruined by the subhuman anti-American conservative movement.
Give me a fucking break, or give me Death!
Fuck off conservatives. You will be punished.
Masks are for pussies, it’s just the flu, it’s the calm before the cytokine storm of full-scale insurrection:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/lining-up-to-be-a-hot-lunch-2/
There will be World War III nuclear war with China within three years if we don’t stop the conservative vermin in the White House and the Chinese people do not stop the conservative vermin in Peking.
I will elaborate on that later this week.
We are about to engage in the greatest blind diplomatic stupidity, and we are doing it without a credible diplomatic corps, instead being led by Rapture-craving, Death-loving murderous fake Christians in thrall to a sadistic lout, since Archduke Franz Ferdinand was assassinated.
The worldwide conservative nationalist confederacy is rushing toward the destruction of the human race.
A good start to firing a shot across their bow would be for the Brazilian people to rise up and kill Bolsonaro and his murderers in Brazil as an example, an out-of-town rehearsal, of what vengeful chaos is coming to the rest of them.
Biden in a coma, brain dead, with multiple indictments against him for sexual assault and a ham sandwich moldering greenishly on his untouched lunch tray is in that vegetative state better government than what we have now, or rather haven’t.
It IS a binary choice.
Masks are for pussies, it’s just the flu, it’s the calm before the cytokine storm of full-scale insurrection:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/lining-up-to-be-a-hot-lunch-2/
There will be World War III nuclear war with China within three years if we don’t stop the conservative vermin in the White House and the Chinese people do not stop the conservative vermin in Peking.
I will elaborate on that later this week.
We are about to engage in the greatest blind diplomatic stupidity, and we are doing it without a credible diplomatic corps, instead being led by Rapture-craving, Death-loving murderous fake Christians in thrall to a sadistic lout, since Archduke Franz Ferdinand was assassinated.
The worldwide conservative nationalist confederacy is rushing toward the destruction of the human race.
A good start to firing a shot across their bow would be for the Brazilian people to rise up and kill Bolsonaro and his murderers in Brazil as an example, an out-of-town rehearsal, of what vengeful chaos is coming to the rest of them.
Biden in a coma, brain dead, with multiple indictments against him for sexual assault and a ham sandwich moldering greenishly on his untouched lunch tray is in that vegetative state better government than what we have now, or rather haven’t.
It IS a binary choice.
We are about to engage in the greatest blind diplomatic stupidity, and we are doing it without a credible diplomatic corps,
On the contrary, we have a pretty good diplomatic corps. They’re being ignored by the morons making our foreign policy currently, but they (mostly) haven’t gone away. For which the next President will, I expect, be profoundly grateful.
We are about to engage in the greatest blind diplomatic stupidity, and we are doing it without a credible diplomatic corps,
On the contrary, we have a pretty good diplomatic corps. They’re being ignored by the morons making our foreign policy currently, but they (mostly) haven’t gone away. For which the next President will, I expect, be profoundly grateful.
Give me a fucking break, or give me Death!
LOL
A rallying cry for the times we find ourselves in.
Give me a fucking break, or give me Death!
LOL
A rallying cry for the times we find ourselves in.
The future is a country which features socio-demographic metrics like “excessive death” and “deaths of despair”.
Oh wait, that’s now.
The future is a country which features socio-demographic metrics like “excessive death” and “deaths of despair”.
Oh wait, that’s now.
One other change: our view of what constitutes an “essential job” will change. In places like Florida, for example, giving tatoos will be “essential.”
And we have this:
Good to know what small businesses are important.
One other change: our view of what constitutes an “essential job” will change. In places like Florida, for example, giving tatoos will be “essential.”
And we have this:
Good to know what small businesses are important.
Give me a fucking break, or give me Death!
LOL
This made me laugh too.
On the contrary, we have a pretty good diplomatic corps.
Alas, wj, friends in the know (non-lefties, at that) tell me that your foreign service has been so hollowed out of senior and even to some extent mid-level expertise, that it will take two or three generations (and I quote) to repair the damage, even assuming the right conditions, i.e. the election of a non-moron whose appointees understand what a diplomatic corps is actually for.
Give me a fucking break, or give me Death!
LOL
This made me laugh too.
On the contrary, we have a pretty good diplomatic corps.
Alas, wj, friends in the know (non-lefties, at that) tell me that your foreign service has been so hollowed out of senior and even to some extent mid-level expertise, that it will take two or three generations (and I quote) to repair the damage, even assuming the right conditions, i.e. the election of a non-moron whose appointees understand what a diplomatic corps is actually for.
FREEDOM!
Read it and weep.
FREEDOM!
Read it and weep.
It’s more ‘give me what I want or I might shoot you’.
A City in Oklahoma Ends Face Mask Requirement After Store Employees Were Threatened
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/05/stillwater-oklahoma-ends-face-mask-requirement-threats.html
It’s more ‘give me what I want or I might shoot you’.
A City in Oklahoma Ends Face Mask Requirement After Store Employees Were Threatened
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/05/stillwater-oklahoma-ends-face-mask-requirement-threats.html
Scratch the ‘might’.
https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/495909-michigan-police-probing-reports-that-store-shooting-stemmed
Scratch the ‘might’.
https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/495909-michigan-police-probing-reports-that-store-shooting-stemmed
From bobbyp’s link, echoing what I said the other day:
I think the tone and volume of the protests against restrictions in Maine are almost surely worse because the governor is a woman.
From bobbyp’s link, echoing what I said the other day:
I think the tone and volume of the protests against restrictions in Maine are almost surely worse because the governor is a woman.
I can’t help but think about what kind of world I brought my children into. It’s hard to know where this is all going. We may be looking at the worst crisis since the Great Depression, and we have the worst president possibly in the history of the nation.
I can’t help but think about what kind of world I brought my children into. It’s hard to know where this is all going. We may be looking at the worst crisis since the Great Depression, and we have the worst president possibly in the history of the nation.
I just finished reading “Dying of Whiteness”, and it doesn’t quite “feature patients literally dying of preventable diseases telling the author they would rather die than have Obamacare.”
It’s worse than that, and Metzl is a very gentle interlocutor.
It features patients literally on public assistance of one kind or many kinds or another, including Medicare and in some instances Medicaid, trailing oxygen canisters and IV drips, dying of preventable (though some prevention is going thanks to commie pinko fucking me) diseases telling the authors all sorts of dumb fucking shit.
Guns, suicide, no health insurance, opioids, and the No Mask of the White Death, Covid-19, given time, will do their demographic damage to the Republican Party.
Why, if the victims, who deserve our utmost empathy and our government handouts, were of any other race than proud white, we’d be calling it a cultural and racial pathology, but there is no political correctness like the kid gloves these folks are handled with.
They have elegies written about their victim hood.
They are Rosa Parks on a pogo stick wielding six guns.
Hillary would have been President for a shorter time than William Henry Harrison. If her terminal snivels and syphilis during the campaign didn’t get her, a republican bullet surely would have in short order.
I just finished reading “Dying of Whiteness”, and it doesn’t quite “feature patients literally dying of preventable diseases telling the author they would rather die than have Obamacare.”
It’s worse than that, and Metzl is a very gentle interlocutor.
It features patients literally on public assistance of one kind or many kinds or another, including Medicare and in some instances Medicaid, trailing oxygen canisters and IV drips, dying of preventable (though some prevention is going thanks to commie pinko fucking me) diseases telling the authors all sorts of dumb fucking shit.
Guns, suicide, no health insurance, opioids, and the No Mask of the White Death, Covid-19, given time, will do their demographic damage to the Republican Party.
Why, if the victims, who deserve our utmost empathy and our government handouts, were of any other race than proud white, we’d be calling it a cultural and racial pathology, but there is no political correctness like the kid gloves these folks are handled with.
They have elegies written about their victim hood.
They are Rosa Parks on a pogo stick wielding six guns.
Hillary would have been President for a shorter time than William Henry Harrison. If her terminal snivels and syphilis during the campaign didn’t get her, a republican bullet surely would have in short order.
Alas, wj, friends in the know (non-lefties, at that) tell me that your foreign service has been so hollowed out of senior and even to some extent mid-level expertise, that it will take two or three generations (and I quote) to repair the damage, even assuming the right conditions, i.e. the election of a non-moron whose appointees understand what a diplomatic corps is actually for.
Following up on this – I have multiple contacts with some connection to State and the other big FP departments. They all report that senior staff have left and that junior staff are not becoming senior staff because there is no one who can give them performance evaluations. The junior staff are working short-handed, have not been given any raises or promotions, and are not getting any guidance from farther up the chain.
And these are not just people working in small countries, either.
Our FP is structurally and functionally in ruins.
Alas, wj, friends in the know (non-lefties, at that) tell me that your foreign service has been so hollowed out of senior and even to some extent mid-level expertise, that it will take two or three generations (and I quote) to repair the damage, even assuming the right conditions, i.e. the election of a non-moron whose appointees understand what a diplomatic corps is actually for.
Following up on this – I have multiple contacts with some connection to State and the other big FP departments. They all report that senior staff have left and that junior staff are not becoming senior staff because there is no one who can give them performance evaluations. The junior staff are working short-handed, have not been given any raises or promotions, and are not getting any guidance from farther up the chain.
And these are not just people working in small countries, either.
Our FP is structurally and functionally in ruins.
GftNC and nous, thank you for the education. My usual optimism had led me to underestimate (easy to do, unfortunately) just how much damahe Trump and his boys have done there.
GftNC and nous, thank you for the education. My usual optimism had led me to underestimate (easy to do, unfortunately) just how much damahe Trump and his boys have done there.
The anti-Nostrodamus of our evil benighted times actually formed these words with the soft tissue inside his full of shit republican gob:
“Well, I don’t want to get too far ahead of the story, Jake,” Kudlow said.”
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/the-white-house-signals-a-pause-on-coronavirus-aid-even-as-the-economic-situation-becomes-more-urgent/ar-BB13y5IR
Forget it, Jake.
It’s Chinatown.
The anti-Nostrodamus of our evil benighted times actually formed these words with the soft tissue inside his full of shit republican gob:
“Well, I don’t want to get too far ahead of the story, Jake,” Kudlow said.”
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/the-white-house-signals-a-pause-on-coronavirus-aid-even-as-the-economic-situation-becomes-more-urgent/ar-BB13y5IR
Forget it, Jake.
It’s Chinatown.
Kevin Drum’s hands are shaking.
That happens when you have a cancer damaged immune system and conservative republicans are gleefully and sadistically trying to murder you.
https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2020/05/cdc-projects-half-a-million-deaths-from-covid-19/
Kevin Drum’s hands are shaking.
That happens when you have a cancer damaged immune system and conservative republicans are gleefully and sadistically trying to murder you.
https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2020/05/cdc-projects-half-a-million-deaths-from-covid-19/
Someone should OUTLAW the wearing of facemasks in gun stores.
And mandate that customers lick each others eyeballs, also, too.
For FREEDUM! of course.
Someone should OUTLAW the wearing of facemasks in gun stores.
And mandate that customers lick each others eyeballs, also, too.
For FREEDUM! of course.
Third Russian Doctor Falls From Hospital Window After Coronavirus Complaint
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2020/05/04/third-russian-doctor-falls-from-hospital-window-after-coronavirus-complaint-a70176
Third Russian Doctor Falls From Hospital Window After Coronavirus Complaint
https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2020/05/04/third-russian-doctor-falls-from-hospital-window-after-coronavirus-complaint-a70176
What about outlawing carrying guns in face mask stores?
Oh, we don’t have any of those latter beasts, priorities in the supply chains being what they fucking are.
Fauci and his colleagues should remain on the first floor of the White House and the NIH and the CDC and stay away from the windows and elevator shafts, accidental deaths being what they fucking are in our increasingly fascist conservative Russian and American world.
What about outlawing carrying guns in face mask stores?
Oh, we don’t have any of those latter beasts, priorities in the supply chains being what they fucking are.
Fauci and his colleagues should remain on the first floor of the White House and the NIH and the CDC and stay away from the windows and elevator shafts, accidental deaths being what they fucking are in our increasingly fascist conservative Russian and American world.
A song for America today.
Makes me want to cry.
A song for America today.
Makes me want to cry.
The present is a foreign country. Of course, the victim trying to uphold the law was a nigger:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/they-will-not-wear-a-mask/
Aimee Mann has a song for that too:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HrtMemDVp-k
No wisdom, no saving, only vengeance.
We can’t get tested, we can’t find toilet paper, we can’t find hand wipes, but the White House just found and ordered 100,000 body bags.
Put THEM in those bags.
Fuck you, conservatives.
The present is a foreign country. Of course, the victim trying to uphold the law was a nigger:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/they-will-not-wear-a-mask/
Aimee Mann has a song for that too:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HrtMemDVp-k
No wisdom, no saving, only vengeance.
We can’t get tested, we can’t find toilet paper, we can’t find hand wipes, but the White House just found and ordered 100,000 body bags.
Put THEM in those bags.
Fuck you, conservatives.
Mike DeWine of Ohio is one of those typical conservative republicans who learn their child is gay and has AIDS and decides to come in from the conservative a hard rain is gonna fall, as the bootstraps turn out to be a physically impossible bullshit platitude.
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/dewine-acton-ohio-covid-antisemitic-attacks
I was born in Ohio, as were both of my parents.
It has always been a hotbed of racism and antisemitism.
Where do you think I got my rabbit ears?
No doubt DeWine’s conservative republican political career profited and capitalized from those dark right wing fuckings for decades, but now he’s up against it and shows signs of being human.
Hooray for performance art. Not Olivier, but I don’t know ….. Bill Bixby?
We’ll take it, but you can blow out the candles without me.
Mike DeWine of Ohio is one of those typical conservative republicans who learn their child is gay and has AIDS and decides to come in from the conservative a hard rain is gonna fall, as the bootstraps turn out to be a physically impossible bullshit platitude.
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/dewine-acton-ohio-covid-antisemitic-attacks
I was born in Ohio, as were both of my parents.
It has always been a hotbed of racism and antisemitism.
Where do you think I got my rabbit ears?
No doubt DeWine’s conservative republican political career profited and capitalized from those dark right wing fuckings for decades, but now he’s up against it and shows signs of being human.
Hooray for performance art. Not Olivier, but I don’t know ….. Bill Bixby?
We’ll take it, but you can blow out the candles without me.
Mike DeWine of Ohio is one of those typical conservative republicans who learn their child is gay and has AIDS and decides to come in from the conservative a hard rain is gonna fall, as the bootstraps turn out to be a physically impossible bullshit platitude.
I got no problem with that. FWIW, my impression is that DeWine has been pretty much on the ball through the whole COVID thing. In any case, whether soon or late, well done Governor De Wine.
In other Ohio-related news, today is the 50th anniversary of the Kent State shootings. My wife grew up in northeast OH – Akron and Stow – and was an undergrad at Kent on the famous day. One of the young women killed was an acquaintance of hers.
For whatever reason, we can’t seem to figure anything out without somebody getting shot, or dying unnecessarily from illness, or whatever. Somebody’s gotta die before we wise the fuck up.
I suspect that, in the foreign country of the future, it’ll probably be no different.
A truly American tune. Or maybe just human.
What i think is that we’re gonna drain this whole dumb-ass “you’re not the boss of me” America First clown show to the very dregs before we wise the fuck up.
And then I don’t know what the future looks like.
Mike DeWine of Ohio is one of those typical conservative republicans who learn their child is gay and has AIDS and decides to come in from the conservative a hard rain is gonna fall, as the bootstraps turn out to be a physically impossible bullshit platitude.
I got no problem with that. FWIW, my impression is that DeWine has been pretty much on the ball through the whole COVID thing. In any case, whether soon or late, well done Governor De Wine.
In other Ohio-related news, today is the 50th anniversary of the Kent State shootings. My wife grew up in northeast OH – Akron and Stow – and was an undergrad at Kent on the famous day. One of the young women killed was an acquaintance of hers.
For whatever reason, we can’t seem to figure anything out without somebody getting shot, or dying unnecessarily from illness, or whatever. Somebody’s gotta die before we wise the fuck up.
I suspect that, in the foreign country of the future, it’ll probably be no different.
A truly American tune. Or maybe just human.
What i think is that we’re gonna drain this whole dumb-ass “you’re not the boss of me” America First clown show to the very dregs before we wise the fuck up.
And then I don’t know what the future looks like.
Tonight I’m thinking of the familly of Calvin Munerlyn, security guard at a Dollar Store in Flint MI, who was shot dead because he asked the wife of some gun-happy patriot to put a mask on while she shopped.
It’s not going to stop
Until we wise up
There is no reason for any of us to believe that, in the foreign country of the future, any more of us will have wised up than have done so by now.
Tonight I’m thinking of the familly of Calvin Munerlyn, security guard at a Dollar Store in Flint MI, who was shot dead because he asked the wife of some gun-happy patriot to put a mask on while she shopped.
It’s not going to stop
Until we wise up
There is no reason for any of us to believe that, in the foreign country of the future, any more of us will have wised up than have done so by now.
Thanks for the reminder of Kent State, russell. My sister taught there in later years, and I’ve been with her to the parking lot with the markers noting where the students who were killed that day fell. Can’t walk past without crying, not just for them but for the stupidity of it all.
COVID-19 #’s have been updated through today in the other thread.
Thanks for the reminder of Kent State, russell. My sister taught there in later years, and I’ve been with her to the parking lot with the markers noting where the students who were killed that day fell. Can’t walk past without crying, not just for them but for the stupidity of it all.
COVID-19 #’s have been updated through today in the other thread.
Strange…
Strange…
I’m going to be interested to see if the big conferences, conventions, trade shows make a comeback. I used to get sent to the National Association of Broadcasters (NAB), the second biggest trade show in Vegas. For a tremendous number of the smaller equipment companies, those four days are make-or-break for their business for the year: they took orders for as much as 75% of their annual dollar volume. I also got sent to a lot of odd little technical conferences. The sessions were all well and good, but the most valuable part was the chance to catch one of the speakers at the bar where you could take turns scribbling on a piece of paper and putting odd ideas together.
God only knows what new PhDs in the social sciences will do if the ASSA meeting in January disappears.
I’m going to be interested to see if the big conferences, conventions, trade shows make a comeback. I used to get sent to the National Association of Broadcasters (NAB), the second biggest trade show in Vegas. For a tremendous number of the smaller equipment companies, those four days are make-or-break for their business for the year: they took orders for as much as 75% of their annual dollar volume. I also got sent to a lot of odd little technical conferences. The sessions were all well and good, but the most valuable part was the chance to catch one of the speakers at the bar where you could take turns scribbling on a piece of paper and putting odd ideas together.
God only knows what new PhDs in the social sciences will do if the ASSA meeting in January disappears.
THanks Charles, I just wrote to them.
THanks Charles, I just wrote to them.
Michael, I’m wondering about similar things here in Japan. My Japanese is pretty much in person Japanese. Over the phone, it’s a lot worse, written without context, it might was well be baby talk. (there are a lot of things involved in that, not all of them on me btw)
So I’m trying to do all the things that I normally do at my university thru phone or email or god help me LINE. It’s also hampered because I’m pointing out things that they often don’t see and so assume that I as a foreigner, am just misunderstanding something. The new first years came in and we got two lists of names in chinese characters with the Japanese hiragana gloss, one for each ‘kumi’ which is half of the cohort, divided to provide some ease in scheduling and other things. Thru a mistake of cut and paste, one of the students on the first list had the same last name as a student on the other list and was exactly the same number in the list, but they had copied the first name of the other student (who was the opposite sex) into the first students name. I pointed this out and got told that yes, those were the first names, and I said no, they aren’t right. Finally, after 15 minutes on the phone, I had to take a picture with my camera of the list, circle the offending name and send it to the office. It gets to a point of ‘why don’t you believe me when I tell you something’
But that rant aside, despite the image of a hi tech wonderland that Japan likes to sell, beyond toliet seats, it isn’t really. Everything really gets done on personal connections and so called ‘nemawashi’ or root building. So not having face time not only makes things painfully slow, it really disadvantages people who are not completely within the system.
Early in all this, there was a story of a chinese phd student who died. He or she had tried to call 911 several times, but they couldn’t understand the person and they were discovered dead. That’s a dramatic example, but think of all the day to day interactions that are supposed to seamlessly be transferred to phone or computer and think about the people who are being left out. Depressing.
Michael, I’m wondering about similar things here in Japan. My Japanese is pretty much in person Japanese. Over the phone, it’s a lot worse, written without context, it might was well be baby talk. (there are a lot of things involved in that, not all of them on me btw)
So I’m trying to do all the things that I normally do at my university thru phone or email or god help me LINE. It’s also hampered because I’m pointing out things that they often don’t see and so assume that I as a foreigner, am just misunderstanding something. The new first years came in and we got two lists of names in chinese characters with the Japanese hiragana gloss, one for each ‘kumi’ which is half of the cohort, divided to provide some ease in scheduling and other things. Thru a mistake of cut and paste, one of the students on the first list had the same last name as a student on the other list and was exactly the same number in the list, but they had copied the first name of the other student (who was the opposite sex) into the first students name. I pointed this out and got told that yes, those were the first names, and I said no, they aren’t right. Finally, after 15 minutes on the phone, I had to take a picture with my camera of the list, circle the offending name and send it to the office. It gets to a point of ‘why don’t you believe me when I tell you something’
But that rant aside, despite the image of a hi tech wonderland that Japan likes to sell, beyond toliet seats, it isn’t really. Everything really gets done on personal connections and so called ‘nemawashi’ or root building. So not having face time not only makes things painfully slow, it really disadvantages people who are not completely within the system.
Early in all this, there was a story of a chinese phd student who died. He or she had tried to call 911 several times, but they couldn’t understand the person and they were discovered dead. That’s a dramatic example, but think of all the day to day interactions that are supposed to seamlessly be transferred to phone or computer and think about the people who are being left out. Depressing.
Any bets on when or how we get back to something recognizably “normal” are now inoperative: a leaked presentation by the CDC predicts the curve to go skyhigh in the next couple months.
200,000 more cases and 3,000 more deaths PER DAY.
Why?
Because we f*cking well “re-opened” too soon.
Any bets on when or how we get back to something recognizably “normal” are now inoperative: a leaked presentation by the CDC predicts the curve to go skyhigh in the next couple months.
200,000 more cases and 3,000 more deaths PER DAY.
Why?
Because we f*cking well “re-opened” too soon.
lj and CharlesWT — wow, at first I thought only a couple of ObWi posts were listed on that Yglesias page. But there are lots of them! Including at least one of mine. I’ve written to them to. WTF?
Thanks, Charles.
lj and CharlesWT — wow, at first I thought only a couple of ObWi posts were listed on that Yglesias page. But there are lots of them! Including at least one of mine. I’ve written to them to. WTF?
Thanks, Charles.
I might write Matt (whom I don’t know). Linkedin or Twitter? Any suggestions from you up to date types?
I might write Matt (whom I don’t know). Linkedin or Twitter? Any suggestions from you up to date types?
To return to the OT, in the (post-Trump) future the US will again be an important factor in the world. Because we’re big enough that all we really need to do is show up. But never again will we be the go-to player, whenever something big happens. Because once everybody loses the habit….
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/the-world-comes-together-for-a-virtual-vaccine-summit-the-us-is-conspicuously-absent/2020/05/04/ac5b6754-8a5c-11ea-80df-d24b35a568ae_story.html
To return to the OT, in the (post-Trump) future the US will again be an important factor in the world. Because we’re big enough that all we really need to do is show up. But never again will we be the go-to player, whenever something big happens. Because once everybody loses the habit….
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/the-world-comes-together-for-a-virtual-vaccine-summit-the-us-is-conspicuously-absent/2020/05/04/ac5b6754-8a5c-11ea-80df-d24b35a568ae_story.html
If I try to channel optimism… If the rest of the world picks up all the balls that the US is currently dropping, and if the US can live with not being BMoC, we might be able to scale back our militarist jonez to a sustainable level and free up some budget space for taking care of our domestic problems.
Won’t happen, I know, but that’s what my optimistic fantasy would look like.
If I try to channel optimism… If the rest of the world picks up all the balls that the US is currently dropping, and if the US can live with not being BMoC, we might be able to scale back our militarist jonez to a sustainable level and free up some budget space for taking care of our domestic problems.
Won’t happen, I know, but that’s what my optimistic fantasy would look like.
Strange…
Uh oh, time to mind my manners – we got company.
😉
Strange…
Uh oh, time to mind my manners – we got company.
😉
In the foreign country that is the future, we may see more things like this and this.
Which might not be a bad thing.
In the foreign country that is the future, we may see more things like this and this.
Which might not be a bad thing.
Those two stories, russell, have me thinking that the future of the US may look something like the Hanseatic League, filtered through a layer of dysfunctional federalism.
Those two stories, russell, have me thinking that the future of the US may look something like the Hanseatic League, filtered through a layer of dysfunctional federalism.
Long ago, in the different country that was the past, one of my friends went on a lament, while we watched a kids’ baseball game, that included this question: “When did we stop being ‘citizens’ and start being ‘consumers’?”
I was reminded of that plaintive cry when I finally had to walk away from the incessant drumbeat of headlines and rants about “reopening the economy.”
With Tony P. in mind, I observe that at least the transformation from citizens to consumers still framed us as individuals. Now we’re not even that. Now we’ve been subsumed into a nebulous collective metaphor that stands in for the generation of wealth and profit, which we are here to serve, and which matters more than any number of deaths you could count.
The framing of the “reopening” in public discourse makes it seem like there’s some rational relationship between it and the course of the epidemic beyond a toddler-like impatience with sticking with something hard, and helping everyone through it from our unimaginably large store of collective wealth.
There is no such rational relationship. We are going to have a bloodbath.
From Wendell Berry’s poem “The Mad Farmer Liberation Front,” which I’m sure I’ve quoted here many times:
When they want you to buy something
they will call you. When they want you
to die for profit they will let you know.
So, friends, every day do something
that won’t compute….
I used to think his phrase “die for profit” was a metaphor. Stupid me.
Long ago, in the different country that was the past, one of my friends went on a lament, while we watched a kids’ baseball game, that included this question: “When did we stop being ‘citizens’ and start being ‘consumers’?”
I was reminded of that plaintive cry when I finally had to walk away from the incessant drumbeat of headlines and rants about “reopening the economy.”
With Tony P. in mind, I observe that at least the transformation from citizens to consumers still framed us as individuals. Now we’re not even that. Now we’ve been subsumed into a nebulous collective metaphor that stands in for the generation of wealth and profit, which we are here to serve, and which matters more than any number of deaths you could count.
The framing of the “reopening” in public discourse makes it seem like there’s some rational relationship between it and the course of the epidemic beyond a toddler-like impatience with sticking with something hard, and helping everyone through it from our unimaginably large store of collective wealth.
There is no such rational relationship. We are going to have a bloodbath.
From Wendell Berry’s poem “The Mad Farmer Liberation Front,” which I’m sure I’ve quoted here many times:
When they want you to buy something
they will call you. When they want you
to die for profit they will let you know.
So, friends, every day do something
that won’t compute….
I used to think his phrase “die for profit” was a metaphor. Stupid me.
I don’t read the NYT much, but…just in case it seems like I’m overreacting. At least I’m not alone, fat consolation that is.
I don’t read the NYT much, but…just in case it seems like I’m overreacting. At least I’m not alone, fat consolation that is.
citizen—>consumer—>commodity
citizen—>consumer—>commodity
Re russell’s examples and nous’s comment… I have long said the US needs something official bigger than a state and smaller than the national government. Binding interstate compacts are legally possible on a limited range of topics, but are hard to get approved. Examples where regional control might be more appropriate include management of the electric grid, fire policy (both before and after fires occur) in the vast currently-national forests, flooding in various river basins that span states.
Re russell’s examples and nous’s comment… I have long said the US needs something official bigger than a state and smaller than the national government. Binding interstate compacts are legally possible on a limited range of topics, but are hard to get approved. Examples where regional control might be more appropriate include management of the electric grid, fire policy (both before and after fires occur) in the vast currently-national forests, flooding in various river basins that span states.
hsh — good, pithy summary.
hsh — good, pithy summary.
Aaand in other news:
NYT Coronavirus Live Updates: As Threat of Virus Persists, Trump Administration Signals It Will Wind Down Task Force
and
REPORTER: Why won’t you let Fauci testify before the House?
TRUMP: “Because the House is a set up. The House is a bunch of Trump haters … they, frankly, want our situation to be unsuccessful, which means death.”
The proof that this is not a spoof:
https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1257682123353460736
Aaand in other news:
NYT Coronavirus Live Updates: As Threat of Virus Persists, Trump Administration Signals It Will Wind Down Task Force
and
REPORTER: Why won’t you let Fauci testify before the House?
TRUMP: “Because the House is a set up. The House is a bunch of Trump haters … they, frankly, want our situation to be unsuccessful, which means death.”
The proof that this is not a spoof:
https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1257682123353460736
well sure, but China.
well sure, but China.
The proof that this is not a spoof
Self-parody is one of the Trump administration’s core competencies.
But even before Trump said it explicitly, it was obvious from the fact that they were fine with Fauci testifying before the (Republican-run) Senate. It was just the House that he had no time for.
The proof that this is not a spoof
Self-parody is one of the Trump administration’s core competencies.
But even before Trump said it explicitly, it was obvious from the fact that they were fine with Fauci testifying before the (Republican-run) Senate. It was just the House that he had no time for.
Yes, wj, I realised that. But listen to what he’s actually prepared to say out loud
Yes, wj, I realised that. But listen to what he’s actually prepared to say out loud
He’s had a lifetime of not being held accountable. (Or responsible.) As a result of which, he doesn’t feel the need (and has never acquired the habit) of self-censoring his words. The rest of us have learned that it is best not to say some things out loud. He hasn’t.
He’s had a lifetime of not being held accountable. (Or responsible.) As a result of which, he doesn’t feel the need (and has never acquired the habit) of self-censoring his words. The rest of us have learned that it is best not to say some things out loud. He hasn’t.
Some other comments on the future, specifically the future of business in America:
https://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/202x/2020/04/29/Leaving-Amazon
The issues regarding warehouse workers at Amazon (and everybody else with warehouses; Amazon’s certainly not unique) have been around for quite a while. But the current situation is bringing them into stark relief.
Which, I think, is going to be true more broadly: even in parts of our lives which are not directly seeing much impact, we are going to be looking at what is there really. Rather than just being comfortable with “how things are” as a matter of habit.
For instance, how will the legal profession change, now that anyone anywhere in the country can log on and listen to Supreme Court oral arguments? And the attorneys don’t have to be in Washington for that either. Suddenly, being close to DC isn’t the huge deal it has been. (I note also that, instead of just interrupting, the justices waited to get called on before speaking. And that Justice Thomas actually asked several questions, which doesn’t hardly ever happen.)
Some other comments on the future, specifically the future of business in America:
https://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/202x/2020/04/29/Leaving-Amazon
The issues regarding warehouse workers at Amazon (and everybody else with warehouses; Amazon’s certainly not unique) have been around for quite a while. But the current situation is bringing them into stark relief.
Which, I think, is going to be true more broadly: even in parts of our lives which are not directly seeing much impact, we are going to be looking at what is there really. Rather than just being comfortable with “how things are” as a matter of habit.
For instance, how will the legal profession change, now that anyone anywhere in the country can log on and listen to Supreme Court oral arguments? And the attorneys don’t have to be in Washington for that either. Suddenly, being close to DC isn’t the huge deal it has been. (I note also that, instead of just interrupting, the justices waited to get called on before speaking. And that Justice Thomas actually asked several questions, which doesn’t hardly ever happen.)
Graphs updated to today. It’s depressing.
There seems to be a rhythm to this experience, discoverable only as we go along. Settling in for the long haul requires a different sort of determination than the early weeks did, I find.
Graphs updated to today. It’s depressing.
There seems to be a rhythm to this experience, discoverable only as we go along. Settling in for the long haul requires a different sort of determination than the early weeks did, I find.
“This too shall pass” is a a very imprecise proposition. I had a mindset of “This isn’t the end of the world” that has become more and more dependent on how to define the end of the world. I still have hope that a breakthrough in a treatment or vaccine will put an end to this to a large degree, with so many of humanity’s brightest minds focused so intensely on it, but it’s certainly not just going away. And I’m more doubtful about how soon it gets tamped down before things start falling apart in a significant way.
The short version: I’m getting more and more worried about how bad things will eventually get.
“This too shall pass” is a a very imprecise proposition. I had a mindset of “This isn’t the end of the world” that has become more and more dependent on how to define the end of the world. I still have hope that a breakthrough in a treatment or vaccine will put an end to this to a large degree, with so many of humanity’s brightest minds focused so intensely on it, but it’s certainly not just going away. And I’m more doubtful about how soon it gets tamped down before things start falling apart in a significant way.
The short version: I’m getting more and more worried about how bad things will eventually get.
Graphs updated to today. It’s depressing.
Tuesday’s a bitch.
Graphs updated to today. It’s depressing.
Tuesday’s a bitch.
Some may think this is an overreaction, but as the Buchanan joke goes, all this sounds a lot more natural if you hear it in the original German…
Don’t know if any one wants to work on their German, but fortunately Natascha Strobl put this up in English.
https://twitter.com/Natascha_Strobl/status/1247606764914302979
via LGM
Some may think this is an overreaction, but as the Buchanan joke goes, all this sounds a lot more natural if you hear it in the original German…
Don’t know if any one wants to work on their German, but fortunately Natascha Strobl put this up in English.
https://twitter.com/Natascha_Strobl/status/1247606764914302979
via LGM
can we declare the GOP an enemy of the people yet?
can we declare the GOP an enemy of the people yet?
can we declare the GOP an enemy of the people yet?
Hey, maybe they actually have gotten tired of winning — just like Trump said they would. And are pulling out all the stops to get some respite.
Becausem let’s face it, you’ve gotta be trying hard to lose (and probably suicidal) if you’re trash-talking the Packers in Wisconsin!
can we declare the GOP an enemy of the people yet?
Hey, maybe they actually have gotten tired of winning — just like Trump said they would. And are pulling out all the stops to get some respite.
Becausem let’s face it, you’ve gotta be trying hard to lose (and probably suicidal) if you’re trash-talking the Packers in Wisconsin!
can we declare the GOP an enemy of the people yet?
We (humans, primates, vertebrates, animals, eukaryotic organisms) have always been at war with viruses.
The GOP is now filled with species-traitors. Treat appropriately.
I hear that filling their lungs with chlorine bleach can be a very effective technique.
can we declare the GOP an enemy of the people yet?
We (humans, primates, vertebrates, animals, eukaryotic organisms) have always been at war with viruses.
The GOP is now filled with species-traitors. Treat appropriately.
I hear that filling their lungs with chlorine bleach can be a very effective technique.
The border county of Cavan now has the highest number of cases relative to its population, even though it is only the 25th largest county by population in Ireland.
If variations are random, one would expect outliers to be small counties.
The border county of Cavan now has the highest number of cases relative to its population, even though it is only the 25th largest county by population in Ireland.
If variations are random, one would expect outliers to be small counties.
I play bridge. It’s a game which can be played online: the game is different without the social contact, and the triggers for concentration are missing, but some other aspects work better than face-to-face.
Not surprisingly, online play has exploded. The platforms are struggling to cope with demand. People like me who’ve been reluctant to play online have accepted reality.
This is never going back. Bridge clubs have many elderly members, and the playing environment, involving shared equipment, is ideal for transmission of respiratory-tract infections. Even when we restart regular meetings some will stay at home for safety’s sake, and the remaining numbers may not be sufficient to cover overheads. Online sessions will continue as a major part of the club game.
I play bridge. It’s a game which can be played online: the game is different without the social contact, and the triggers for concentration are missing, but some other aspects work better than face-to-face.
Not surprisingly, online play has exploded. The platforms are struggling to cope with demand. People like me who’ve been reluctant to play online have accepted reality.
This is never going back. Bridge clubs have many elderly members, and the playing environment, involving shared equipment, is ideal for transmission of respiratory-tract infections. Even when we restart regular meetings some will stay at home for safety’s sake, and the remaining numbers may not be sufficient to cover overheads. Online sessions will continue as a major part of the club game.
we’ve started playing euchre on-line.
it’s better in person, though. it’s less fun to yell at your partner for not reading your mind correctly when you have to type it in.
we’ve started playing euchre on-line.
it’s better in person, though. it’s less fun to yell at your partner for not reading your mind correctly when you have to type it in.
We started playing a game called Codenames with friends before social distancing. It’s a fun game to play over some drinks. We started playing on line by having someone put a photo of the cards on google docs and editing it as they got covered after teams would make their guesses. That would be viewed on one device, with a group video chat on another. The clue-givers (or “spymasters” in game parlance) would have to be paired up in the same location, so couples would be on opposite teams and give clues at the same time.
We started using the on line version of the game recently, and it’s way easier logistically. Now two people in different locations can both be spymasters and don’t need to have a collocated partner, but couples in the same room do still have to be on opposite teams and give clues on the same rounds because they necessarily will both know whose cards are whose. But you have to trust the people who are playing alone because they could select the spymaster option and reveal which cards each team is trying to guess.
Anyway, if you’re looking for something to keep group video chats fun and lively, Codenames is a really good option. It has a good balance between being engaging and allowing for some interspersed casual chit chat. If you’re drinking, it’s funny to watch the debate and reasoning degrade as teams are trying to agree on which cards to guess.
We started playing a game called Codenames with friends before social distancing. It’s a fun game to play over some drinks. We started playing on line by having someone put a photo of the cards on google docs and editing it as they got covered after teams would make their guesses. That would be viewed on one device, with a group video chat on another. The clue-givers (or “spymasters” in game parlance) would have to be paired up in the same location, so couples would be on opposite teams and give clues at the same time.
We started using the on line version of the game recently, and it’s way easier logistically. Now two people in different locations can both be spymasters and don’t need to have a collocated partner, but couples in the same room do still have to be on opposite teams and give clues on the same rounds because they necessarily will both know whose cards are whose. But you have to trust the people who are playing alone because they could select the spymaster option and reveal which cards each team is trying to guess.
Anyway, if you’re looking for something to keep group video chats fun and lively, Codenames is a really good option. It has a good balance between being engaging and allowing for some interspersed casual chit chat. If you’re drinking, it’s funny to watch the debate and reasoning degrade as teams are trying to agree on which cards to guess.
I’ve recently become aware of the new wacko conspiracy theory “Plandemic.” I’m actually not sure if it’s just one conspiracy theory or if it’s a name being used for a number of loosely related conspiracy theories. I don’t want to click on any links to delve into the details, but from what’s readily available in previews, it’s really out there.
I don’t know how so many people – people I’ve been friends with for years – can believe such ridiculous crap. It’s really disheartening. I don’t want to think they’re stupid, but it’s hard not to. **does not compute**
I’ve recently become aware of the new wacko conspiracy theory “Plandemic.” I’m actually not sure if it’s just one conspiracy theory or if it’s a name being used for a number of loosely related conspiracy theories. I don’t want to click on any links to delve into the details, but from what’s readily available in previews, it’s really out there.
I don’t know how so many people – people I’ve been friends with for years – can believe such ridiculous crap. It’s really disheartening. I don’t want to think they’re stupid, but it’s hard not to. **does not compute**
I hadn’t seen any of that yet. Is it because I’m not on Facebook?
My head hurts.
I hadn’t seen any of that yet. Is it because I’m not on Facebook?
My head hurts.
Is it because I’m not on Facebook?
Well, you’d be more likely to have seen it if you were, but it’s circulating more generally. It seems the main “Plandemic” is a youtube video from Dr. Judy Mikovits, who has credentials but a very checkered past. It’s got something to do with a vast global conspiracy involving various elites trying to control us.
Why people will believe stuff like that over the simpler possibility that people like Dr. Mikovits are kooks, I don’t know.
Is it because I’m not on Facebook?
Well, you’d be more likely to have seen it if you were, but it’s circulating more generally. It seems the main “Plandemic” is a youtube video from Dr. Judy Mikovits, who has credentials but a very checkered past. It’s got something to do with a vast global conspiracy involving various elites trying to control us.
Why people will believe stuff like that over the simpler possibility that people like Dr. Mikovits are kooks, I don’t know.
holy crap.
Fauci has ‘killed millions since 1984’ !
i lasted through about two minute of “Plandemic: the movie”. the crap is far too dense to get through.
holy crap.
Fauci has ‘killed millions since 1984’ !
i lasted through about two minute of “Plandemic: the movie”. the crap is far too dense to get through.
Amusing commentary from (which I just found via google, so not a blanket endorsement of this source):
https://markmanson.net/newsletters/motherfcking-monday-29
Amusing commentary from (which I just found via google, so not a blanket endorsement of this source):
https://markmanson.net/newsletters/motherfcking-monday-29
the “Dr” who is the subject of the “Plandemic” movie is a lunatic anti-vaxxer, and she has a history (predating this pandemic) of being paranoid about Fauci.
good stuff.
the “Dr” who is the subject of the “Plandemic” movie is a lunatic anti-vaxxer, and she has a history (predating this pandemic) of being paranoid about Fauci.
good stuff.
a well-coordinated hoax by some shadowy international cabal looking to… I don’t know, make lots of money, or something.
Well, it seems to be being used to make lots of money for Trump supporters at least. See outfits like Blue Flame Medical — which is flagrant enough that even the Trump Justice Department has opened a criminal investigation.
a well-coordinated hoax by some shadowy international cabal looking to… I don’t know, make lots of money, or something.
Well, it seems to be being used to make lots of money for Trump supporters at least. See outfits like Blue Flame Medical — which is flagrant enough that even the Trump Justice Department has opened a criminal investigation.
The “plandemic” crowd seem to have a combination of apophenia, poor critical reading skills, poor media literacy, strong confirmation bias, strong out-group tribal identity, and a worldview with a non-falsifiable core belief system.
The “plandemic” crowd seem to have a combination of apophenia, poor critical reading skills, poor media literacy, strong confirmation bias, strong out-group tribal identity, and a worldview with a non-falsifiable core belief system.
apophenia
I knew a guy in Salem a while back, probably in the mid-80’s. He lived in a SRO joint around the corner from where I lived.
His name was August, and his rent was subsidized as Section 8 housing, and he had avoided military service under a Section 8 discharge. So, the number 8 loomed large in his thinking, as a kind of numerological tutelary being.
The ozone layer stuff was a thing then, and he mis-heard that as the “low zone” layer. So he imagined it as some ethereal area that occupied the space between heaven and earth, and thought that the holes in it were causing unwanted channels between our world and the heavenly one. He saved up the foil from cigarette packs and would draw diagrams illustrating this on the non-shiny side.
He ate a lot of apples, because that was the fruit in the garden of Eden. But he had somehow come to believe that it was necessary to eat the whole fruit, including the core and seeds, to get the full benefit.
August would save drinking straws and fold them into triangles, which he distributed around Salem wherever he went.
A friendly, harmless, robustly and vividly insane neighborhood character. I enjoyed hanging out with him. He could whistle louder than anybody I ever met.
Didn’t know there was a name for his particular genius for finding connections where none really exist. Sorry to see the degree to which it, in a less harmless form, has become mainstreamed.
August could probably host a TV show nowadays. Maybe even run for office.
apophenia
I knew a guy in Salem a while back, probably in the mid-80’s. He lived in a SRO joint around the corner from where I lived.
His name was August, and his rent was subsidized as Section 8 housing, and he had avoided military service under a Section 8 discharge. So, the number 8 loomed large in his thinking, as a kind of numerological tutelary being.
The ozone layer stuff was a thing then, and he mis-heard that as the “low zone” layer. So he imagined it as some ethereal area that occupied the space between heaven and earth, and thought that the holes in it were causing unwanted channels between our world and the heavenly one. He saved up the foil from cigarette packs and would draw diagrams illustrating this on the non-shiny side.
He ate a lot of apples, because that was the fruit in the garden of Eden. But he had somehow come to believe that it was necessary to eat the whole fruit, including the core and seeds, to get the full benefit.
August would save drinking straws and fold them into triangles, which he distributed around Salem wherever he went.
A friendly, harmless, robustly and vividly insane neighborhood character. I enjoyed hanging out with him. He could whistle louder than anybody I ever met.
Didn’t know there was a name for his particular genius for finding connections where none really exist. Sorry to see the degree to which it, in a less harmless form, has become mainstreamed.
August could probably host a TV show nowadays. Maybe even run for office.
He could whistle louder than anybody I ever met.
Funniest sentence of the day.
He could whistle louder than anybody I ever met.
Funniest sentence of the day.
The bit that cracked me up was “numerological tutelary being.”
The bit that cracked me up was “numerological tutelary being.”
He could whistle louder than anybody I ever met.
Funniest sentence of the day.
The bit that cracked me up was “numerological tutelary being.”
Both wonderful. Plandemic, eh? The things one learns on ObWi – it’s not just good for acronyms and IT slang. I’d never heard of it either, but then I too am a Facebook refusenik.
It’s got something to do with a vast global conspiracy involving various elites trying to control us.
Freemasons? Jews? Illuminati? Really, one is spoilt for choice with the various scapegoats at one’s disposal. And if one of them doesn’t work out, you move on to the next one (and people have been, all my life).
He could whistle louder than anybody I ever met.
Funniest sentence of the day.
The bit that cracked me up was “numerological tutelary being.”
Both wonderful. Plandemic, eh? The things one learns on ObWi – it’s not just good for acronyms and IT slang. I’d never heard of it either, but then I too am a Facebook refusenik.
It’s got something to do with a vast global conspiracy involving various elites trying to control us.
Freemasons? Jews? Illuminati? Really, one is spoilt for choice with the various scapegoats at one’s disposal. And if one of them doesn’t work out, you move on to the next one (and people have been, all my life).
An artistic take involving holes in the sky.
http://www.clarkashton.org/faithinindustry.htm
An artistic take involving holes in the sky.
http://www.clarkashton.org/faithinindustry.htm
Don’t forget Gresham’s Reverse Gas Law wherein it is confidently affirmed that since carbon is heavier than oxygen, global warming is a hoax…otherwise we would all be suffocating.
Don’t forget Gresham’s Reverse Gas Law wherein it is confidently affirmed that since carbon is heavier than oxygen, global warming is a hoax…otherwise we would all be suffocating.
Certainly, if you try inhaling carbon (presumably carbon dust), suffocating is the kindest way to put it. But then, if you are the owner of a coal mine, presumably you think it’s no problem if your miners inhale carbon dust — those OSHA regulations are just Federal overreach.
Certainly, if you try inhaling carbon (presumably carbon dust), suffocating is the kindest way to put it. But then, if you are the owner of a coal mine, presumably you think it’s no problem if your miners inhale carbon dust — those OSHA regulations are just Federal overreach.
This NYT opinion piece by Linda Hirshman headlined I Believe Tara Reade. I’m Voting for Joe Biden Anyway: the importance of owning an ugly moral choice. seems pretty close to what my view would be, if I had a vote in the US. Interesting on the Lewinsky/Clinton issue too, I thought.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/06/opinion/tara-reade-joe-biden-vote.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage
This NYT opinion piece by Linda Hirshman headlined I Believe Tara Reade. I’m Voting for Joe Biden Anyway: the importance of owning an ugly moral choice. seems pretty close to what my view would be, if I had a vote in the US. Interesting on the Lewinsky/Clinton issue too, I thought.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/06/opinion/tara-reade-joe-biden-vote.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage
Funniest sentence of the day.
He was very proud of his whistling prowess, and would demonstrate it at the drop of a hat, any place and any time.
It was startling.
An artistic take involving holes in the sky.
That guy seems like a kinder gentler version of these maniacs.
Funniest sentence of the day.
He was very proud of his whistling prowess, and would demonstrate it at the drop of a hat, any place and any time.
It was startling.
An artistic take involving holes in the sky.
That guy seems like a kinder gentler version of these maniacs.
GftNC,
Yes. I read that essay also. Cause for pause as they say.
GftNC,
Yes. I read that essay also. Cause for pause as they say.
Interesting on the Lewinsky/Clinton issue too, I thought.
I agree with Hirshman that even if you believe Tara Reade, you should vote for Biden anyway. However, I think Reade is an unreliable witness, and that matters. It’s not victim-blaming to question a person who is not trustworthy. I know that’s problematic in sexual abuse cases, but I still feel that way, so whatever.
That said, I still agree with Gloria Steinem’s article, which did not throw Lewinsky under the bus. Maybe we’ve now “graduated” to a place where young women have to be treated as children because of “power dynamics”, but certainly in the ’90’s, adult women who thought they were consenting to (in fact initiating) a sexual relationship were actually believed to have had the agency to consent. I haven’t changed my mind on this, at least regarding people in the ’90’s, a place where I lived as a seemingly adult woman (which now, I find out, I was not).
I’ve mentioned my deep regard for the way Monica Lewinsky has picked up her life after having been abused by Ken Starr and a lot of other people. She and Bill made a mistake by having an affair. However, Clinton should absolutely not have resigned. That was an early example of the right-wing machine digging into whatever dirt they could manage to find, true or not. I don’t trust a freaking thing they do or say, not the intent, not the substance, not the result.
Interesting on the Lewinsky/Clinton issue too, I thought.
I agree with Hirshman that even if you believe Tara Reade, you should vote for Biden anyway. However, I think Reade is an unreliable witness, and that matters. It’s not victim-blaming to question a person who is not trustworthy. I know that’s problematic in sexual abuse cases, but I still feel that way, so whatever.
That said, I still agree with Gloria Steinem’s article, which did not throw Lewinsky under the bus. Maybe we’ve now “graduated” to a place where young women have to be treated as children because of “power dynamics”, but certainly in the ’90’s, adult women who thought they were consenting to (in fact initiating) a sexual relationship were actually believed to have had the agency to consent. I haven’t changed my mind on this, at least regarding people in the ’90’s, a place where I lived as a seemingly adult woman (which now, I find out, I was not).
I’ve mentioned my deep regard for the way Monica Lewinsky has picked up her life after having been abused by Ken Starr and a lot of other people. She and Bill made a mistake by having an affair. However, Clinton should absolutely not have resigned. That was an early example of the right-wing machine digging into whatever dirt they could manage to find, true or not. I don’t trust a freaking thing they do or say, not the intent, not the substance, not the result.
From the Hirshman piece: Democratic primary voters knew all about Mr. Biden’s membership in that boys’ club when there was still time to pick someone else. Alas.
This kind of thing is why I’m sick to death of pundits. “Democratic primary voters” are mostly ordinary people who aren’t political junkies, and many of whom were either not born or still children at the time of the Clarence Thomas hearings. The quote strikes me as a vast generalization pulled out of thin air, as if the entire electorate lives in the rarefied bubble of NYT-level pundits talking to each other.
*****
Meanwhile, I was bemused by Priest’s and russell’s links to metal artists. I tried to figure out what they were up to by reading their own words, and was still at sea. This article gave me (maybe?) a bit of a clearer picture of Clark Ashton, anyhow. Very interesting.
From the Hirshman piece: Democratic primary voters knew all about Mr. Biden’s membership in that boys’ club when there was still time to pick someone else. Alas.
This kind of thing is why I’m sick to death of pundits. “Democratic primary voters” are mostly ordinary people who aren’t political junkies, and many of whom were either not born or still children at the time of the Clarence Thomas hearings. The quote strikes me as a vast generalization pulled out of thin air, as if the entire electorate lives in the rarefied bubble of NYT-level pundits talking to each other.
*****
Meanwhile, I was bemused by Priest’s and russell’s links to metal artists. I tried to figure out what they were up to by reading their own words, and was still at sea. This article gave me (maybe?) a bit of a clearer picture of Clark Ashton, anyhow. Very interesting.
the entire pandemic (or, excuse me, “plandemic”) is a well-coordinated hoax by some shadowy international cabal
You laugh, but TRUMP is one of the key figures in the cabal.
His “cofefe” tweet was the signal to release the virus…and did anyone connect the dots?1??
the entire pandemic (or, excuse me, “plandemic”) is a well-coordinated hoax by some shadowy international cabal
You laugh, but TRUMP is one of the key figures in the cabal.
His “cofefe” tweet was the signal to release the virus…and did anyone connect the dots?1??
1. I’m even more cranky and contrary than usual these days. Sorry about that.
2. hsh’s 2:08 passage is full of interesting passages and aspects, one of which is that there are quite a few things in it that could be said about almost anyone, not just conspiracy theorists. Esp. right now. Like, “You
get to beare constantly angry that more people don’t ‘open their eyes’…”3. A church is suing Maine’s governor over her emergency order barring in-person worship. This reminds me of another reason why the incessant drumbeat about “the economy” is depressing. It isn’t just “the economy” that’s affected by the situation. It’s the entire range of human activities: churches, schools, bridge clubs, sports, parks, sewing circles… But none of that is important now that we’re just commodities (borrowing from hsh).
4. The restaurateur in Bethel opened again yesterday and I assume today, without a valid health license. He says he’s just going to pay the fines.
1. I’m even more cranky and contrary than usual these days. Sorry about that.
2. hsh’s 2:08 passage is full of interesting passages and aspects, one of which is that there are quite a few things in it that could be said about almost anyone, not just conspiracy theorists. Esp. right now. Like, “You
get to beare constantly angry that more people don’t ‘open their eyes’…”3. A church is suing Maine’s governor over her emergency order barring in-person worship. This reminds me of another reason why the incessant drumbeat about “the economy” is depressing. It isn’t just “the economy” that’s affected by the situation. It’s the entire range of human activities: churches, schools, bridge clubs, sports, parks, sewing circles… But none of that is important now that we’re just commodities (borrowing from hsh).
4. The restaurateur in Bethel opened again yesterday and I assume today, without a valid health license. He says he’s just going to pay the fines.
Full disclosure, Clark is a buddy of mine, for 19 years, and through Clark I’m friendly with Bill Torpy, the AJC writer, been to some epic St. Patrick’s Day parties at his family’s house. Big vats of homemade corned beef, and a build-your-own beverage station for Irish Car Bombs, appropriately located in the garage.
I do a decent job as a docent when I take visitors to get a look at his yard/sculpture garden, got a lot of the wording of his patter down, but can’t match the Augusta accent. Metro Atlanta (mostly justified) is not considered an exciting tourist destination, but Druid Hill, to use his affectation, is a true “you won’t see this anywhere else” spot.
Full disclosure, Clark is a buddy of mine, for 19 years, and through Clark I’m friendly with Bill Torpy, the AJC writer, been to some epic St. Patrick’s Day parties at his family’s house. Big vats of homemade corned beef, and a build-your-own beverage station for Irish Car Bombs, appropriately located in the garage.
I do a decent job as a docent when I take visitors to get a look at his yard/sculpture garden, got a lot of the wording of his patter down, but can’t match the Augusta accent. Metro Atlanta (mostly justified) is not considered an exciting tourist destination, but Druid Hill, to use his affectation, is a true “you won’t see this anywhere else” spot.
Priest — that’s pretty cool.
The pics of the scultpures have raised up something that’s nagging at the edge of my memory, like — I’m sure I’ve seen a place like this, only much more modest, in Maine. If I ever dredge up what the echo is, I’ll toss it into a comment.
But meanwhile, the sculture itself, and Clark’s rather high-flown language about it (on the website) brings to mind The Garden of Cosmic Speculation in Scotland, which I would never have heard of (and have certainly never seen), except that it’s featured in The Long Way Home, one of my favorite mysteries by the Canadian writer Louise Penny. That book also made me acquainted with the paintings of Clarence Gagnon, which are a feast for the eyes.
Priest — that’s pretty cool.
The pics of the scultpures have raised up something that’s nagging at the edge of my memory, like — I’m sure I’ve seen a place like this, only much more modest, in Maine. If I ever dredge up what the echo is, I’ll toss it into a comment.
But meanwhile, the sculture itself, and Clark’s rather high-flown language about it (on the website) brings to mind The Garden of Cosmic Speculation in Scotland, which I would never have heard of (and have certainly never seen), except that it’s featured in The Long Way Home, one of my favorite mysteries by the Canadian writer Louise Penny. That book also made me acquainted with the paintings of Clarence Gagnon, which are a feast for the eyes.
Graphs updated in the other thread. I don’t know why I’m still bothering, since as hsh pointed out, Worldometer is now showing a line for 7-day averages. But it has become something of a ritual for me, a way of insisting on a reality that a significant segment of the US has decided to pretend isn’t happening, or isn’t important.
Graphs updated in the other thread. I don’t know why I’m still bothering, since as hsh pointed out, Worldometer is now showing a line for 7-day averages. But it has become something of a ritual for me, a way of insisting on a reality that a significant segment of the US has decided to pretend isn’t happening, or isn’t important.
Had to google Irish car bomb cocktails
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/irish-car-bomb-drink_n_2867367
Had to google Irish car bomb cocktails
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/irish-car-bomb-drink_n_2867367
lj, thanks for that.
Similarly with “Black and Tan” (see from wiki below). There’s a bar in Augusta, Maine, named the Black and Tan and AFAICT the owners meant it to be an “Irish” pub. I mean……..sheesh.
The name “Black and Tan” is not used in Ireland as a term for a mixture of two beers. The drink is instead referred to as a half and half.[1] Indeed, the drink has image problems in Ireland and elsewhere due to the association with the Royal Irish Constabulary Reserve Force, nicknamed the “Black and Tans”, which was sent into Ireland in the early 1920s.[1] As a result, in Ireland the name is seen as contentious and disrespectful.[6]
In March 2006, Ben and Jerry’s released an ice cream flavour in the United States for Saint Patrick’s Day inspired by the drink; the name offended Irish nationalists because of the paramilitary association. Ben and Jerry’s has since apologised. A spokesman told Reuters, “Any reference on our part to the British Army [sic] unit was absolutely unintentional and no ill will was ever intended.”[7] In March 2012, the drink’s name once more came into the news when Nike, as part of an Irish themed set of designs, released a pair of shoes advertised as the “Black and Tan” and generating offence similar to the earlier Ben and Jerry’s ice cream.[8]
lj, thanks for that.
Similarly with “Black and Tan” (see from wiki below). There’s a bar in Augusta, Maine, named the Black and Tan and AFAICT the owners meant it to be an “Irish” pub. I mean……..sheesh.
The name “Black and Tan” is not used in Ireland as a term for a mixture of two beers. The drink is instead referred to as a half and half.[1] Indeed, the drink has image problems in Ireland and elsewhere due to the association with the Royal Irish Constabulary Reserve Force, nicknamed the “Black and Tans”, which was sent into Ireland in the early 1920s.[1] As a result, in Ireland the name is seen as contentious and disrespectful.[6]
In March 2006, Ben and Jerry’s released an ice cream flavour in the United States for Saint Patrick’s Day inspired by the drink; the name offended Irish nationalists because of the paramilitary association. Ben and Jerry’s has since apologised. A spokesman told Reuters, “Any reference on our part to the British Army [sic] unit was absolutely unintentional and no ill will was ever intended.”[7] In March 2012, the drink’s name once more came into the news when Nike, as part of an Irish themed set of designs, released a pair of shoes advertised as the “Black and Tan” and generating offence similar to the earlier Ben and Jerry’s ice cream.[8]
Back in the day, when I would order such things in bars, a Black and Tan was half Guinness and half Bass Ale (an English ale). A Half and Half was half Guinness and half Harp Lager (an Irish lager brewed by the brewers of Guinness). And the places I recall drinking them in were English-style pubs like Dickens’ Inn and The Artful Dodger.
Kinda-sorta related, a friend of mine worked at McGillin’s Olde Ale House and wore and orange shirt to work on St. Patrick’s Day, having no idea that it had any meaning. (Not sure why she didn’t wear green.) She was fired on the spot.
Back in the day, when I would order such things in bars, a Black and Tan was half Guinness and half Bass Ale (an English ale). A Half and Half was half Guinness and half Harp Lager (an Irish lager brewed by the brewers of Guinness). And the places I recall drinking them in were English-style pubs like Dickens’ Inn and The Artful Dodger.
Kinda-sorta related, a friend of mine worked at McGillin’s Olde Ale House and wore and orange shirt to work on St. Patrick’s Day, having no idea that it had any meaning. (Not sure why she didn’t wear green.) She was fired on the spot.
Also kinda-sorta related…though far off-topic…
My little Catholic high school in the sixties had, at a very rough guess, 1/3 Italian-Americans, 1/3 Irish-Americans, and 1/3 other. There was a small group of kids who would come to school on St. Patrick’s Day wearing a bit of orange (not much; we wore uniforms). I don’t think they really had a clue what it implied, they were just trying to wind up their Irish friends.
Also kinda-sorta related…though far off-topic…
My little Catholic high school in the sixties had, at a very rough guess, 1/3 Italian-Americans, 1/3 Irish-Americans, and 1/3 other. There was a small group of kids who would come to school on St. Patrick’s Day wearing a bit of orange (not much; we wore uniforms). I don’t think they really had a clue what it implied, they were just trying to wind up their Irish friends.
these days, “Irish” pubs are prefabricated. they might have been authentically fabricated in Ireland, however.
these days, “Irish” pubs are prefabricated. they might have been authentically fabricated in Ireland, however.
There is (at least) one of those in my general vicinity. It’s place that’s been around for a while in different iterations with different ownership. The previous versions were all slick, modern bar-restaurants where you would expect to drink different kinds of martinis and champagne cocktails and eat sushi-based dishes. It’s not too close, so not a place I would even drive past with any frequency, so it’s most recent transformation seemed very sudden to me.
It was turned completely into a relatively upscale but warm and cozy Irish pub. Every square inch of the place, inside and out, is now “Irish.” Looking at the photos at cleek’s link, it has to be one of those prefab imports. The resemblances are uncanny.
We happened to be in the area after a doctor’s appointment or something a year or two ago and were in somewhat desperate need of lunch. Suddenly, there was an Irish pub, so we pulled in. It was fake, but it was good.
There is (at least) one of those in my general vicinity. It’s place that’s been around for a while in different iterations with different ownership. The previous versions were all slick, modern bar-restaurants where you would expect to drink different kinds of martinis and champagne cocktails and eat sushi-based dishes. It’s not too close, so not a place I would even drive past with any frequency, so it’s most recent transformation seemed very sudden to me.
It was turned completely into a relatively upscale but warm and cozy Irish pub. Every square inch of the place, inside and out, is now “Irish.” Looking at the photos at cleek’s link, it has to be one of those prefab imports. The resemblances are uncanny.
We happened to be in the area after a doctor’s appointment or something a year or two ago and were in somewhat desperate need of lunch. Suddenly, there was an Irish pub, so we pulled in. It was fake, but it was good.
Top ten? There shouldn’t even be ten. Humans…
https://allianceforscience.cornell.edu/blog/2020/04/covid-top-10-current-conspiracy-theories/
Top ten? There shouldn’t even be ten. Humans…
https://allianceforscience.cornell.edu/blog/2020/04/covid-top-10-current-conspiracy-theories/
And that Cornell article is dated April 20. He could probably write up the top 100 by this time.
And that Cornell article is dated April 20. He could probably write up the top 100 by this time.
With a tiny whiff of another cultural appropriation meme. H/t Anne Laurie at BJ.
Cultural appropriation is a big topic, too big for this morning. But I will say this: pubs in Ireland, as distinct from “Irish” pubs in America, have (or at least had, as of when I was going there a lot, which was a while ago) an indefinable air of shabbiness that I doubt can be reproduced by design. And it was a particularly Irish shabbiness, not to be mistaken for anything you’d find in the diners or bars of the back roads of, let’s just say, western Pennsylvania or northeastern Ohio.
With a tiny whiff of another cultural appropriation meme. H/t Anne Laurie at BJ.
Cultural appropriation is a big topic, too big for this morning. But I will say this: pubs in Ireland, as distinct from “Irish” pubs in America, have (or at least had, as of when I was going there a lot, which was a while ago) an indefinable air of shabbiness that I doubt can be reproduced by design. And it was a particularly Irish shabbiness, not to be mistaken for anything you’d find in the diners or bars of the back roads of, let’s just say, western Pennsylvania or northeastern Ohio.
We happened to be in the area after a doctor’s appointment or something a year or two ago and were in somewhat desperate need of lunch. Suddenly, there was an Irish pub, so we pulled in. It was fake, but it was good.
when Mrs wife and i were in Japan a few years ago, we were exhausted after a hard day of travel and touring so we found one of those Irish pubs right around the corner from our hotel and watched a bunch of Japanese kids playing traditional Irish music while we ate fish n chips and drank Guinness.
knowing exactly what you’re going to get, no matter where you are, is exactly what you need sometimes.
We happened to be in the area after a doctor’s appointment or something a year or two ago and were in somewhat desperate need of lunch. Suddenly, there was an Irish pub, so we pulled in. It was fake, but it was good.
when Mrs wife and i were in Japan a few years ago, we were exhausted after a hard day of travel and touring so we found one of those Irish pubs right around the corner from our hotel and watched a bunch of Japanese kids playing traditional Irish music while we ate fish n chips and drank Guinness.
knowing exactly what you’re going to get, no matter where you are, is exactly what you need sometimes.
“It was fake, but it was good.”
Trump wins, Trump wins!
“It was fake, but it was good.”
Trump wins, Trump wins!
knowing exactly what you’re going to get, no matter where you are, is exactly what you need sometimes
I found that this phenomenon made it much easier to travel with kids. 😉
For a long time, Subway was our go-to stop. I felt that it was a tiny step up from McD’s, but maybe that was just wishful thinking.
knowing exactly what you’re going to get, no matter where you are, is exactly what you need sometimes
I found that this phenomenon made it much easier to travel with kids. 😉
For a long time, Subway was our go-to stop. I felt that it was a tiny step up from McD’s, but maybe that was just wishful thinking.
At least with Subway, there’s a chance of some flavor in what you get. Maybe even some food value.
At least with Subway, there’s a chance of some flavor in what you get. Maybe even some food value.
I think the decor in many Chinese restaurants comes in a kit too.
Some of them even receive koi to place in a little burbling pond in the lobby. But koi are Japanese, aren’t they?
Just like Covid-19 is the common flu cold and you know who is the greatest President ever.
Why, because Americans say so and we’re buying it, and who’s to say different, but if do have something different, tell it to my gun here.
If you want authenticity, stick to McDonald’s and Burger King.
Cracker Barrel is “just like” the joints where John Jay would repair to safe harbor from the constant damning. I think they have cracker barrels on site, but there are no cracker in them.
They were all-American originalist chintzy knockoffs from the getgo.
Janie asked the question days ago: “When did we all become consumers rather than citizens?”, I think it was.
You could do worse than read Walker Percy’s “Lost In The Cosmos — The Last Self-Help Book for inquiry into the answer to that question.
“The self in the twentieth century is a voracious nought which expands like the feeding vacuole of an amoeba seeking to nourish and inform its own nothingness by ingesting new objects in the world but, like a vacuole, only succeeds in emptying them out.”
Like Seinfeld’s “what’s with that” routines, Percy gives examples and scratches his existential head over them.
Why do upscale Americans purchase renovated slave quarters in southern American towns, and live in them?
You could ask the same about luxury bomb-shelter missile silos.
After rattling off a Martha Stewart-like list for making a funky coffee table from non-traditional materials, he asks, “Why was not a single table designed as such, rather than being a non-table doing duty as a table?” After suggesting that people have gotten tired of regular tables, or that converted non-tables make good conversation pieces etc. etc.
Why do non-cobblers buy a cobbler’s bench and use it as a breakfast nook table. There’s not a cobbler within a thousand miles.
You might well ask, in the same vein, why in the suburbs of Denver you can come across housing developments with streets named after Cape Cod beach towns.
On Cape Cod, I’ll bet you there is a Pikes Peak Lane.
Why were some astronauts so depressed after returning from the room, even to the point of taking up drinking as a pastime?
Why do many combat veterans recall, despite the murderous savagery they witnessed on the battlefield, those moments as the only time in their lives that they felt totally and authentically alive?
No American (OK, some) wants to be where they are at any particular moment. A very un-Thoreauean thought.
Why, after 20- or 30-whatever years of living in your own skin, do you look to personality tests to reveal who you really are?
Percy.
He wrote the book in the form of a self-help document because his essays and novels really didn’t get that much of an audience, so he went way down market.
To which Americans, generally speaking, answered like Alvy Singer’s mother regarding her son’s anxiety over whether the universe is expanding or not:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5U1-OmAICpU
And then Dr Flickr is noticed by a TV producer for his making up a bunch of bogus bullshit and gets his own TV show, and like asshole Dr. Phil goes in to make millions in horseshit America asking why should we take special precautions during a fucking pandemic, rather than going on with our daily lives filling the empty vacuoles of ourselves, when we do nothing about the tens of thousands killing each other or themselves with guns, and the tens of thousands or more who are killed and scragged every year in traffic accidents, and the millions have no insurance and access to healthcare, and the tens of thousands who die of the regular flu every year.
Washing our hands is no replacement for doing what the fuck we please.
True, regarding all of those needless killings and deaths, busybody liberals propose from time to time various solutions to each of the everyday meat grinders we subject ourselves to and we’re told to shut our politically correct traps and buy shit, usually by highly reasonable sounding maniacs who point out cost benefit analyses they jotted down on a napkin and here, if you don’t believe that, here’s an algorithm Elon Musk came up with that will explain everything, which trump will quote, mispronouncing the word “algorithm” and maybe even thinking it means that Al Gore can’t dance.
The least that Irish pubs in America or anywhere else could do is hire barkeeps who can fake an Irish brogue and once in a while hire female barkeeps who are lookalikes for Maureen O’Hara and who you find difficulty social distancing from.
I think the decor in many Chinese restaurants comes in a kit too.
Some of them even receive koi to place in a little burbling pond in the lobby. But koi are Japanese, aren’t they?
Just like Covid-19 is the common flu cold and you know who is the greatest President ever.
Why, because Americans say so and we’re buying it, and who’s to say different, but if do have something different, tell it to my gun here.
If you want authenticity, stick to McDonald’s and Burger King.
Cracker Barrel is “just like” the joints where John Jay would repair to safe harbor from the constant damning. I think they have cracker barrels on site, but there are no cracker in them.
They were all-American originalist chintzy knockoffs from the getgo.
Janie asked the question days ago: “When did we all become consumers rather than citizens?”, I think it was.
You could do worse than read Walker Percy’s “Lost In The Cosmos — The Last Self-Help Book for inquiry into the answer to that question.
“The self in the twentieth century is a voracious nought which expands like the feeding vacuole of an amoeba seeking to nourish and inform its own nothingness by ingesting new objects in the world but, like a vacuole, only succeeds in emptying them out.”
Like Seinfeld’s “what’s with that” routines, Percy gives examples and scratches his existential head over them.
Why do upscale Americans purchase renovated slave quarters in southern American towns, and live in them?
You could ask the same about luxury bomb-shelter missile silos.
After rattling off a Martha Stewart-like list for making a funky coffee table from non-traditional materials, he asks, “Why was not a single table designed as such, rather than being a non-table doing duty as a table?” After suggesting that people have gotten tired of regular tables, or that converted non-tables make good conversation pieces etc. etc.
Why do non-cobblers buy a cobbler’s bench and use it as a breakfast nook table. There’s not a cobbler within a thousand miles.
You might well ask, in the same vein, why in the suburbs of Denver you can come across housing developments with streets named after Cape Cod beach towns.
On Cape Cod, I’ll bet you there is a Pikes Peak Lane.
Why were some astronauts so depressed after returning from the room, even to the point of taking up drinking as a pastime?
Why do many combat veterans recall, despite the murderous savagery they witnessed on the battlefield, those moments as the only time in their lives that they felt totally and authentically alive?
No American (OK, some) wants to be where they are at any particular moment. A very un-Thoreauean thought.
Why, after 20- or 30-whatever years of living in your own skin, do you look to personality tests to reveal who you really are?
Percy.
He wrote the book in the form of a self-help document because his essays and novels really didn’t get that much of an audience, so he went way down market.
To which Americans, generally speaking, answered like Alvy Singer’s mother regarding her son’s anxiety over whether the universe is expanding or not:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5U1-OmAICpU
And then Dr Flickr is noticed by a TV producer for his making up a bunch of bogus bullshit and gets his own TV show, and like asshole Dr. Phil goes in to make millions in horseshit America asking why should we take special precautions during a fucking pandemic, rather than going on with our daily lives filling the empty vacuoles of ourselves, when we do nothing about the tens of thousands killing each other or themselves with guns, and the tens of thousands or more who are killed and scragged every year in traffic accidents, and the millions have no insurance and access to healthcare, and the tens of thousands who die of the regular flu every year.
Washing our hands is no replacement for doing what the fuck we please.
True, regarding all of those needless killings and deaths, busybody liberals propose from time to time various solutions to each of the everyday meat grinders we subject ourselves to and we’re told to shut our politically correct traps and buy shit, usually by highly reasonable sounding maniacs who point out cost benefit analyses they jotted down on a napkin and here, if you don’t believe that, here’s an algorithm Elon Musk came up with that will explain everything, which trump will quote, mispronouncing the word “algorithm” and maybe even thinking it means that Al Gore can’t dance.
The least that Irish pubs in America or anywhere else could do is hire barkeeps who can fake an Irish brogue and once in a while hire female barkeeps who are lookalikes for Maureen O’Hara and who you find difficulty social distancing from.
I think the decor in many Chinese restaurants comes in a kit too.
also while we were in Japan, we stopped at an Indian restaurant. we got to talking with the waiter, an Indian man. and he told us that he had gone to something like an “Indian Restaurant Waiter School” in India and that a lot of Indian restaurants are package deals – just like the Chinese places. you get the menu, the recipes, decor and trained staff.
makes sense.
I think the decor in many Chinese restaurants comes in a kit too.
also while we were in Japan, we stopped at an Indian restaurant. we got to talking with the waiter, an Indian man. and he told us that he had gone to something like an “Indian Restaurant Waiter School” in India and that a lot of Indian restaurants are package deals – just like the Chinese places. you get the menu, the recipes, decor and trained staff.
makes sense.
astronauts returned from the “moon” …..
astronauts returned from the “moon” …..
I can’t pay my hospital bill, and whitey’s on the room.
I can’t pay my hospital bill, and whitey’s on the room.
Pete Hegseth gets anywhere near me or my loved ones or my friends and I’ll put a bullet in his head and then hunt down his Christian herd of subhuman children…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5U1-OmAICpU
I mean, look, if Sean Hanitty can compare the salon owner who was given a week in the hoose gow for violating shutdown guidelines to William Wallace being disemboweled in Braveheart, I can threaten whatever I fucking like.
Republicans want bloody Civil War, though they would settle for their enemies .. ME .. dying of the Covid-19.
One can hope and yes, I can project just as well as the Republican Party (which won’t do; a thousand times more might work to destroy them):
https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a32388472/ohios-mike-dewine-covid-19-work-refusals-report/
Meanwhile, Deep State Switzerland is wrong about kids and the Covid:
https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/kids-are-now-showing-strange-symptoms-of-coronavirus-but-experts-say-it-remains-exceptionally-uncommon-172951808.html
My son’s Chemistry Department Head’s (Columbia University, were he earned his doctorate) wife suffered from and tested positive for the virus in New York. She has recovered, but days after she started showing symptoms, he and their two teenagers came down with the virus as well, yes recovered.
Believe nothing conservatives tell us.
After all, America is a mere money-making vanity project for them to commit genocide on:
“In a way, by doing all this testing we make ourselves look bad,” — Donald Trump, Wednesday
Insurrectionary Civil War.
It’s already started and it is violent. And this pandemic is what it looks like, for now.
Republicans and conservatives started it.
Anything we do in response is self defense.
Pete Hegseth gets anywhere near me or my loved ones or my friends and I’ll put a bullet in his head and then hunt down his Christian herd of subhuman children…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5U1-OmAICpU
I mean, look, if Sean Hanitty can compare the salon owner who was given a week in the hoose gow for violating shutdown guidelines to William Wallace being disemboweled in Braveheart, I can threaten whatever I fucking like.
Republicans want bloody Civil War, though they would settle for their enemies .. ME .. dying of the Covid-19.
One can hope and yes, I can project just as well as the Republican Party (which won’t do; a thousand times more might work to destroy them):
https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a32388472/ohios-mike-dewine-covid-19-work-refusals-report/
Meanwhile, Deep State Switzerland is wrong about kids and the Covid:
https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/kids-are-now-showing-strange-symptoms-of-coronavirus-but-experts-say-it-remains-exceptionally-uncommon-172951808.html
My son’s Chemistry Department Head’s (Columbia University, were he earned his doctorate) wife suffered from and tested positive for the virus in New York. She has recovered, but days after she started showing symptoms, he and their two teenagers came down with the virus as well, yes recovered.
Believe nothing conservatives tell us.
After all, America is a mere money-making vanity project for them to commit genocide on:
“In a way, by doing all this testing we make ourselves look bad,” — Donald Trump, Wednesday
Insurrectionary Civil War.
It’s already started and it is violent. And this pandemic is what it looks like, for now.
Republicans and conservatives started it.
Anything we do in response is self defense.
That first site at 2:17pm about Pete Hegseth threatening me with death should be this:
https://www.eschatonblog.com/2020/05/your-family-first-big-guy.html
That first site at 2:17pm about Pete Hegseth threatening me with death should be this:
https://www.eschatonblog.com/2020/05/your-family-first-big-guy.html
The second cite at 2:17pm should be this:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-personal-assistant-valet-positive-covid-19
This would be a good time for a conspiracy theory confirming what’s already out there, that there is a vaccine and only a few choice vermin Republicans, including Pence and Trump have received it.
The rest of us can fucking die.
Meanwhile, look who the government IS protecting:
https://www.businessinsider.com/fox-news-hosts-received-priority-treatment-for-ppe-requests-2020-5
Can’t let the subhuman lying propaganda mouthpieces get struck down by this thing, while there is so much conservative lying, cheating, thieving and killing to do.
But DeWine can kiss my ass as well.
America, you had better kill me.
The second cite at 2:17pm should be this:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-personal-assistant-valet-positive-covid-19
This would be a good time for a conspiracy theory confirming what’s already out there, that there is a vaccine and only a few choice vermin Republicans, including Pence and Trump have received it.
The rest of us can fucking die.
Meanwhile, look who the government IS protecting:
https://www.businessinsider.com/fox-news-hosts-received-priority-treatment-for-ppe-requests-2020-5
Can’t let the subhuman lying propaganda mouthpieces get struck down by this thing, while there is so much conservative lying, cheating, thieving and killing to do.
But DeWine can kiss my ass as well.
America, you had better kill me.
Republicans want bloody Civil War, though they would settle for their enemies .. ME .. dying of the Covid-19.
Just to be clear, that’s Republican politicians. Plus their co-dependent media and the occasional RWNJ militia members.
One of the fascinating features of this whole affair is that, while they will say they think Trump is doing well, the actual masses of Republicans are pretty much in sync with the rest of the population regarding
They do gripe more about the lockdowns,and other measures to deal with the virus. But they overwhelmingly follow the directions, just like everybody else.
And I’m starting to see speculation about the long (actual medium) term political impact of the disconnect between the politicians and their supporters. Especially if, as seems likely, those politicians’ actions blow up in their faces.
Republicans want bloody Civil War, though they would settle for their enemies .. ME .. dying of the Covid-19.
Just to be clear, that’s Republican politicians. Plus their co-dependent media and the occasional RWNJ militia members.
One of the fascinating features of this whole affair is that, while they will say they think Trump is doing well, the actual masses of Republicans are pretty much in sync with the rest of the population regarding
They do gripe more about the lockdowns,and other measures to deal with the virus. But they overwhelmingly follow the directions, just like everybody else.
And I’m starting to see speculation about the long (actual medium) term political impact of the disconnect between the politicians and their supporters. Especially if, as seems likely, those politicians’ actions blow up in their faces.
If they have a seisun on the weekends that’s early enough for the whole family to show up – and the whole family shows up – and they have Irish breakfast on Sunday after church with black pudding, greasy fried eggs, and good bread, and there’s soccer on the TV during the Irish breakfast, then it’s an Irish pub.
Anybody can pull a pint of Guiness.
If they have a seisun on the weekends that’s early enough for the whole family to show up – and the whole family shows up – and they have Irish breakfast on Sunday after church with black pudding, greasy fried eggs, and good bread, and there’s soccer on the TV during the Irish breakfast, then it’s an Irish pub.
Anybody can pull a pint of Guiness.
This would be a good time for a conspiracy theory confirming what’s already out there, that there is a vaccine and only a few choice vermin Republicans, including Pence and Trump have received it.
Except that the story I read said that Trump went into total freak-out mode when he discovered that someone near him had tested positive. If they had a vaccine, or a treatment, Trump would have demanded that everybody around him get it. Germophobe that he notoriously is.
This would be a good time for a conspiracy theory confirming what’s already out there, that there is a vaccine and only a few choice vermin Republicans, including Pence and Trump have received it.
Except that the story I read said that Trump went into total freak-out mode when he discovered that someone near him had tested positive. If they had a vaccine, or a treatment, Trump would have demanded that everybody around him get it. Germophobe that he notoriously is.
the actual masses of Republicans are pretty much in sync with the rest of the population regarding
TBH, among conservatives I know, there is no mass of support for the status quo. A lot of them see it as Government Stepping On Their Rights, a lot of them think the risk is way overblown, many of them think it’s time for the population as a whole to take the hit and get it over with.
It’s weird talking with them about any of this. I’m having a lot of “who the hell are you?” moments.
the actual masses of Republicans are pretty much in sync with the rest of the population regarding
TBH, among conservatives I know, there is no mass of support for the status quo. A lot of them see it as Government Stepping On Their Rights, a lot of them think the risk is way overblown, many of them think it’s time for the population as a whole to take the hit and get it over with.
It’s weird talking with them about any of this. I’m having a lot of “who the hell are you?” moments.
He faked the freak-out.
Plus, he thought he was going to contract polio, not having heard of the Covid-19.
And if he was so afraid of germs, why doesn’t he wash his hands after every trip to his solid-gold shitter?
“Trump would have demanded that everybody around him get it.”
No, he wouldn’t. If he is already inoculated, his underlings disappearing with the Covid would relieve him of having to fire them a few weeks down the road for unspecified crimes.
Unless their faces are mirrors reflecting his high-esteem image back at him, he doesn’t give a shit whether they live or die.
“One of the fascinating features of this whole affair is that ….”
Fascinating, you say.
This was fascinating:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ueAYUp4rHZI
One of Joe Exotic’s underlings having her arm chewed off at the elbow by an abused tiger was fascinating.
This whole affair is unspeakably despicable and has disgraced each and every one of us in the eyes of the world.
South Korea is America. Canada is America.
America is dead and the Republican Party murdered it.
He faked the freak-out.
Plus, he thought he was going to contract polio, not having heard of the Covid-19.
And if he was so afraid of germs, why doesn’t he wash his hands after every trip to his solid-gold shitter?
“Trump would have demanded that everybody around him get it.”
No, he wouldn’t. If he is already inoculated, his underlings disappearing with the Covid would relieve him of having to fire them a few weeks down the road for unspecified crimes.
Unless their faces are mirrors reflecting his high-esteem image back at him, he doesn’t give a shit whether they live or die.
“One of the fascinating features of this whole affair is that ….”
Fascinating, you say.
This was fascinating:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ueAYUp4rHZI
One of Joe Exotic’s underlings having her arm chewed off at the elbow by an abused tiger was fascinating.
This whole affair is unspeakably despicable and has disgraced each and every one of us in the eyes of the world.
South Korea is America. Canada is America.
America is dead and the Republican Party murdered it.
the future is also a foreign country where the DOJ declines to press charges against members of the POTUS’ staff, even though they’ve pled guilty.
Although, actually, except for the “pled guilty” part, there’s some history there.
Sorry, but rule of law is now a joke. Been that way for a while, certainly since Nixon’s pardon and the free pass for the Iran-Contra crew.
If yer gonna do the crimes, go big.
the future is also a foreign country where the DOJ declines to press charges against members of the POTUS’ staff, even though they’ve pled guilty.
Although, actually, except for the “pled guilty” part, there’s some history there.
Sorry, but rule of law is now a joke. Been that way for a while, certainly since Nixon’s pardon and the free pass for the Iran-Contra crew.
If yer gonna do the crimes, go big.
TBH, among conservatives I know, there is no mass of support for the status quo. A lot of them see it as Government Stepping On Their Rights, a lot of them think the risk is way overblown, many of them think it’s time for the population as a whole to take the hit and get it over with.
Yes, they’re saying stuff like that. But look at what they’re actually doing. It’s easy to show solidarity by mouthing off. But actually do things that are dangerous? Much less attractive.
TBH, among conservatives I know, there is no mass of support for the status quo. A lot of them see it as Government Stepping On Their Rights, a lot of them think the risk is way overblown, many of them think it’s time for the population as a whole to take the hit and get it over with.
Yes, they’re saying stuff like that. But look at what they’re actually doing. It’s easy to show solidarity by mouthing off. But actually do things that are dangerous? Much less attractive.
We can break law we wish to now.
No limits.
Just as in war.
Fuck you conservatives.
We can break law we wish to now.
No limits.
Just as in war.
Fuck you conservatives.
But actually do things that are dangerous? Much less attractive.
Yeah, they pretty much want other people to do the things that are dangerous.
Some of them miss going to church. Other than that, they personally are not in a hurry to gather in large groups, etc.
None of them work retail, none are waitstaff, none are cops or nurses. None work in any kind of human service role that requires face-to-face work.
FWIW, none of the musicians I know are in a hurry to end the lockdown, even though it’s basically brought their livelihoods to a halt. They’re frustrated, and they miss playing with other people, but they’re cool with the rules.
Just another social fault line.
But actually do things that are dangerous? Much less attractive.
Yeah, they pretty much want other people to do the things that are dangerous.
Some of them miss going to church. Other than that, they personally are not in a hurry to gather in large groups, etc.
None of them work retail, none are waitstaff, none are cops or nurses. None work in any kind of human service role that requires face-to-face work.
FWIW, none of the musicians I know are in a hurry to end the lockdown, even though it’s basically brought their livelihoods to a halt. They’re frustrated, and they miss playing with other people, but they’re cool with the rules.
Just another social fault line.
Yes, they’re saying stuff like that. But look at what they’re actually doing. It’s easy to show solidarity by mouthing off. But actually do things that are dangerous? Much less attractive.
To irritate a couple of acquaintances, I used to point out that if we did away with the social safety net the way they wanted to, they weren’t nearly rich enough to pay for individual care for their widowed mother. And that it was good that they had bought the McMansion, because grandma would be living upstairs. Or they could explain to their kids that they were just going to let grandma die, because Social Security and Medicare taxes were such an incredible burden.
Those were the days when at some point I said quietly to myself, “Mike, you’re not nearly as nice a person as you would like to think you are.”
Yes, they’re saying stuff like that. But look at what they’re actually doing. It’s easy to show solidarity by mouthing off. But actually do things that are dangerous? Much less attractive.
To irritate a couple of acquaintances, I used to point out that if we did away with the social safety net the way they wanted to, they weren’t nearly rich enough to pay for individual care for their widowed mother. And that it was good that they had bought the McMansion, because grandma would be living upstairs. Or they could explain to their kids that they were just going to let grandma die, because Social Security and Medicare taxes were such an incredible burden.
Those were the days when at some point I said quietly to myself, “Mike, you’re not nearly as nice a person as you would like to think you are.”
oh my, no.
45% of Republicans don’t wear face masks in public. vs 90% of Dems.
43% of Republicans are ‘sheltering at home’, vs 87% of Dems.
i went to Lowes this past week, and probably 90% of the people there weren’t wearing masks of any kind.
oh my, no.
45% of Republicans don’t wear face masks in public. vs 90% of Dems.
43% of Republicans are ‘sheltering at home’, vs 87% of Dems.
i went to Lowes this past week, and probably 90% of the people there weren’t wearing masks of any kind.
Those big brawny armed pussy conservatives hauling around military grade weaponry in the demonstrations haven’t offered to take a job in the meatpacking plants cutting up my pork chops, have they?
Get to work, ladies!
They’d love to hang around outside the plants with or without masks and harass, perhaps shoot immigrants as they kick the latter’s asses out of the country.
Where’s my beef, they’ll bellow, when their abused raped wives serve them macaroni and cheese.
Trump is now accusing hospitals and health departments of lying about the numbers of the dead.
His poll numbers are climbing which sums up the vermin subhuman half of America.
Too bad this human being can’t have his case dropped:
https://wcti12.com/news/nation-world/man-shot-dead-while-out-for-a-jog-family-demands-arrests-2-months-later
Too bad this guy cant be pardoned after being murdered by black Trump libertarian gun-toting republicans.
https://www.fox2detroit.com/news/4th-family-member-charged-after-flint-security-guard-murdered-over-face-mask-dispute
Too bad this black Republican filth entitled to her cheeseburger watches too much FOX News:
https://www.koco.com/article/police-identify-woman-accused-of-firing-shots-at-mcdonalds-after-she-was-told-dining-room-was-closed/32403518#
When I fully covered up to go witness conservative libertarian assholes demonstrate their Covid-spreading talents in Denver, as I rode my bike home, I looked to the side and there was a homeless soul with all of his stuff in a grocery cart.
HE was wearing a mask. HE wasn’t carrying a weapon.
I gave him ten bucks.
“Mike, you’re not nearly as nice a person as you would like to think you are.”
Were they nice back?
Those big brawny armed pussy conservatives hauling around military grade weaponry in the demonstrations haven’t offered to take a job in the meatpacking plants cutting up my pork chops, have they?
Get to work, ladies!
They’d love to hang around outside the plants with or without masks and harass, perhaps shoot immigrants as they kick the latter’s asses out of the country.
Where’s my beef, they’ll bellow, when their abused raped wives serve them macaroni and cheese.
Trump is now accusing hospitals and health departments of lying about the numbers of the dead.
His poll numbers are climbing which sums up the vermin subhuman half of America.
Too bad this human being can’t have his case dropped:
https://wcti12.com/news/nation-world/man-shot-dead-while-out-for-a-jog-family-demands-arrests-2-months-later
Too bad this guy cant be pardoned after being murdered by black Trump libertarian gun-toting republicans.
https://www.fox2detroit.com/news/4th-family-member-charged-after-flint-security-guard-murdered-over-face-mask-dispute
Too bad this black Republican filth entitled to her cheeseburger watches too much FOX News:
https://www.koco.com/article/police-identify-woman-accused-of-firing-shots-at-mcdonalds-after-she-was-told-dining-room-was-closed/32403518#
When I fully covered up to go witness conservative libertarian assholes demonstrate their Covid-spreading talents in Denver, as I rode my bike home, I looked to the side and there was a homeless soul with all of his stuff in a grocery cart.
HE was wearing a mask. HE wasn’t carrying a weapon.
I gave him ten bucks.
“Mike, you’re not nearly as nice a person as you would like to think you are.”
Were they nice back?
Unlike Flynn, the murdered Trayvon Martins in this pig country weren’t even given a chance to plead guilty first before the bullets flew.
William Barr will be hung by his neck.
We’ll even give him a trial.
Unlike Flynn, the murdered Trayvon Martins in this pig country weren’t even given a chance to plead guilty first before the bullets flew.
William Barr will be hung by his neck.
We’ll even give him a trial.
Those big brawny armed pussy conservatives hauling around military grade weaponry in the demonstrations haven’t offered to take a job in the meatpacking plants cutting up my pork chops, have they?
Get to work, ladies!
They’d love to hang around outside the plants with or without masks and harass, perhaps shoot immigrants as they kick the latter’s asses out of the country.
Has it ever occurred to you to wonder, just how do those guys make a living? How do they keep food on the table?
Maybe being an armed protester pays better than I realize….
Those big brawny armed pussy conservatives hauling around military grade weaponry in the demonstrations haven’t offered to take a job in the meatpacking plants cutting up my pork chops, have they?
Get to work, ladies!
They’d love to hang around outside the plants with or without masks and harass, perhaps shoot immigrants as they kick the latter’s asses out of the country.
Has it ever occurred to you to wonder, just how do those guys make a living? How do they keep food on the table?
Maybe being an armed protester pays better than I realize….
i went to Lowes this past week, and probably 90% of the people there weren’t wearing masks of any kind.
That’s f**king insane. I don’t think you can enter a place like that without a mask around here. I haven’t been to Lowes, but anywhere I’ve gone for last however-many weeks, everyone was wearing a mask.
I will say, my Republican neighbors (and I know who they are) don’t seem to be isolating to nearly the degree that we are. Their kids are out playing with other kids that don’t even live in our neighborhood. I’ve seen neighbors going into each other’s houses. No masks in either case, mind you.
I can’t really be sure when the last time someone else was in our house. Some time in March, maybe?
i went to Lowes this past week, and probably 90% of the people there weren’t wearing masks of any kind.
That’s f**king insane. I don’t think you can enter a place like that without a mask around here. I haven’t been to Lowes, but anywhere I’ve gone for last however-many weeks, everyone was wearing a mask.
I will say, my Republican neighbors (and I know who they are) don’t seem to be isolating to nearly the degree that we are. Their kids are out playing with other kids that don’t even live in our neighborhood. I’ve seen neighbors going into each other’s houses. No masks in either case, mind you.
I can’t really be sure when the last time someone else was in our house. Some time in March, maybe?
DOJ is dropping case against Flynn.
WTAF? Does this mean all charges dropped? No emojis, punctuation marks or acronyms are adequate, let alone those mainstays of a bygone age, words.
DOJ is dropping case against Flynn.
WTAF? Does this mean all charges dropped? No emojis, punctuation marks or acronyms are adequate, let alone those mainstays of a bygone age, words.
OTOH, i went to the grocery store on the nicer side of town this week, most people, including staff, were wearing masks.
different clientele.
OTOH, i went to the grocery store on the nicer side of town this week, most people, including staff, were wearing masks.
different clientele.
No emojis, punctuation marks or acronyms are adequate, let alone those mainstays of a bygone age, words.
ain’t it wild?
turns out, norms aren’t very meaningful when 90% of a political party is in thrall to the leader of that party.
the GOP is a cult.
No emojis, punctuation marks or acronyms are adequate, let alone those mainstays of a bygone age, words.
ain’t it wild?
turns out, norms aren’t very meaningful when 90% of a political party is in thrall to the leader of that party.
the GOP is a cult.
How do these guys make a living?
Their wives work. Two jobs.
But the guys steal the money out of their wives’ purses to buy bullets and give the rest to their girlfriends, who happen to be the wives of their brothers, or maybe the girlfriends are their step mothers.
Following the Ayn Rand example, they are on food stamps, disability, medicaid, and whatever socialism they can game from the VA, in other words, they have no faith in government whatsoever and if government puts its hands on their government bennies, why, it’s showtime for the government deep administrative state gooks.
The only private sector capitalism they practice is letting payday loan joints crib 25% off the top of their disability checks, their disabilities being incontinence, infertility, with a touch of amnesia about what they didn’t do in the Mekong Delta, and erectile dysfunction with their gun, not to be confused with projectile dysfunction with their weapon.
They also run up a tab at the their local bar, which they are secretly glad is closed so the bartenders aren’t able to ask when they might be paying that there tab you’ve run up, buster.
But they can drink free at their mothers’ houses.
The Mayor of Denver just mandated the wearing of masks in all establishments. The cool thing now is that when I punch the guy’s lights out who is giving some hapless clerk in the store shit about having to wear a mask, when the cops arrive, everyone will say they don’t know who I am because I was wearing a mask, like everyone else standing there, except the Trump asshole, and I’m just blending in smiling with my eyes.
How do these guys make a living?
Their wives work. Two jobs.
But the guys steal the money out of their wives’ purses to buy bullets and give the rest to their girlfriends, who happen to be the wives of their brothers, or maybe the girlfriends are their step mothers.
Following the Ayn Rand example, they are on food stamps, disability, medicaid, and whatever socialism they can game from the VA, in other words, they have no faith in government whatsoever and if government puts its hands on their government bennies, why, it’s showtime for the government deep administrative state gooks.
The only private sector capitalism they practice is letting payday loan joints crib 25% off the top of their disability checks, their disabilities being incontinence, infertility, with a touch of amnesia about what they didn’t do in the Mekong Delta, and erectile dysfunction with their gun, not to be confused with projectile dysfunction with their weapon.
They also run up a tab at the their local bar, which they are secretly glad is closed so the bartenders aren’t able to ask when they might be paying that there tab you’ve run up, buster.
But they can drink free at their mothers’ houses.
The Mayor of Denver just mandated the wearing of masks in all establishments. The cool thing now is that when I punch the guy’s lights out who is giving some hapless clerk in the store shit about having to wear a mask, when the cops arrive, everyone will say they don’t know who I am because I was wearing a mask, like everyone else standing there, except the Trump asshole, and I’m just blending in smiling with my eyes.
Yep. The differences in clientele are telling.
Local Trader Joe’s across from campus – mostly students and university affiliates – almost everyone is masked and everyone not masked is assumed to have valid reasons for not doing so.
Local liquor chain store on the other side of the highway from campus on the edge of a bunch of gated communities: half the clientele is masked, half is not. Masked clientele is mostly older and driving luxury vehicles or hybrids. Unmasked clientele are mostly driving fancy contractor trucks (the fancy, foreman types, not the ones that actually haul anything) and looking at the masked customers as if they are all a bunch of snowflakes. They also can’t be bothered to wait for another customer or one of the workers there to get out of an area before grabbing what they want.
Yep. The differences in clientele are telling.
Local Trader Joe’s across from campus – mostly students and university affiliates – almost everyone is masked and everyone not masked is assumed to have valid reasons for not doing so.
Local liquor chain store on the other side of the highway from campus on the edge of a bunch of gated communities: half the clientele is masked, half is not. Masked clientele is mostly older and driving luxury vehicles or hybrids. Unmasked clientele are mostly driving fancy contractor trucks (the fancy, foreman types, not the ones that actually haul anything) and looking at the masked customers as if they are all a bunch of snowflakes. They also can’t be bothered to wait for another customer or one of the workers there to get out of an area before grabbing what they want.
https://juanitajean.com/the-story-out-of-texas/
Fuck you racist vermin conservatives.
I love it when a black judge goes all law and order on white entitled filth.
I hope that Judge carries a weapon and uses it when confronted by white snowflake republican politico operatives on the street.
I think I’ve finally arrived at a point where I understand what the Second Amendment is there for.
https://juanitajean.com/the-story-out-of-texas/
Fuck you racist vermin conservatives.
I love it when a black judge goes all law and order on white entitled filth.
I hope that Judge carries a weapon and uses it when confronted by white snowflake republican politico operatives on the street.
I think I’ve finally arrived at a point where I understand what the Second Amendment is there for.
The first comment to your juanitajean link says:
But obviously not. It will be so much more satisfying if Texas just turns blue sooner rather than later. I’m quite OK with the Texans (the real ones, not the wild west wannabes) cleaning their own house.
The first comment to your juanitajean link says:
But obviously not. It will be so much more satisfying if Texas just turns blue sooner rather than later. I’m quite OK with the Texans (the real ones, not the wild west wannabes) cleaning their own house.
In the foreign country that is the future, state legislators are accompanied to their offices by volunteer private militias, as a safety measure against the volunteer private militias that threaten them.
The guy who organized this is apparently a Lansing firefighter. Anthony is likely his rep. Apparently he saw the BS on the TV and decided it wouldn’t stand.
It will be interesting to see how he ends up being evaluated by the conservative calculus. Firefighter, so – hero!! Plus, open carrying, so – freedom fighter! But, defending a state rep from other hero freedom fighters. Huh?
It must be very confusing.
In the foreign country that is the future, state legislators are accompanied to their offices by volunteer private militias, as a safety measure against the volunteer private militias that threaten them.
The guy who organized this is apparently a Lansing firefighter. Anthony is likely his rep. Apparently he saw the BS on the TV and decided it wouldn’t stand.
It will be interesting to see how he ends up being evaluated by the conservative calculus. Firefighter, so – hero!! Plus, open carrying, so – freedom fighter! But, defending a state rep from other hero freedom fighters. Huh?
It must be very confusing.
Gee, it was awfully quiet as that rep and her posse walked to work to serve the public interest:
https://harpers.org/archive/2020/04/good-guys-with-guns-socialist-gun-club/
I certainly hope no white right wingers’ free loudmouthed speech was queered by the show of force.
I have a plan.
Gee, it was awfully quiet as that rep and her posse walked to work to serve the public interest:
https://harpers.org/archive/2020/04/good-guys-with-guns-socialist-gun-club/
I certainly hope no white right wingers’ free loudmouthed speech was queered by the show of force.
I have a plan.
The Subhuman in Chief is murdering blacks while he wastes my hard-earned tax dollars painting his wall his favorite color:
https://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2020/05/a-leader-to-lead-the-nation
Do something, conservatives and libertarians. If your guns weren’t manufactured to be used at this moment in American history against tyranny, then shove your masks up your asses.
The Subhuman in Chief is murdering blacks while he wastes my hard-earned tax dollars painting his wall his favorite color:
https://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2020/05/a-leader-to-lead-the-nation
Do something, conservatives and libertarians. If your guns weren’t manufactured to be used at this moment in American history against tyranny, then shove your masks up your asses.
Shhh, show no emotion as the alien subhumans distribute death among us in order to cross state lines to get a perm or visit that strip club:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/maga-will-spread-the-virus/
Yever notice how conservative republican dogs look like their owners:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktEW65QQFgQ
Too late:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRVfGMjdGh8
Shhh, show no emotion as the alien subhumans distribute death among us in order to cross state lines to get a perm or visit that strip club:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/maga-will-spread-the-virus/
Yever notice how conservative republican dogs look like their owners:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktEW65QQFgQ
Too late:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JRVfGMjdGh8
Maybe a glimpse of the future
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/05/whats-south-koreas-secret/611215/
Maybe a glimpse of the future
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/05/whats-south-koreas-secret/611215/
South Korea is showing America that old can-do spirit, that we can face our challenges and together defeat them, instead of projecting what Americans think Asians would do, not giving a shit about the value of human life, but it is we who think that way of course.
South Korea is showing America that old can-do spirit, that we can face our challenges and together defeat them, instead of projecting what Americans think Asians would do, not giving a shit about the value of human life, but it is we who think that way of course.
The Flynn thing has rocked me badly. How stupid of me, not to have realised before. Without realising it, I must have been subconsciously expecting that if the Dems win the White House, and please God the senate, in November, it’s not too late to repair things. But it probably is too late. Too many people are just fine with what’s been happening. I feel more heartbroken than I have since the Kavanaugh hearings. I guess in a way russell has been saying as much for a while. America is probably irrevocably broken.
The Flynn thing has rocked me badly. How stupid of me, not to have realised before. Without realising it, I must have been subconsciously expecting that if the Dems win the White House, and please God the senate, in November, it’s not too late to repair things. But it probably is too late. Too many people are just fine with what’s been happening. I feel more heartbroken than I have since the Kavanaugh hearings. I guess in a way russell has been saying as much for a while. America is probably irrevocably broken.
I guess in a way russell has been saying as much for a while. America is probably irrevocably broken.
Haha.
russell is saying let’s all be different countries! Let’s all be United States Brexit! Let’s all be Putin’s dream!
I say: the majority of the people support something other than what’s going on. Let’s not let it happen.
It’s pretty hard, right? It’s an existential moment. Remember when y’all said you’d fight for America when that happened? Do it. We need to figure out the leadership, then follow it. Now.
I guess in a way russell has been saying as much for a while. America is probably irrevocably broken.
Haha.
russell is saying let’s all be different countries! Let’s all be United States Brexit! Let’s all be Putin’s dream!
I say: the majority of the people support something other than what’s going on. Let’s not let it happen.
It’s pretty hard, right? It’s an existential moment. Remember when y’all said you’d fight for America when that happened? Do it. We need to figure out the leadership, then follow it. Now.
Personally, I said during the campaign that if Trump was elected it posed an existential threat to America. The words were right, but somehow I had not foreseen quite how fast institutions could crumble and fall apart. It seems, like Humpty Dumpty, impossible to see how it can be put back together again. Doesn’t mean people shouldn’t fight, say not the struggle naught availeth, etc etc. But fuck, I can’t see how.
Personally, I said during the campaign that if Trump was elected it posed an existential threat to America. The words were right, but somehow I had not foreseen quite how fast institutions could crumble and fall apart. It seems, like Humpty Dumpty, impossible to see how it can be put back together again. Doesn’t mean people shouldn’t fight, say not the struggle naught availeth, etc etc. But fuck, I can’t see how.
I’m pretty sure russell has written no such thing. Not knowing exactly how to avoid something isn’t the same as wanting it to happen.
I’m pretty sure russell has written no such thing. Not knowing exactly how to avoid something isn’t the same as wanting it to happen.
By the way, don’t blame Biden or “the DNC”. They’re used to playing by the old rules,. They need to nod to the old rules because that’s kind of what we’re fighting for. But we, the People – those who make up the majority of the country (and a supermajority who are hoping to fight the virus by staying home) need bad ass people to fight. We are them.
How’re we going to do it? JanieM pointed out that I am not a leader, too mean to be convincing to anyone here. You? Anybody?
By the way, don’t blame Biden or “the DNC”. They’re used to playing by the old rules,. They need to nod to the old rules because that’s kind of what we’re fighting for. But we, the People – those who make up the majority of the country (and a supermajority who are hoping to fight the virus by staying home) need bad ass people to fight. We are them.
How’re we going to do it? JanieM pointed out that I am not a leader, too mean to be convincing to anyone here. You? Anybody?
And, in case it’s not obvious, I mean all this in a sense in a not party political way. At the moment the Trumpistas have captured the GOP and America, so it would have to be the Dems to try to begin the repair. But, for example, I imagine the Rs in the Lincoln Project would have many of the same essential aims, regarding rule of law, due process etc. I am talking about decent people versus crooks, traitors and corrupt thugs, not Ds versus Rs.
And, in case it’s not obvious, I mean all this in a sense in a not party political way. At the moment the Trumpistas have captured the GOP and America, so it would have to be the Dems to try to begin the repair. But, for example, I imagine the Rs in the Lincoln Project would have many of the same essential aims, regarding rule of law, due process etc. I am talking about decent people versus crooks, traitors and corrupt thugs, not Ds versus Rs.
I’m pretty sure russell has written no such thing.
russell can speak for himself, does so eloquently, and does so inspiringly.
It is, perhaps, my fault that I interpret his repeated calls for “we want different things” and maybe we aren’t one country, and maybe it would be much better if you go your way and I go mine, as a call to divide up.
I stand to be corrected.
But fuck, I can’t see how.
My father was a fighter pilot before, on, and after D-Day. He lost half of his colleagues. We fucking haven’t even tried.
I’m pretty sure russell has written no such thing.
russell can speak for himself, does so eloquently, and does so inspiringly.
It is, perhaps, my fault that I interpret his repeated calls for “we want different things” and maybe we aren’t one country, and maybe it would be much better if you go your way and I go mine, as a call to divide up.
I stand to be corrected.
But fuck, I can’t see how.
My father was a fighter pilot before, on, and after D-Day. He lost half of his colleagues. We fucking haven’t even tried.
Graphs updated to today.
Graphs updated to today.
I am talking about decent people versus crooks, traitors and corrupt thugs, not Ds versus Rs.y
Glad you’re finding words, finally. I would call them fascists, or maybe Nazis. Is it a shorthand. Maybe. Maybe not quite the last angel on the head of a pin. But pretty f’ing close.
Time to see them for what they are, and treat them accordingly. And hash out the semantics for 2030 when maybe (because there are no guarantees) we’ve fought hard, lost some battles, but finally won.
I am talking about decent people versus crooks, traitors and corrupt thugs, not Ds versus Rs.y
Glad you’re finding words, finally. I would call them fascists, or maybe Nazis. Is it a shorthand. Maybe. Maybe not quite the last angel on the head of a pin. But pretty f’ing close.
Time to see them for what they are, and treat them accordingly. And hash out the semantics for 2030 when maybe (because there are no guarantees) we’ve fought hard, lost some battles, but finally won.
You? Anybody?
I’m assuming this is meant for Americans. As I have said innumerable times in the past, sapient, more power to you in your continuing efforts to fight the good fight. But I am truly losing heart when I see how vast is the damage. Maybe I’ll feel less apocalyptic tomorrow, but right now it feels to me like Ozymandias.
You? Anybody?
I’m assuming this is meant for Americans. As I have said innumerable times in the past, sapient, more power to you in your continuing efforts to fight the good fight. But I am truly losing heart when I see how vast is the damage. Maybe I’ll feel less apocalyptic tomorrow, but right now it feels to me like Ozymandias.
I am not finding words, finally. I am using the words I have always used, just not the words you wanted me to use. Stop this, sapient. I am too heartsick for one of your ridiculous fights.
I am not finding words, finally. I am using the words I have always used, just not the words you wanted me to use. Stop this, sapient. I am too heartsick for one of your ridiculous fights.
As I have said innumerable times in the past, sapient, more power to you in your continuing efforts to fight the good fight. But I am truly losing heart when I see how vast is the damage.
Thanks. Losing heart, daily, is the zeitgeist. Means we have to woman up and fight. That means solidarity, speaking not with “my voice” but finding “our voice” and figuring out how to use it.
Do I know how? As everyone here has informed me, no. I’m urging you all to help figure it out.
As I have said innumerable times in the past, sapient, more power to you in your continuing efforts to fight the good fight. But I am truly losing heart when I see how vast is the damage.
Thanks. Losing heart, daily, is the zeitgeist. Means we have to woman up and fight. That means solidarity, speaking not with “my voice” but finding “our voice” and figuring out how to use it.
Do I know how? As everyone here has informed me, no. I’m urging you all to help figure it out.
It’s two thirty in the morning here, and I have been having this conversation on my phone in bed. I’m switching off, and hoping, like Scarlett O’Hara, that tomorrow is another day. Good night, all.
It’s two thirty in the morning here, and I have been having this conversation on my phone in bed. I’m switching off, and hoping, like Scarlett O’Hara, that tomorrow is another day. Good night, all.
I am too heartsick for one of your ridiculous fights.
I am not fighting with you. If so, the fights are not mine. Let’s do fight against the common enemy, and leave behind our heartsickness. We know what we love, and need to fight for it. It should do our hearts good to figure out what we hold in common, and a strategy to move forward. What we have lacked is a name for the enemy and a strategy to conquer them.
“Republican” sounds like Abraham Lincoln, but Republicans today are more like Mussolini or Hitler. So I’m fine with calling them words for what modern people think of as racist, anti-democratic strongmen.
Whatever better tools you have, go for it! As everyone here has pointed out, I have failed. But please do go for it. Don’t say, “Oh my! What a shame! Let’s me and our neighbors have a good day, and let the other folks fry!”
I am too heartsick for one of your ridiculous fights.
I am not fighting with you. If so, the fights are not mine. Let’s do fight against the common enemy, and leave behind our heartsickness. We know what we love, and need to fight for it. It should do our hearts good to figure out what we hold in common, and a strategy to move forward. What we have lacked is a name for the enemy and a strategy to conquer them.
“Republican” sounds like Abraham Lincoln, but Republicans today are more like Mussolini or Hitler. So I’m fine with calling them words for what modern people think of as racist, anti-democratic strongmen.
Whatever better tools you have, go for it! As everyone here has pointed out, I have failed. But please do go for it. Don’t say, “Oh my! What a shame! Let’s me and our neighbors have a good day, and let the other folks fry!”
russell can speak for himself
Then stop speaking for him.
russell can speak for himself
Then stop speaking for him.
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/5/7/1943358/-Republican-fraudsters-caught-on-audio-targeting-Dr-Fauci-with-fake-sexual-assault-claims
They will stop at nothing.
We need a Lincoln.
But first …..
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/5/7/1943358/-Republican-fraudsters-caught-on-audio-targeting-Dr-Fauci-with-fake-sexual-assault-claims
They will stop at nothing.
We need a Lincoln.
But first …..
Then stop speaking for him.
He can correct whatever I say that’s wrong. I invite him to do so. I implore him to do so.
Then stop speaking for him.
He can correct whatever I say that’s wrong. I invite him to do so. I implore him to do so.
russell is saying let’s all be different countries! Let’s all be United States Brexit! Let’s all be Putin’s dream!
Look, sapient, if you are going to misread russell that badly, I’m not sure that anything he can say will be understandable to you. I on the other hand, will explain this. If you don’t give it a rest, I’ll give you some time to think about it. I really don’t have time for your shit.
russell is saying let’s all be different countries! Let’s all be United States Brexit! Let’s all be Putin’s dream!
Look, sapient, if you are going to misread russell that badly, I’m not sure that anything he can say will be understandable to you. I on the other hand, will explain this. If you don’t give it a rest, I’ll give you some time to think about it. I really don’t have time for your shit.
When you go to war with those on your own side, sapient, you are perhaps reinforcing russell’s point.
When you go to war with those on your own side, sapient, you are perhaps reinforcing russell’s point.
Trump has been exposed to Covid-19 by his Navy pants presser.
He must quarantine for 14 days.
Will he pull a Rand Paul ( who should have been attacked physically for his life-threatening ideological allegiance to the virus’ freedom of movement and expression) and expose the entire White House staff and his corrupt family to the disease?
Will he permit the pandemic to sweep through the elite right wing republican population?
The downside for the country and the world is that they don’t contract the virus. The further downside is that they live through its ravages to emerge supervirally republican from the other side to continue their ruination of the country.
Will the Supreme Court be asked to confer personhood on the virus? Will deadly viruses be accorded all of the rights and privileges under the Constitution now reserved for corporations. Will deadly viruses, because they prey on and kill the poor and sick and the vulnerable among us be permitted to argue, with representation from unqualified Federalist society terrorists, that vaccination against viruses, even testing their human hosting for their presence, violates the originalist intentions of the Founders vis a vis viruses, the latter of which were permitted to run free throughout the human population when freedom really meant something for those who were considered the full five fifths of a citizen and a human being?
The law is an ass, as the assholes have now made it so across the board.
The lives of fetuses and viruses and corporations are now more important in the political, moral, and ethical spheres than the lives of any human citizen who is not conservative and republican.
In reality, however, fetuses take a very distant third place to viruses and corporations in the vermin conservative movement legal hierarchy, and they drop even below environmental pollutants for protection, once they have been born, roughly a nanosecond afterwards.
And all three are nearly, but still not quite, as important as massive tax cuts.
Trump has been exposed to Covid-19 by his Navy pants presser.
He must quarantine for 14 days.
Will he pull a Rand Paul ( who should have been attacked physically for his life-threatening ideological allegiance to the virus’ freedom of movement and expression) and expose the entire White House staff and his corrupt family to the disease?
Will he permit the pandemic to sweep through the elite right wing republican population?
The downside for the country and the world is that they don’t contract the virus. The further downside is that they live through its ravages to emerge supervirally republican from the other side to continue their ruination of the country.
Will the Supreme Court be asked to confer personhood on the virus? Will deadly viruses be accorded all of the rights and privileges under the Constitution now reserved for corporations. Will deadly viruses, because they prey on and kill the poor and sick and the vulnerable among us be permitted to argue, with representation from unqualified Federalist society terrorists, that vaccination against viruses, even testing their human hosting for their presence, violates the originalist intentions of the Founders vis a vis viruses, the latter of which were permitted to run free throughout the human population when freedom really meant something for those who were considered the full five fifths of a citizen and a human being?
The law is an ass, as the assholes have now made it so across the board.
The lives of fetuses and viruses and corporations are now more important in the political, moral, and ethical spheres than the lives of any human citizen who is not conservative and republican.
In reality, however, fetuses take a very distant third place to viruses and corporations in the vermin conservative movement legal hierarchy, and they drop even below environmental pollutants for protection, once they have been born, roughly a nanosecond afterwards.
And all three are nearly, but still not quite, as important as massive tax cuts.
I’m back, and possibly in a slightly less apocalyptic mood. I too may have misinterpreted russell when I said:
I guess in a way russell has been saying as much for a while. America is probably irrevocably broken.
In which case, apologies. These are very hard times. Let’s try not to turn on each other.
I’m back, and possibly in a slightly less apocalyptic mood. I too may have misinterpreted russell when I said:
I guess in a way russell has been saying as much for a while. America is probably irrevocably broken.
In which case, apologies. These are very hard times. Let’s try not to turn on each other.
fuck that. en garde!
fuck that. en garde!
William Barr:
“Well, history is written by the winners. So it largely depends on who’s writing the history.”
I’m writing history yet to be, and my writing sees Barr hanging by his dead neck from a poorly tied noose …. like Obama left no bullets for the military and no PPE for republican elites, trump will leave little sturdy rope in federal warehouses for us to dispose of the refuse, and they stole all of the meat hooks as well … in a public place, while citizens fling rotting vegetables at his corpse and jump up and down on his shattered glasses.
I’ll call that winning, as will the future better America, free of sadistic, corrupt republican rule.
William Barr:
“Well, history is written by the winners. So it largely depends on who’s writing the history.”
I’m writing history yet to be, and my writing sees Barr hanging by his dead neck from a poorly tied noose …. like Obama left no bullets for the military and no PPE for republican elites, trump will leave little sturdy rope in federal warehouses for us to dispose of the refuse, and they stole all of the meat hooks as well … in a public place, while citizens fling rotting vegetables at his corpse and jump up and down on his shattered glasses.
I’ll call that winning, as will the future better America, free of sadistic, corrupt republican rule.
as above, so below.
as above, so below.
FWIW
in the 2016 election, 136.7 million votes were cast. Clinton got 65,844,610. Trump got 62,979,636.
To this day, Trump has greater than 90% support among registered (R)’s. At least the ones that answer the question.
I’d love to think that Americans overwhelmingly support values that I think are important. There is no evidence of that. And no, “we all want the same things, we just see different ways of achieving them” doesn’t cut it. The ways of achieving the ends are an expression of the values themselves.
So if I want to be engaged in any political way with the society I live in, I’m obliged to account for that, and work with that.
I could, of course, try to persuade all of the people that do not share my values, to change their minds. That’s not gonna happen.
We could try to find enough middle ground to sort of muddle through. But that also doesn’t seem to be on offer. As far as I can tell, everybody’s dug in. Including People Like Me, to be honest. Because we all think we’re right, and right about fairly important things.
And so, the nation has become dysfunctional.
Personally, I’m tired of talking with people about things like is torture OK, and should we be separating immigrant kids from their parents, and are inheritance taxes really thievery, and is it a violation of people’s sacred inalienable rights to ask them to not meet in large groups during an epidemic.
I feel like I’m trying to have a conversation with utter moral idiots. I feel like people I know, and have known and respected, for decades in some cases, have been replaced by an army of replicant orcs.
I hope that captures the flavor of it.
So I’m just looking for simple, pragmatic, tactical ways to address all of this. Because what we have now is FUBAR, it just is. And a (D) POTUS, or even (D) majorities in both houses of Congress and a (D) POTUS, is not gonna change any of that at a fundamental level.
Because it’s what people – tens of millions of people – think and believe. That’s the problem.
I have no solution.
As an aside, it’s unclear to me what exactly it is you expect from me here. I’m just here to talk. Nothing any of us says here is going to transform the world in one way or another.
That can happen, it’s just not gonna happen in an ObWi thread.
So maybe assume that we’re all doing our best in our daily lives to advance the things we value, and don’t place too many expectations on discussions in a blog post.
FWIW
in the 2016 election, 136.7 million votes were cast. Clinton got 65,844,610. Trump got 62,979,636.
To this day, Trump has greater than 90% support among registered (R)’s. At least the ones that answer the question.
I’d love to think that Americans overwhelmingly support values that I think are important. There is no evidence of that. And no, “we all want the same things, we just see different ways of achieving them” doesn’t cut it. The ways of achieving the ends are an expression of the values themselves.
So if I want to be engaged in any political way with the society I live in, I’m obliged to account for that, and work with that.
I could, of course, try to persuade all of the people that do not share my values, to change their minds. That’s not gonna happen.
We could try to find enough middle ground to sort of muddle through. But that also doesn’t seem to be on offer. As far as I can tell, everybody’s dug in. Including People Like Me, to be honest. Because we all think we’re right, and right about fairly important things.
And so, the nation has become dysfunctional.
Personally, I’m tired of talking with people about things like is torture OK, and should we be separating immigrant kids from their parents, and are inheritance taxes really thievery, and is it a violation of people’s sacred inalienable rights to ask them to not meet in large groups during an epidemic.
I feel like I’m trying to have a conversation with utter moral idiots. I feel like people I know, and have known and respected, for decades in some cases, have been replaced by an army of replicant orcs.
I hope that captures the flavor of it.
So I’m just looking for simple, pragmatic, tactical ways to address all of this. Because what we have now is FUBAR, it just is. And a (D) POTUS, or even (D) majorities in both houses of Congress and a (D) POTUS, is not gonna change any of that at a fundamental level.
Because it’s what people – tens of millions of people – think and believe. That’s the problem.
I have no solution.
As an aside, it’s unclear to me what exactly it is you expect from me here. I’m just here to talk. Nothing any of us says here is going to transform the world in one way or another.
That can happen, it’s just not gonna happen in an ObWi thread.
So maybe assume that we’re all doing our best in our daily lives to advance the things we value, and don’t place too many expectations on discussions in a blog post.
I feel like I’m trying to have a conversation with utter moral idiots. I feel like people I know, and have known and respected, for decades in some cases, have been replaced by an army of replicant orcs.
I hope that captures the flavor of it.
…
Nothing any of us says here is going to transform the world in one way or another.
That can happen, it’s just not gonna happen in an ObWi thread.
Quoting the whole comment would be silly, saying “wrs” would be repetitive, so I’m going for my favorite snippets of eloquent sanity. Nice to wake up to something like this in the midst of all the doom and frustration of the headlines.
I feel like I’m trying to have a conversation with utter moral idiots. I feel like people I know, and have known and respected, for decades in some cases, have been replaced by an army of replicant orcs.
I hope that captures the flavor of it.
…
Nothing any of us says here is going to transform the world in one way or another.
That can happen, it’s just not gonna happen in an ObWi thread.
Quoting the whole comment would be silly, saying “wrs” would be repetitive, so I’m going for my favorite snippets of eloquent sanity. Nice to wake up to something like this in the midst of all the doom and frustration of the headlines.
Very true and sane, Janie and russell, and an excellent corrective. But on the other hand:
fuck that. en garde!
at least made me laugh.
Very true and sane, Janie and russell, and an excellent corrective. But on the other hand:
fuck that. en garde!
at least made me laugh.
As an aside, it’s unclear to me what exactly it is you expect from me here. I’m just here to talk. Nothing any of us says here is going to transform the world in one way or another.
My expectation is just that you’ll be here. I value the conversation, your thoughtfulness and perspective immensely, but I don’t think that we need to declare defeat. Sorry to have mischaracterized your suggestions for reorganizing the states. I believe that disunity is destructive to too many people.
These are very hard times. Let’s try not to turn on each other.
Yes. I’m sorry.
in the 2016 election, 136.7 million votes were cast. Clinton got 65,844,610. Trump got 62,979,636.
About 43% of eligible voters didn’t vote. Many eligible voters were disenfranchised. Many people are ineligible because they’ve been disenfranchised. Many people refused to vote for Clinton for reasons that were discussed here, seemingly having little to do with support for Trump’s values.
An unprecedented effort was made to spread disinformation during 2016. It worked. It’s true that no matter what happens in the coming election, there will still be “an army of replicant orcs”. But they have always been with us, and nothing we do will completely get rid of them. We just have to figure out how to remove their power. Giving up on the states where they currently hold sway doesn’t seem the way to do that. We’re not going to persuade them, but we can keep working to outnumber them by empowering the disenfranchised. It’s not going to happen overnight, and it won’t happen without a lot of ugliness along the way. I still have hope that it will happen.
lj is right – I need a break, and will try to be out of here for awhile.
Thanks.
As an aside, it’s unclear to me what exactly it is you expect from me here. I’m just here to talk. Nothing any of us says here is going to transform the world in one way or another.
My expectation is just that you’ll be here. I value the conversation, your thoughtfulness and perspective immensely, but I don’t think that we need to declare defeat. Sorry to have mischaracterized your suggestions for reorganizing the states. I believe that disunity is destructive to too many people.
These are very hard times. Let’s try not to turn on each other.
Yes. I’m sorry.
in the 2016 election, 136.7 million votes were cast. Clinton got 65,844,610. Trump got 62,979,636.
About 43% of eligible voters didn’t vote. Many eligible voters were disenfranchised. Many people are ineligible because they’ve been disenfranchised. Many people refused to vote for Clinton for reasons that were discussed here, seemingly having little to do with support for Trump’s values.
An unprecedented effort was made to spread disinformation during 2016. It worked. It’s true that no matter what happens in the coming election, there will still be “an army of replicant orcs”. But they have always been with us, and nothing we do will completely get rid of them. We just have to figure out how to remove their power. Giving up on the states where they currently hold sway doesn’t seem the way to do that. We’re not going to persuade them, but we can keep working to outnumber them by empowering the disenfranchised. It’s not going to happen overnight, and it won’t happen without a lot of ugliness along the way. I still have hope that it will happen.
lj is right – I need a break, and will try to be out of here for awhile.
Thanks.
I’d add:
…and don’t place too many expectations on discussions in a blog post.
which I know is just an extension of it’s just not gonna happen in an ObWi thread, but it resonates with me. This is the online equivalent of people sitting around talking at a party or something. We aren’t remaking the world.
I’d add:
…and don’t place too many expectations on discussions in a blog post.
which I know is just an extension of it’s just not gonna happen in an ObWi thread, but it resonates with me. This is the online equivalent of people sitting around talking at a party or something. We aren’t remaking the world.
“There is no daylight between the NRSC and President Trump.”
I’m gratified to learn that the hacking away at the administrative state, as Bannon mandates, is being followed to the T by the entire diabolical Republican edifice.
Streamlining the process so that those who must be liquidated, every one of them, sign their OWN death warrants, without jumping through the arduous, but normative, duplicative and bureaucratic, deep state paperwork and processes will hasten their horrific ends.
It’s at once so Soviet and Republican of them.
“replaced by an army of replicant orcs”
I suspect it’s too late.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AocjvWQVi0A
“There is no daylight between the NRSC and President Trump.”
I’m gratified to learn that the hacking away at the administrative state, as Bannon mandates, is being followed to the T by the entire diabolical Republican edifice.
Streamlining the process so that those who must be liquidated, every one of them, sign their OWN death warrants, without jumping through the arduous, but normative, duplicative and bureaucratic, deep state paperwork and processes will hasten their horrific ends.
It’s at once so Soviet and Republican of them.
“replaced by an army of replicant orcs”
I suspect it’s too late.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AocjvWQVi0A
Sorry, but rule of law is now a joke.
If one reads TPM as the truth, then yes. I’m not going to assume you haven’t read the motion and the recently released evidence (and the evidence released in the past). And I have not read it all. But what I have read leads me to the opposite conclusion and the opposite of what Comey and Nadler and Schiff are spouting now. The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival, plain and simple. Do the ends of taking down a duly-elected president justify the means simply because that president is Trump? YMMV.
Sorry, but rule of law is now a joke.
If one reads TPM as the truth, then yes. I’m not going to assume you haven’t read the motion and the recently released evidence (and the evidence released in the past). And I have not read it all. But what I have read leads me to the opposite conclusion and the opposite of what Comey and Nadler and Schiff are spouting now. The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival, plain and simple. Do the ends of taking down a duly-elected president justify the means simply because that president is Trump? YMMV.
@russell, I can’t disagree with anything you said. About this:
As far as I can tell, everybody’s dug in. Including People Like Me, to be honest. Because we all think we’re right, and right about fairly important things.
I would add that everyone’s dug in because they think they can win, in the sense of convincing (or to be discouraging, read as forcing their opinions on) the other side(s). Tennessee thinks they can force their beliefs about guns on New York. New York thinks they can force their beliefs about LGBT people on Tennessee. As a point of clarification, when I say “beliefs” and name a state, I mean the majority positions held in the state legislatures.
Where things get dicey is when state legislatures (and Congressional delegations) decide that they can’t win, but they can avoid losing. I often think that the US Supreme Court is headed in that direction. Not, for example, to enforce racial discrimination in voting on a national basis, but rather to allow individual states to do so.
@russell, I can’t disagree with anything you said. About this:
As far as I can tell, everybody’s dug in. Including People Like Me, to be honest. Because we all think we’re right, and right about fairly important things.
I would add that everyone’s dug in because they think they can win, in the sense of convincing (or to be discouraging, read as forcing their opinions on) the other side(s). Tennessee thinks they can force their beliefs about guns on New York. New York thinks they can force their beliefs about LGBT people on Tennessee. As a point of clarification, when I say “beliefs” and name a state, I mean the majority positions held in the state legislatures.
Where things get dicey is when state legislatures (and Congressional delegations) decide that they can’t win, but they can avoid losing. I often think that the US Supreme Court is headed in that direction. Not, for example, to enforce racial discrimination in voting on a national basis, but rather to allow individual states to do so.
GftNC: These are very hard times. Let’s try not to turn on each other.
cleek: fuck that. en garde!
Well as long as you’re playing by civilized (elitist) rules when we, OK. Just so we don’t start rolling in the mud.
GftNC: These are very hard times. Let’s try not to turn on each other.
cleek: fuck that. en garde!
Well as long as you’re playing by civilized (elitist) rules when we, OK. Just so we don’t start rolling in the mud.
To this day, Trump has greater than 90% support among registered (R)’s.
A depressingly, and appallingly, large fraction of Republicans actually agree with Trump. Or, worse**, just worship his every word.
But I suspect, or maybe that’s desperately hope, that a larger percentage is merely blindly partisan. Which is to say, if the next Republican leader is wildly different, they’ll then support those positions instead. That is, certainly, worrisome as well. But on balance, gives more hope for the country that if they actually believed in his bullsh*t positions on their own “merits”.
** Albeit probably necessary, considering how often Trump disagrees with Trump from one day (or hour) to the next.
To this day, Trump has greater than 90% support among registered (R)’s.
A depressingly, and appallingly, large fraction of Republicans actually agree with Trump. Or, worse**, just worship his every word.
But I suspect, or maybe that’s desperately hope, that a larger percentage is merely blindly partisan. Which is to say, if the next Republican leader is wildly different, they’ll then support those positions instead. That is, certainly, worrisome as well. But on balance, gives more hope for the country that if they actually believed in his bullsh*t positions on their own “merits”.
** Albeit probably necessary, considering how often Trump disagrees with Trump from one day (or hour) to the next.
The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival, plain and simple.
yes, and Flynn got caught. Trump too.
not our problem if you’re ok with that.
The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival, plain and simple.
yes, and Flynn got caught. Trump too.
not our problem if you’re ok with that.
Flynn plead guilty.
I once did too, to a DUI, although my attorney claimed he could get me off.
I was guilty. And he could have gotten me off, I expect.
When I hear the words “plain and simple”, I hear bullshit being “spouted”.
If you read the motion “as truth” ….
So you believe what government sez is true. Is this the deep government or the shallow government you believe?
Next week, you’ll be back on the theme that government lies about everything and can’t be trusted to tell the truth, as an absolute.
If you think anything is plain and simple, you are simple.
But, bc, you believe you are right.
I believe I am right.
I see no middle ground except war.
Flynn plead guilty.
I once did too, to a DUI, although my attorney claimed he could get me off.
I was guilty. And he could have gotten me off, I expect.
When I hear the words “plain and simple”, I hear bullshit being “spouted”.
If you read the motion “as truth” ….
So you believe what government sez is true. Is this the deep government or the shallow government you believe?
Next week, you’ll be back on the theme that government lies about everything and can’t be trusted to tell the truth, as an absolute.
If you think anything is plain and simple, you are simple.
But, bc, you believe you are right.
I believe I am right.
I see no middle ground except war.
Reality bites (back).
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/08/vice-president-mike-pence-staffer-tests-positive-for-coronavirus.html
Reality bites (back).
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/08/vice-president-mike-pence-staffer-tests-positive-for-coronavirus.html
what I have read leads me to the opposite conclusion and the opposite of what Comey and Nadler and Schiff are spouting now. The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival, plain and simple.
bc, ask yourself this: If Flynn did nothing wrong, why did he lie about it?
IANAL, but even I know that lying under oath is illegal. Definitely not something one should do . . . unless you know, not just suspect but know, that what you did (and would be lying to claim you didn’t do) was a bigger crime.**
** And if there’s any question in your mind on that, that’s why you have high-priced lawyers: to be sure that is the case.
what I have read leads me to the opposite conclusion and the opposite of what Comey and Nadler and Schiff are spouting now. The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival, plain and simple.
bc, ask yourself this: If Flynn did nothing wrong, why did he lie about it?
IANAL, but even I know that lying under oath is illegal. Definitely not something one should do . . . unless you know, not just suspect but know, that what you did (and would be lying to claim you didn’t do) was a bigger crime.**
** And if there’s any question in your mind on that, that’s why you have high-priced lawyers: to be sure that is the case.
The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival
Still laughing as I question whose rival Flynn was. (I know this is not what bc meant. But still, his/her comment would have to imply that the only reason for going after Flynn was to get Trump. Which is an interesting take on the facts of what Flynn said and did, and pleaded guilty to.) And Mueller and Comey, those lifelong Republicans (until Trump), which political rival were they trying to take down? You really couldn’t make it up. Still, it’s better to laugh than cry.
The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival
Still laughing as I question whose rival Flynn was. (I know this is not what bc meant. But still, his/her comment would have to imply that the only reason for going after Flynn was to get Trump. Which is an interesting take on the facts of what Flynn said and did, and pleaded guilty to.) And Mueller and Comey, those lifelong Republicans (until Trump), which political rival were they trying to take down? You really couldn’t make it up. Still, it’s better to laugh than cry.
yes, and Flynn got caught. Trump too.
not our problem if you’re ok with that.
Alas, alas, alas, it is our problem. bc is one of those people I was talking about who is just fine with the degradation of American institutions.
yes, and Flynn got caught. Trump too.
not our problem if you’re ok with that.
Alas, alas, alas, it is our problem. bc is one of those people I was talking about who is just fine with the degradation of American institutions.
“If Flynn did nothing wrong, why did he lie about it?”
There is no lodestar truth, nor are there facts, nor are there lies, nor are there untruths, falsehoods, and bullshit in Trump’s world, of which Flynn is a feature.
It’s a fake reality they have made up. All of it useful from one moment to the next, whatever crap at hand that works to own their enemies.
It makes fools of all of us, of all law, of all scientific endeavor, of all rational thinking, of all whistle blowing, of all appearances to the contrary, despite Reason Magazine’s thinking dunce cap.
When trump and his crowd look at the stars they don’t see the useful made up shit we see, which normal people know is provisional and subject to variance according to our relative location in the universe and despite the fact that we rely on the north star for navigation, the big dippers, little dippers, Beranice’s hair, charioteers, etc … they see their absolute images reflected back at them and that is their only “truth”.
Their interests.
Not ours.
Certainly no objective truth.
Maybe they see a guy drinking bleach in the heavens.
God drinks bleach, doesn’t he?
“If Flynn did nothing wrong, why did he lie about it?”
There is no lodestar truth, nor are there facts, nor are there lies, nor are there untruths, falsehoods, and bullshit in Trump’s world, of which Flynn is a feature.
It’s a fake reality they have made up. All of it useful from one moment to the next, whatever crap at hand that works to own their enemies.
It makes fools of all of us, of all law, of all scientific endeavor, of all rational thinking, of all whistle blowing, of all appearances to the contrary, despite Reason Magazine’s thinking dunce cap.
When trump and his crowd look at the stars they don’t see the useful made up shit we see, which normal people know is provisional and subject to variance according to our relative location in the universe and despite the fact that we rely on the north star for navigation, the big dippers, little dippers, Beranice’s hair, charioteers, etc … they see their absolute images reflected back at them and that is their only “truth”.
Their interests.
Not ours.
Certainly no objective truth.
Maybe they see a guy drinking bleach in the heavens.
God drinks bleach, doesn’t he?
IANAL, but even I know that lying under oath is illegal.
I think Flynn was guilty of lying to the FBI, not for lying under oath.
“It’s right to be deeply critical of federal statutes criminalizing lying to federal agents. It’s right to be deeply critical of the archaic Logan Act being brought up against Flynn to try to punish political speech. But there’s no sign that this is anything but a special deal for Flynn, and the Justice Department is bending over backward to justify it. Calls for changes to federal laws? None to be seen here. The FBI will continue to attempt to trap others in lies and prosecute them.”
Justice Department Moves To Dismiss Charges Against Michael Flynn: Feds now say the national security advisor’s lie wasn’t “material” and they cannot prove it.
IANAL, but even I know that lying under oath is illegal.
I think Flynn was guilty of lying to the FBI, not for lying under oath.
“It’s right to be deeply critical of federal statutes criminalizing lying to federal agents. It’s right to be deeply critical of the archaic Logan Act being brought up against Flynn to try to punish political speech. But there’s no sign that this is anything but a special deal for Flynn, and the Justice Department is bending over backward to justify it. Calls for changes to federal laws? None to be seen here. The FBI will continue to attempt to trap others in lies and prosecute them.”
Justice Department Moves To Dismiss Charges Against Michael Flynn: Feds now say the national security advisor’s lie wasn’t “material” and they cannot prove it.
The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival
I bet the utterly evil Clintons got a good laugh reading that.
The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival
I bet the utterly evil Clintons got a good laugh reading that.
Geez, Pence breathed on those doctors at the Mayo Clinic.
Trump fucking breathed on a masked American AND on the fucking masks the guy was manufacturing right there in front of him.
May that guy maybe borrow just one of the Covid-19 tests Trump is protected with daily to use for himself so he knows whether or not to quarantine himself to protect his loved ones?
Please, assholes? Pretty please, cocksuckers?
Or do I need a fucking gun to get the test for the guy?
Are we tracking the pregnant woman who bought that mask Trump contaminated and is this moment putting it on her face, not that Pence and Trump ever gave a second’s thought about a fetus besides as a weapon to hit liberals over the head with.
Yeah, but Flynn was framed.
It’s all very, very, beautifully, winningly plain and simple.
Geez, Pence breathed on those doctors at the Mayo Clinic.
Trump fucking breathed on a masked American AND on the fucking masks the guy was manufacturing right there in front of him.
May that guy maybe borrow just one of the Covid-19 tests Trump is protected with daily to use for himself so he knows whether or not to quarantine himself to protect his loved ones?
Please, assholes? Pretty please, cocksuckers?
Or do I need a fucking gun to get the test for the guy?
Are we tracking the pregnant woman who bought that mask Trump contaminated and is this moment putting it on her face, not that Pence and Trump ever gave a second’s thought about a fetus besides as a weapon to hit liberals over the head with.
Yeah, but Flynn was framed.
It’s all very, very, beautifully, winningly plain and simple.
I think Flynn was guilty of lying to the FBI, not for lying under oath.
Ah, so a felony violation Section 1001 of Title 18 of the United States Code (or 18 U.S.C. § 1001), rather than Perjury (18 U.S. Code § 1621).
I think Flynn was guilty of lying to the FBI, not for lying under oath.
Ah, so a felony violation Section 1001 of Title 18 of the United States Code (or 18 U.S.C. § 1001), rather than Perjury (18 U.S. Code § 1621).
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/pompeo-never-mind-maybe-covid-didnt-come-from-chinese-lab-after-all
See, from day to day, from minute to minute, whatever bullshit they think works in bringing us closer to the republican rapture.
I’m not denying it’s a brilliant strategy.
It’s working and will work until they are dead.
Flood the zone with shit.
See bc’s post above for the latest.
bc, are you deep state?
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/pompeo-never-mind-maybe-covid-didnt-come-from-chinese-lab-after-all
See, from day to day, from minute to minute, whatever bullshit they think works in bringing us closer to the republican rapture.
I’m not denying it’s a brilliant strategy.
It’s working and will work until they are dead.
Flood the zone with shit.
See bc’s post above for the latest.
bc, are you deep state?
Or, do you just represent the lollipop kids, the lollipop kids, the lollipop kids.
The only oath republicans take to is to fuck the liberals and the blacks and the immigrants and the gays.
Or, do you just represent the lollipop kids, the lollipop kids, the lollipop kids.
The only oath republicans take to is to fuck the liberals and the blacks and the immigrants and the gays.
I think Flynn was guilty of lying to the FBI, not for lying under oath.
General officers are also required to inform DoD if they get paid by foreign governments, businesses, or individuals for a few years after retirement. Flynn was paid, and didn’t report it. IIRC, the whole investigation was started after someone notified DoD Flynn was probably in violation of that reg. In theory, that should have cost him something in terms of retired rank and pension. DoD blew that off once he plead guilty to something worse. I wonder if the Army is going to come after him now?
I think Flynn was guilty of lying to the FBI, not for lying under oath.
General officers are also required to inform DoD if they get paid by foreign governments, businesses, or individuals for a few years after retirement. Flynn was paid, and didn’t report it. IIRC, the whole investigation was started after someone notified DoD Flynn was probably in violation of that reg. In theory, that should have cost him something in terms of retired rank and pension. DoD blew that off once he plead guilty to something worse. I wonder if the Army is going to come after him now?
The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival, plain and simple.
This strikes me as utter nuttery. However, I don’t think bc is an utter nut. I do not count him among the people who have been turned in a replicant orc.
So I’m kind of at a loss.
Here’s how it looks to me.
Flynn was working for Turkey, while he was participating in Trump’s campaign. As part of that, he had planned to grab someone living in the US and render that person to the Turkish government. For a cool million.
Right after Obama put sanctions in place against the Russians, Flynn was on the phone, repeatedly, with Kislyak. First he said they weren’t talking about sanctions, then it was well maybe the topic came up. And when asked about it by the FBI, he lied.
So, WTF.
If anyone can show me the way to connect the dots from “the rule of law was bent to take down a political rival” to “Flynn called the Russian ambassador immediately after sanctions were imposed, lied about it to the FBI, and oh yeah he and his kid were running a snatch-n-grab for Turkey on the side”, have at it.
Other than that, I have to conclude we are living in separate universes of fact.
I have no ill will toward bc or really much of anyone with extremely few exceptions. But I hardly know how to pursue conversations like this.
The rule of law was bent to take down a political rival, plain and simple.
This strikes me as utter nuttery. However, I don’t think bc is an utter nut. I do not count him among the people who have been turned in a replicant orc.
So I’m kind of at a loss.
Here’s how it looks to me.
Flynn was working for Turkey, while he was participating in Trump’s campaign. As part of that, he had planned to grab someone living in the US and render that person to the Turkish government. For a cool million.
Right after Obama put sanctions in place against the Russians, Flynn was on the phone, repeatedly, with Kislyak. First he said they weren’t talking about sanctions, then it was well maybe the topic came up. And when asked about it by the FBI, he lied.
So, WTF.
If anyone can show me the way to connect the dots from “the rule of law was bent to take down a political rival” to “Flynn called the Russian ambassador immediately after sanctions were imposed, lied about it to the FBI, and oh yeah he and his kid were running a snatch-n-grab for Turkey on the side”, have at it.
Other than that, I have to conclude we are living in separate universes of fact.
I have no ill will toward bc or really much of anyone with extremely few exceptions. But I hardly know how to pursue conversations like this.
bc believes deeply in the rule of law.
To bad for all of us that’s just Cleek’s Law.
bc believes deeply in the rule of law.
To bad for all of us that’s just Cleek’s Law.
But I hardly know how to pursue conversations like this.
If you can call it a “conversation.”
After your summary of the Flynn caper(s), cue some creative goalpost-moving, or some imaginative whataboutery, or some strawmanning, or some begging the question, or some of anything other than actually addressing the facts you’ve pointed out.
The whataboutery is probably the most wide-ranging option, but it isn’t so much bc’s kind of gambit as a certain Texas lawyer’s, in conversation with whom, in order for a word about Flynn’s transgressions to be allowed, you would first have to abase yourself and atone for any and all alleged transgressions of any of the “left”-leaning figments of said TX atty’s imagination from the entire history of the universe.
[Ooops, it’s Friday, maybe I should be more careful about whose name I invoke. References adjusted accordingly.]
But I hardly know how to pursue conversations like this.
If you can call it a “conversation.”
After your summary of the Flynn caper(s), cue some creative goalpost-moving, or some imaginative whataboutery, or some strawmanning, or some begging the question, or some of anything other than actually addressing the facts you’ve pointed out.
The whataboutery is probably the most wide-ranging option, but it isn’t so much bc’s kind of gambit as a certain Texas lawyer’s, in conversation with whom, in order for a word about Flynn’s transgressions to be allowed, you would first have to abase yourself and atone for any and all alleged transgressions of any of the “left”-leaning figments of said TX atty’s imagination from the entire history of the universe.
[Ooops, it’s Friday, maybe I should be more careful about whose name I invoke. References adjusted accordingly.]
have i told you all how much i love the Chinese government lately?
have i told you all how much i love the Chinese government lately?
And Genghis Khan, don’t forget about him!
And Genghis Khan, don’t forget about him!
What I think conservatives and (R)’s need to consider is that the president and everyone around him is, actually, profoundly corrupt.
That seems as obvious to me as the fact that the sun comes up in the morning and goes down at night.
He is a freaking crook. There is not an honest bone in his body. Hardly anyone I would say that about, but I’ll say it about him.
Crook. Liar, cheat, bully, crook.
I feel the need to draw a line in the sand, if only for my own sanity. We can talk about a lot of things, but I’m not interested in talking about “plots to overthrow a duly elected president”. The man is a fucking cancer on the nation, and any investigations that have been made into him, his campaign, his businesses, or what he ate for lunch, have been well earned. By him.
If you want to debate any of that, talk to somebody else. I’m not having it.
It’s time for conservatives and (R)’s of good will to demonstrate that and quit getting this guy’s back. Good intentions aren’t enough, and if you’re in it for the tax cuts, you can choke on them.
J’accuse. He’s your guy, and he’s pulling the nation down around the freaking black hole of his own corrupt ego.
Cut him loose, or there’s nothing else to talk about. With me, at least.
What I think conservatives and (R)’s need to consider is that the president and everyone around him is, actually, profoundly corrupt.
That seems as obvious to me as the fact that the sun comes up in the morning and goes down at night.
He is a freaking crook. There is not an honest bone in his body. Hardly anyone I would say that about, but I’ll say it about him.
Crook. Liar, cheat, bully, crook.
I feel the need to draw a line in the sand, if only for my own sanity. We can talk about a lot of things, but I’m not interested in talking about “plots to overthrow a duly elected president”. The man is a fucking cancer on the nation, and any investigations that have been made into him, his campaign, his businesses, or what he ate for lunch, have been well earned. By him.
If you want to debate any of that, talk to somebody else. I’m not having it.
It’s time for conservatives and (R)’s of good will to demonstrate that and quit getting this guy’s back. Good intentions aren’t enough, and if you’re in it for the tax cuts, you can choke on them.
J’accuse. He’s your guy, and he’s pulling the nation down around the freaking black hole of his own corrupt ego.
Cut him loose, or there’s nothing else to talk about. With me, at least.
on Tara Reade…
turns out she was charged with check fraud days before Biden’s office asked her to resign.
but she didn’t tell anyone that. she started telling everyone a very different story about why she had to find a new job. one that made her look like the victim, instead of a criminal.
and people weren’t denying her a new job because Joe Biden was covering up – people weren’t hiring her for govt work because she had just been charged with check fraud!
on Tara Reade…
turns out she was charged with check fraud days before Biden’s office asked her to resign.
but she didn’t tell anyone that. she started telling everyone a very different story about why she had to find a new job. one that made her look like the victim, instead of a criminal.
and people weren’t denying her a new job because Joe Biden was covering up – people weren’t hiring her for govt work because she had just been charged with check fraud!
Thanks, cleek – I just saw that information. Reade had a huge reason to lie, and then added new lies to buttress the first one.
Now she’s sticking to the accumulation of Big Lies. She might even believe them by this point.
But anyone else who does is showing their ass.
Following up on what russell said, it’s all corruption all the way down, with Trump and the GOP. There is nothing to any of them but corruption.
Thanks, cleek – I just saw that information. Reade had a huge reason to lie, and then added new lies to buttress the first one.
Now she’s sticking to the accumulation of Big Lies. She might even believe them by this point.
But anyone else who does is showing their ass.
Following up on what russell said, it’s all corruption all the way down, with Trump and the GOP. There is nothing to any of them but corruption.
i should add… “if this is verified”.
seems legit to me, but i’m not familiar with CA court dox or how things were numbered or recorded in 1993, anywhere, etc..
i should add… “if this is verified”.
seems legit to me, but i’m not familiar with CA court dox or how things were numbered or recorded in 1993, anywhere, etc..
Can’t find anything about this on any news sites I normally check. I’m guessing this needs to be treated with caution.
Can’t find anything about this on any news sites I normally check. I’m guessing this needs to be treated with caution.
Apparently, the covid-positive Pence staffer is Stephen Miller’s wife. I wonder if he’ll try to deport her.
Apparently, the covid-positive Pence staffer is Stephen Miller’s wife. I wonder if he’ll try to deport her.
From wikipedia about same:
Of course.
From wikipedia about same:
Of course.
I suppose it depends on whether contact tracing reveals that she got it from consorting with immigrants or other foreigners. Which would be far, far worse than merely acquiring a nasty (even if foreign) disease.
I suppose it depends on whether contact tracing reveals that she got it from consorting with immigrants or other foreigners. Which would be far, far worse than merely acquiring a nasty (even if foreign) disease.
My first reaction was: Someone actually married Stephen Miller?
Then I read the Wikipedia entried and remembered: people get married for all sorts of reasons. (Can you spell a-m-b-i-t-i-o-…..?)
Someone in a discussion/conflict work group I was once part of said, “I got married for the wrong reasons.” The group facilitator said, “Everyone gets married for the wrong reasons.”
Not sure I believe that, but not sure I believe there are any right reasons…well, not for marrying Stephen Miller, I guess, but for Stephen Miller as such.
My first reaction was: Someone actually married Stephen Miller?
Then I read the Wikipedia entried and remembered: people get married for all sorts of reasons. (Can you spell a-m-b-i-t-i-o-…..?)
Someone in a discussion/conflict work group I was once part of said, “I got married for the wrong reasons.” The group facilitator said, “Everyone gets married for the wrong reasons.”
Not sure I believe that, but not sure I believe there are any right reasons…well, not for marrying Stephen Miller, I guess, but for Stephen Miller as such.
I’ve said this before, but no thinking person can deny it now.
Trump is a fascist. As such, it is essential to his presidency to destroy democracy and all that has been decent about US governance.
Anyone supporting him is enabling that.
And for what, tax cuts? The tax cuts we said at the time were economically illiterate. We’ve been proven right much sooner that I expected, because the US government now needs to spread money, and it has been made riskier and more difficult by those tax cuts.
I’ve said this before, but no thinking person can deny it now.
Trump is a fascist. As such, it is essential to his presidency to destroy democracy and all that has been decent about US governance.
Anyone supporting him is enabling that.
And for what, tax cuts? The tax cuts we said at the time were economically illiterate. We’ve been proven right much sooner that I expected, because the US government now needs to spread money, and it has been made riskier and more difficult by those tax cuts.
Pro Bono – Occam’s Razor says, the people supporting Trump *want* a fascist state. That’s why they support him. Tax cuts and primitive-law judges are a side bonus.
Pro Bono – Occam’s Razor says, the people supporting Trump *want* a fascist state. That’s why they support him. Tax cuts and primitive-law judges are a side bonus.
Alternatively, some of them actually do want those tax cuts and incompetent judges. It’s not that they want a fascist state. It’s just that they don’t care whether the state is fascist or not — perhaps because they can’t imagine the downsides of such a state would ever be inflicted on them.
Alternatively, some of them actually do want those tax cuts and incompetent judges. It’s not that they want a fascist state. It’s just that they don’t care whether the state is fascist or not — perhaps because they can’t imagine the downsides of such a state would ever be inflicted on them.
When you adopt economic policies that shovel resources to a select few, you get outcomes that mock the very theory they so ferverently claim to believe in.
Fascism, capitalism….whatever. It’s all about having it all.
When you adopt economic policies that shovel resources to a select few, you get outcomes that mock the very theory they so ferverently claim to believe in.
Fascism, capitalism….whatever. It’s all about having it all.
Neoliberals are a sneaky and nefarious bunch since almost none of them will self identify as a neoliberal. Instead, like poltergeists, they create havoc in the world on which no one can put a face.
Neoliberals are a sneaky and nefarious bunch since almost none of them will self identify as a neoliberal. Instead, like poltergeists, they create havoc in the world on which no one can put a face.
Graphs updated to today.
Graphs updated to today.
I’m guessing this needs to be treated with caution.
Indeed. Stipulating that the record is genuine, it could be that Ms. Reade’s “check fraud” consisted of bouncing a check, and refusing or neglecting to enter a diversion program:
https://www.slocounty.ca.gov/Departments/District-Attorney/Special-Prosecutions/Services/Bad-Check-Program.aspx
The District Attorney will prosecute bad check writers who do not comply with the diversion program if the victim has followed proper procedure when accepting checks for goods or services.
Since its creation in 1989, the Bad Check Program has recovered over $11 million in restitution and fees.
Mr. Zachary from Vista goes on one hell of a flight of fancy in that thread before admitting that he has basically no information about the case.
Of course it is possible that the intersection of the sets of phony paper passers and sexual assault victims is non-empty.
I’m guessing this needs to be treated with caution.
Indeed. Stipulating that the record is genuine, it could be that Ms. Reade’s “check fraud” consisted of bouncing a check, and refusing or neglecting to enter a diversion program:
https://www.slocounty.ca.gov/Departments/District-Attorney/Special-Prosecutions/Services/Bad-Check-Program.aspx
The District Attorney will prosecute bad check writers who do not comply with the diversion program if the victim has followed proper procedure when accepting checks for goods or services.
Since its creation in 1989, the Bad Check Program has recovered over $11 million in restitution and fees.
Mr. Zachary from Vista goes on one hell of a flight of fancy in that thread before admitting that he has basically no information about the case.
Of course it is possible that the intersection of the sets of phony paper passers and sexual assault victims is non-empty.
Graphs updated to today.
Creeping down, painfully slowly, but down-ish.
May it continue.
Graphs updated to today.
Creeping down, painfully slowly, but down-ish.
May it continue.
I’m not sure what constitutes confirmation of Reade’s fraud record to folks here, but here is the latest from Twitter:
“@LukeRodriguez75 just heard back from SLO. I confirmed the person that replied to the emails works for the courthouse. She provided a document showing the case number matching the case number from the databases & date — 8/2/1993 — 3 days before she was terminated.”
I’m not sure what constitutes confirmation of Reade’s fraud record to folks here, but here is the latest from Twitter:
“@LukeRodriguez75 just heard back from SLO. I confirmed the person that replied to the emails works for the courthouse. She provided a document showing the case number matching the case number from the databases & date — 8/2/1993 — 3 days before she was terminated.”
…”SLO” being the Superior Court for the County of San Luis Obispo.
…”SLO” being the Superior Court for the County of San Luis Obispo.
folks here….
…are hardly a monolith.
Just sayin’.
folks here….
…are hardly a monolith.
Just sayin’.
Creeping down, painfully slowly, but down-ish.
May it continue.
Deo volente
But with some places opening up without adequate (or any) testing and tracing? Another spike, at least local ones, are the safe bet.
Creeping down, painfully slowly, but down-ish.
May it continue.
Deo volente
But with some places opening up without adequate (or any) testing and tracing? Another spike, at least local ones, are the safe bet.
Serious question: how is the fact dealt with that some states now actively suppress publication of case numbers? Is the number of cases really going down or is it mainly the number of publicly recognized cases?
(It seems, several officials (not just Jabbabonk)) have stated some or other variation of ‘less testing, fewer cases’ in order to ‘justify’ their opposition to wide-spread testing)
Serious question: how is the fact dealt with that some states now actively suppress publication of case numbers? Is the number of cases really going down or is it mainly the number of publicly recognized cases?
(It seems, several officials (not just Jabbabonk)) have stated some or other variation of ‘less testing, fewer cases’ in order to ‘justify’ their opposition to wide-spread testing)
That’s because tests may not be measuring any actual facts, according to you know who…
https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2020/05/quote-of-the-day-maybe-testing-isnt-so-great-after-all/
That’s because tests may not be measuring any actual facts, according to you know who…
https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2020/05/quote-of-the-day-maybe-testing-isnt-so-great-after-all/
I am aware of the reasons they do it but is the graph influenced by that deliberate data shortage? Or influence enough to turn a rising trend into a falling one?
I am aware of the reasons they do it but is the graph influenced by that deliberate data shortage? Or influence enough to turn a rising trend into a falling one?
Neoliberals are a sneaky and nefarious bunch since almost none of them will self identify as a neoliberal.
because the word has 85,000 different meanings, half of which are insults. using it in a non-pejorative way, these days, would be inviting confusion. easier to make up a new word.
Neoliberals are a sneaky and nefarious bunch since almost none of them will self identify as a neoliberal.
because the word has 85,000 different meanings, half of which are insults. using it in a non-pejorative way, these days, would be inviting confusion. easier to make up a new word.
Hartmut, sorry, I misread your question. I’ve got no idea, anyone else?
Hartmut, sorry, I misread your question. I’ve got no idea, anyone else?
“Neoliberals are a sneaky and nefarious bunch since almost none of them will self identify as a neoliberal. Instead, like poltergeists, they create havoc in the world on which no one can put a face.”
CharlesWT is trying to cross the beams.
Never cross the beams.
“Neoliberals are a sneaky and nefarious bunch since almost none of them will self identify as a neoliberal. Instead, like poltergeists, they create havoc in the world on which no one can put a face.”
CharlesWT is trying to cross the beams.
Never cross the beams.
Well, a lot of them claim they are libertarians, I suppose, though it is hard to tell if they are just faking it or they really believe they are libertarians…
Well, a lot of them claim they are libertarians, I suppose, though it is hard to tell if they are just faking it or they really believe they are libertarians…
Expect to hear much about fake Covid-19 test kits, fake positive test results, and fake death Covid death counts from the usual suspects as the campaign season launches into high gear this summer and into the fall.
Expect a barrage of rumored facts, factless rumors, and conspiracy theories floated by the same subhumans accusing blue state leaders, health departments, hospitals, and specific doctors who might have given some spare change to Democratic candidates of wildly inflating Covid case numbers and deaths while of course all of the parties are photo shopped having illicit sex in wet markets.
Expect the incidents now being reported of massive organ failures among the severely infected and seriously weird symptoms in infected young children to be targeted by the enormous and highly disciplined conservative gauleiter and worldwide disinformation apparatus churning out constantly, minute-by-minute zone flooding scripts of shit and transmitted instantly to the flummoxed numb public via the precision synchronized lying mouths of the trump republican juggernaut.
Regarding Reade, if she goes down in flames, the point is that doubt has been seeded regarding our ham sandwich, and besides the vote-stealing Trump Republican Party has a long queue of well-paid liars, desperate ideological losers, and conservative movement operatives in place to lock into Reade’s place in the conservative phalanx of bullshit artists, their surly mouths emitting scurrilous accusations …. women, girls, young boys, heck Biden will photo shopped in a Hong Kong hotel bedding two chink (I’m using republican Party technical language here from their style manual) chicks while some slant eye room service serves them sweet and sour pangolin on a bed of tender bat gut shopped from a wet market.
Murderous Republican operatives are just now conniving and putting into operation methods of infected Biden and other Democratic pols with the virus to hobble and even kill their candidacies, if not the candidates themselves.
The attempts will resemble the mysterious and lethal attacks on Russian ex-patriots in England and other countries. I can’t think why that would be.
Regarding Miller and his diseased bride, who was infected by a throw-pillow doused with Covid left in the anteroom to the Oval Office three and half years ago by Obama and Clinton operatives and used by Miller to mock smother his wife in their nightly BDSM rituals, which include viewing videos of naked Central American children being cuffed and raped in Trump’s detention centers, with of course laugh tracks which swell with hilarity as the dear couple climax together … pause … there are touching photos of Joseph Goebbels and his bride Magda with their many beautiful children available for viewing.
The two of them, as American, English, and Soviet troops converged on Nazi Germany at the bitter end, murdered their own children and then executed themselves. Their ashes were commingled with, among others, the ashes of Hitler’s beloved Christian dogs and later disposed of.
Of course, unlike Hitler, and Nixon for that matter, Trump is so self-enamoured that even a single spark of cross-species feeling, let alone a human relationship, is beneath his towering self regard.
As Genghis Khan, or was it Sammy Kahn … or James Caan, or maybe Madeline Kahn at the Cannes Movie Festival, is my witness, history will repeat itself.
Expect diversionary tactics drawing attention away from all of these events and on to the OBWI commentariat’s frailties and petty hypocrisies to surface here as representatives of the conservative Deep State assigned to foster and sow doubt, division, and suspicion among us do their thing.
Facts are funny things in America.
As in the scoring of the game of golf when playing against certain course champions and record holders at resorts around the globe, the lower the number of facts your competitors possess, the more they win.
Let’s not overvalue truth, people.
There is no proof in pig fucker republican America that the facts will out.
Expect to hear much about fake Covid-19 test kits, fake positive test results, and fake death Covid death counts from the usual suspects as the campaign season launches into high gear this summer and into the fall.
Expect a barrage of rumored facts, factless rumors, and conspiracy theories floated by the same subhumans accusing blue state leaders, health departments, hospitals, and specific doctors who might have given some spare change to Democratic candidates of wildly inflating Covid case numbers and deaths while of course all of the parties are photo shopped having illicit sex in wet markets.
Expect the incidents now being reported of massive organ failures among the severely infected and seriously weird symptoms in infected young children to be targeted by the enormous and highly disciplined conservative gauleiter and worldwide disinformation apparatus churning out constantly, minute-by-minute zone flooding scripts of shit and transmitted instantly to the flummoxed numb public via the precision synchronized lying mouths of the trump republican juggernaut.
Regarding Reade, if she goes down in flames, the point is that doubt has been seeded regarding our ham sandwich, and besides the vote-stealing Trump Republican Party has a long queue of well-paid liars, desperate ideological losers, and conservative movement operatives in place to lock into Reade’s place in the conservative phalanx of bullshit artists, their surly mouths emitting scurrilous accusations …. women, girls, young boys, heck Biden will photo shopped in a Hong Kong hotel bedding two chink (I’m using republican Party technical language here from their style manual) chicks while some slant eye room service serves them sweet and sour pangolin on a bed of tender bat gut shopped from a wet market.
Murderous Republican operatives are just now conniving and putting into operation methods of infected Biden and other Democratic pols with the virus to hobble and even kill their candidacies, if not the candidates themselves.
The attempts will resemble the mysterious and lethal attacks on Russian ex-patriots in England and other countries. I can’t think why that would be.
Regarding Miller and his diseased bride, who was infected by a throw-pillow doused with Covid left in the anteroom to the Oval Office three and half years ago by Obama and Clinton operatives and used by Miller to mock smother his wife in their nightly BDSM rituals, which include viewing videos of naked Central American children being cuffed and raped in Trump’s detention centers, with of course laugh tracks which swell with hilarity as the dear couple climax together … pause … there are touching photos of Joseph Goebbels and his bride Magda with their many beautiful children available for viewing.
The two of them, as American, English, and Soviet troops converged on Nazi Germany at the bitter end, murdered their own children and then executed themselves. Their ashes were commingled with, among others, the ashes of Hitler’s beloved Christian dogs and later disposed of.
Of course, unlike Hitler, and Nixon for that matter, Trump is so self-enamoured that even a single spark of cross-species feeling, let alone a human relationship, is beneath his towering self regard.
As Genghis Khan, or was it Sammy Kahn … or James Caan, or maybe Madeline Kahn at the Cannes Movie Festival, is my witness, history will repeat itself.
Expect diversionary tactics drawing attention away from all of these events and on to the OBWI commentariat’s frailties and petty hypocrisies to surface here as representatives of the conservative Deep State assigned to foster and sow doubt, division, and suspicion among us do their thing.
Facts are funny things in America.
As in the scoring of the game of golf when playing against certain course champions and record holders at resorts around the globe, the lower the number of facts your competitors possess, the more they win.
Let’s not overvalue truth, people.
There is no proof in pig fucker republican America that the facts will out.
When in a war against cruelty, be goddamned doubly cruel:
https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a32418915/coronavirus-pandemic-iowa-nebraska-conservatives-moral-chaos/
When in a war against cruelty, be goddamned doubly cruel:
https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a32418915/coronavirus-pandemic-iowa-nebraska-conservatives-moral-chaos/
I’m not sure what constitutes confirmation of Reade’s fraud record to folks here
I speak only for myself, but I’d want to see a lot more than some alleged screen grabs (I could make something that looked like that doc in a few minutes, and I don’t even have Photoshop) and an alleged “confirmation from SLO” published by anonymous Twitter and Reddit users (one of the latter of whom has removed the post).
Knowing what we know about the internet and human nature, some solid corroboration from a reputable news source or seven would be nice. Taking unverified factoids from anonymous internet entities and spinning them into huge edifices of speculation (as e.g. people whose comments I usually respect were doing at BJ last night) suggests wishful thinking fed by a dismaying (to me) level of gullibility.
And/or, what GftNC and Ufficio said.
I will be glad if Reade is unmasked as a serial liar, but as to the alleged check fraud, I’m reserving judgment until something more solid in the way of evidence turns up.
I’m not sure what constitutes confirmation of Reade’s fraud record to folks here
I speak only for myself, but I’d want to see a lot more than some alleged screen grabs (I could make something that looked like that doc in a few minutes, and I don’t even have Photoshop) and an alleged “confirmation from SLO” published by anonymous Twitter and Reddit users (one of the latter of whom has removed the post).
Knowing what we know about the internet and human nature, some solid corroboration from a reputable news source or seven would be nice. Taking unverified factoids from anonymous internet entities and spinning them into huge edifices of speculation (as e.g. people whose comments I usually respect were doing at BJ last night) suggests wishful thinking fed by a dismaying (to me) level of gullibility.
And/or, what GftNC and Ufficio said.
I will be glad if Reade is unmasked as a serial liar, but as to the alleged check fraud, I’m reserving judgment until something more solid in the way of evidence turns up.
And, for the perfect circle: what Janie said. Let’s not forget Dan Rather and Dubya. I’m sticking with that earlier comment piece from the NYT, even if Tara Reade is totally legit I support Biden for POTUS.
And, for the perfect circle: what Janie said. Let’s not forget Dan Rather and Dubya. I’m sticking with that earlier comment piece from the NYT, even if Tara Reade is totally legit I support Biden for POTUS.
The future is a foreign country without Little Richard. Gosh.
The future is a foreign country without Little Richard. Gosh.
What JanieM said about vetting by a reputable outlet.
Luke Rodriguez posted this:
https://twitter.com/LukeRodriguez75/status/1258859312648089600
So even if we’re taking “the latest from Twitter” as fact, what we know is that Tara Reade was charged with a misdemeanor, apparently for bouncing a check or two, in San Luis Obispo in August 1993.
That’s it.
What JanieM said about vetting by a reputable outlet.
Luke Rodriguez posted this:
https://twitter.com/LukeRodriguez75/status/1258859312648089600
So even if we’re taking “the latest from Twitter” as fact, what we know is that Tara Reade was charged with a misdemeanor, apparently for bouncing a check or two, in San Luis Obispo in August 1993.
That’s it.
Which are the states that are deliberately undercounting? I know that for a while Florida was only counting residents (eg, a visitor from Ohio would not have been included) but believe they gave that up. I know there are some states where the state health dept and the medical examiners/coroners are going around about whether “probable but not confirmed” deaths attributed to Covid-19 should be included. There’s some precedent on the not-confirmed stuff. Influenza deaths are greatly undercounted by states, and the annual actual number then estimated by the CDC from the low counts, because the states don’t report it as flu unless there’s a positive test result.
Which are the states that are deliberately undercounting? I know that for a while Florida was only counting residents (eg, a visitor from Ohio would not have been included) but believe they gave that up. I know there are some states where the state health dept and the medical examiners/coroners are going around about whether “probable but not confirmed” deaths attributed to Covid-19 should be included. There’s some precedent on the not-confirmed stuff. Influenza deaths are greatly undercounted by states, and the annual actual number then estimated by the CDC from the low counts, because the states don’t report it as flu unless there’s a positive test result.
New Brunswick: so near and yet so far.
New Brunswick: so near and yet so far.
Michael Cain, I ran across this and intended to post it here before seeing your comment. It makes a different point, but discusses the way flu deaths are estimated rather than simply counted.
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/comparing-covid-19-deaths-to-flu-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/
Michael Cain, I ran across this and intended to post it here before seeing your comment. It makes a different point, but discusses the way flu deaths are estimated rather than simply counted.
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/comparing-covid-19-deaths-to-flu-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/
Neoliberalism in the US has one meaning. In Europe it might get confused with the more hardline Hayekian 19th Century liberal— I get confused when people at Crooked Timber talk about it. Nowadays it is used by leftists in a pejorative way to describe liberals to their right, but there was never any mystery about what it meant, or rather, there was no mystery until it became seen as an insult. People used to embrace it. It describes the Third Way liberals who sprung up in the 80’s as a reaction to rightwing attacks on traditional liberali/ left in th US and Britain. Blair and Clinton had electoral success with this formula. Tom Friedman didn’t use the term, but in the 90’s he was a pretty fair representative of what neoliberalism was about.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/opinions/1982/09/05/a-neo-liberals-manifesto/21cf41ca-e60e-404e-9a66-124592c9f70d/
Neoliberalism in the US has one meaning. In Europe it might get confused with the more hardline Hayekian 19th Century liberal— I get confused when people at Crooked Timber talk about it. Nowadays it is used by leftists in a pejorative way to describe liberals to their right, but there was never any mystery about what it meant, or rather, there was no mystery until it became seen as an insult. People used to embrace it. It describes the Third Way liberals who sprung up in the 80’s as a reaction to rightwing attacks on traditional liberali/ left in th US and Britain. Blair and Clinton had electoral success with this formula. Tom Friedman didn’t use the term, but in the 90’s he was a pretty fair representative of what neoliberalism was about.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/opinions/1982/09/05/a-neo-liberals-manifesto/21cf41ca-e60e-404e-9a66-124592c9f70d/
Expect to hear much about fake Covid-19 test kits, fake positive test results, and fake death Covid death counts from the usual suspects as the campaign season launches into high gear this summer and into the fall.
And the first two of those three may well be TRUE. Think about it. Can you imagine that the grifter-in-chief and his buddies would pass up a chance to sell fake test kits? And even fake test processing? Sounds like something that would be right in their wheelhouse.
Expect to hear much about fake Covid-19 test kits, fake positive test results, and fake death Covid death counts from the usual suspects as the campaign season launches into high gear this summer and into the fall.
And the first two of those three may well be TRUE. Think about it. Can you imagine that the grifter-in-chief and his buddies would pass up a chance to sell fake test kits? And even fake test processing? Sounds like something that would be right in their wheelhouse.
More tales of the incredible ineptitude of the US’s covid-19 response.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/in-the-early-days-of-the-pandemic-the-us-government-turned-down-an-offer-to-manufacture-millions-of-n95-masks-in-america/2020/05/09/f76a821e-908a-11ea-a9c0-73b93422d691_story.html
Got that? The guys offers to reactivate 4 mask production lines. In January. But the government wasn’t interested. Those production lines still sit idle.
The company’s doing fine. It’s got plenty of orders to keep it’s active lines humming. This was an offer to reactivate old lines, even though it would be expensive. “My phones are ringing now, so I don’t ‘need’ government business. I’m just letting you know that I can help you preserve our infrastructure if things ever get really bad. I’m a patriot first, businessman second.” Too bad the folks around Trump don’t seem to be patriots first. Or even ever.
More tales of the incredible ineptitude of the US’s covid-19 response.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/in-the-early-days-of-the-pandemic-the-us-government-turned-down-an-offer-to-manufacture-millions-of-n95-masks-in-america/2020/05/09/f76a821e-908a-11ea-a9c0-73b93422d691_story.html
Got that? The guys offers to reactivate 4 mask production lines. In January. But the government wasn’t interested. Those production lines still sit idle.
The company’s doing fine. It’s got plenty of orders to keep it’s active lines humming. This was an offer to reactivate old lines, even though it would be expensive. “My phones are ringing now, so I don’t ‘need’ government business. I’m just letting you know that I can help you preserve our infrastructure if things ever get really bad. I’m a patriot first, businessman second.” Too bad the folks around Trump don’t seem to be patriots first. Or even ever.
Neoliberalism in the US has one meaning.
if only
there was never any mystery about what it meant, or rather, there was no mystery until it became seen as an insult.
and now it means whatever the user intends it to mean.
Neoliberalism in the US has one meaning.
if only
there was never any mystery about what it meant, or rather, there was no mystery until it became seen as an insult.
and now it means whatever the user intends it to mean.
yes, but what to do with the neo-assholes:
https://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2020/05/my-chest-is-aching-burns-like-a-furnace-the-burning-keeps-me-alive
Todd Starnes is hoping he doesn’t run into me, because he will be dealing with neo-Mike Tyson and neo-Joe Pesci.
He’ll need to put a call into gummint and beg them to intervene in his neo-Death, or at least remove his toaster oven from his neo-know-nothing butt.
yes, but what to do with the neo-assholes:
https://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2020/05/my-chest-is-aching-burns-like-a-furnace-the-burning-keeps-me-alive
Todd Starnes is hoping he doesn’t run into me, because he will be dealing with neo-Mike Tyson and neo-Joe Pesci.
He’ll need to put a call into gummint and beg them to intervene in his neo-Death, or at least remove his toaster oven from his neo-know-nothing butt.
New Brunswick sounds like a great place.
New Brunswick sounds like a great place.
Neoliberalism in the US has one meaning.
The problem is that the base term, liberalism, has gone thru the semantic ringer, so the addition of a three letter prefix isn’t going to magically fix that. That’s why you can have ‘neoliberalism’ (whatever that may mean) but you can’t attach neo to left. (left as an exercise for the reader, why is no one called a liberalist and why is there no leftism for people to believe in?)
Neoliberalism in the US has one meaning.
The problem is that the base term, liberalism, has gone thru the semantic ringer, so the addition of a three letter prefix isn’t going to magically fix that. That’s why you can have ‘neoliberalism’ (whatever that may mean) but you can’t attach neo to left. (left as an exercise for the reader, why is no one called a liberalist and why is there no leftism for people to believe in?)
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/trumps-favorite-tv-network-in-full-effect/
Merge the First and Second Amendments so that we can answer these filth with sentences made of bullets.
Is it genocide to kill conservative genocidal maniacs attempting to murder Americans.
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/trumps-favorite-tv-network-in-full-effect/
Merge the First and Second Amendments so that we can answer these filth with sentences made of bullets.
Is it genocide to kill conservative genocidal maniacs attempting to murder Americans.
Last summer, the family and I drove to Ohio to spend the 4th of July weekend with my wife’s aunt and uncle just outside of Cleveland. My wife’s uncle is a regular consumer of Fox News and OAN. I don’t think I even know what OAN was at the time. I was impressed! They made Fox look like a normal news network, and that’s no small feat.
They had a party the one night we were there, and my wife’s cousin and I got into a conversation about how bizarre OAN was. Watching it is like tripping without needing to take acid. It’s a bad trip, though, so not something I recommend.
Last summer, the family and I drove to Ohio to spend the 4th of July weekend with my wife’s aunt and uncle just outside of Cleveland. My wife’s uncle is a regular consumer of Fox News and OAN. I don’t think I even know what OAN was at the time. I was impressed! They made Fox look like a normal news network, and that’s no small feat.
They had a party the one night we were there, and my wife’s cousin and I got into a conversation about how bizarre OAN was. Watching it is like tripping without needing to take acid. It’s a bad trip, though, so not something I recommend.
That OAN stuff is mindblowing (after looking at JT’s link). There is nothing else to say. Except, if I was still feeling as apocalyptic as the other night: those whom the gods seek to destroy they first make mad.
That OAN stuff is mindblowing (after looking at JT’s link). There is nothing else to say. Except, if I was still feeling as apocalyptic as the other night: those whom the gods seek to destroy they first make mad.
If OAN is pushing hydroxychlorquine over remdesvir, they may be a self-solving problem. Enough people ODing on the former will definitely qualify as “evolution** in action.”
** Which, I’m betting, they don’t believe in. So they can hardly complain….
If OAN is pushing hydroxychlorquine over remdesvir, they may be a self-solving problem. Enough people ODing on the former will definitely qualify as “evolution** in action.”
** Which, I’m betting, they don’t believe in. So they can hardly complain….
Federal judge rules that governor’s banning of in-person church services does not violate 1A.
If only we had equally sane 2A jurisprudence….
Federal judge rules that governor’s banning of in-person church services does not violate 1A.
If only we had equally sane 2A jurisprudence….
By the way, forgot to mention and am now on phone, but saw a clip of Geraldo being interviewed on Fox re Flynn: it was almost word for word what bc was saying, with everybody nodding their heads in sage agreement. Separate realities is exactly right.
By the way, forgot to mention and am now on phone, but saw a clip of Geraldo being interviewed on Fox re Flynn: it was almost word for word what bc was saying, with everybody nodding their heads in sage agreement. Separate realities is exactly right.
Lawfare on Flynn.
I don’t really have legal chops. They do. Argue with them.
The (R) organization at this point is about seizing and holding power. They are not interested in finding middle ground, they are not interested in compromise, they are not interested in the rule of law, they are not interested in constitutional republican self-governance. They are interested in seizing and holding power.
Conservatives need to walk away from Trump, from Barr, from Flynn, from McConnell. Stop defending them, stop excusing their actions. Cut them loose and walk away.
This administration is destroying the country. If we want to talk about matters of public interest, that has to be stipulated as a freaking given. And then we can proceed from there.
The last 3 1/2 years have been one outrage, one obscenity, one national embarrassment after another.
Enough of this.
Trump’s campaign was up to its ass in co-ordination with Russia. Trump absolutely attempted to extort the Ukraine government into publicly announcing investigations into Biden to dirty him up for 2020. Trump and his family are absolutely exploiting his position to enrich themselves, hand over fist. And Trump absolutely dropped the ball on COVID, and a lot of people are going to get sick and die as a result.
These things are not even worth discussing, they’re like discussing whether or not the Gambino family businesses were on the up and up. So I’m not interested in debating them.
I’m interested in discussing what we do with this god-awful trainwreck that 3 1/2 years and counting for Trump et al has foisted upon the country.
If everyone wants to talk about constructive things, let’s talk about constructive things. Arguing about whether Trump and his crew are a bunch of freaking crooks, running the nation as a freaking corrupt enterprise, is not only not constructive, it doesn’t even merit discussion.
Lawfare on Flynn.
I don’t really have legal chops. They do. Argue with them.
The (R) organization at this point is about seizing and holding power. They are not interested in finding middle ground, they are not interested in compromise, they are not interested in the rule of law, they are not interested in constitutional republican self-governance. They are interested in seizing and holding power.
Conservatives need to walk away from Trump, from Barr, from Flynn, from McConnell. Stop defending them, stop excusing their actions. Cut them loose and walk away.
This administration is destroying the country. If we want to talk about matters of public interest, that has to be stipulated as a freaking given. And then we can proceed from there.
The last 3 1/2 years have been one outrage, one obscenity, one national embarrassment after another.
Enough of this.
Trump’s campaign was up to its ass in co-ordination with Russia. Trump absolutely attempted to extort the Ukraine government into publicly announcing investigations into Biden to dirty him up for 2020. Trump and his family are absolutely exploiting his position to enrich themselves, hand over fist. And Trump absolutely dropped the ball on COVID, and a lot of people are going to get sick and die as a result.
These things are not even worth discussing, they’re like discussing whether or not the Gambino family businesses were on the up and up. So I’m not interested in debating them.
I’m interested in discussing what we do with this god-awful trainwreck that 3 1/2 years and counting for Trump et al has foisted upon the country.
If everyone wants to talk about constructive things, let’s talk about constructive things. Arguing about whether Trump and his crew are a bunch of freaking crooks, running the nation as a freaking corrupt enterprise, is not only not constructive, it doesn’t even merit discussion.
wrs, but:
Having the Gambino crime family in charge of the presidency would likely be an improvement over the Trump crime family, just saying.
wrs, but:
Having the Gambino crime family in charge of the presidency would likely be an improvement over the Trump crime family, just saying.
Graphs updated to today.
Also, wrs.
Graphs updated to today.
Also, wrs.
wrs
I was interested to see that the judge in the Flynn case does NOT have to accept this latest DoJ motion. He can tell them that they’re talikg out their *ss, or just ignore them, and sentence Flynn anyway. I dare to hope that he’ll do exactly that.
Of course, Trump will rail about “unelected judges” (as opposed, presumably, to those unelected judges appointed by him). And then grant Flynn a pardon. But still, I hope the judge does the right thing.
wrs
I was interested to see that the judge in the Flynn case does NOT have to accept this latest DoJ motion. He can tell them that they’re talikg out their *ss, or just ignore them, and sentence Flynn anyway. I dare to hope that he’ll do exactly that.
Of course, Trump will rail about “unelected judges” (as opposed, presumably, to those unelected judges appointed by him). And then grant Flynn a pardon. But still, I hope the judge does the right thing.
I don’t know anything about the Gambino crime family, but…
1. It’s easy enough to imagine a crime family, or any family for that matter, being generally more competent at everything from taking out the garbage to running the country than SFJ-fka-Clickbait and his slimy crew. (Not that being competent plays any role in their goals, but that’s covered below.)
2. This of russell’s: The (R) organization at this point is about seizing and holding power seems as true and obvious to me as that the sun rises every day. These people do not give a flying banana about our country. It’s not that they’re sort of trying to govern, but their other agenda is bigger and has priority. It’s that at the core of their agenda is the specific intent to destroy the country’s capacity to be governed.
But 3. SFA-fka-Clickbait adds a dimension to the whole operation that I think is in no way intrinsic to the agenda in #2, or to the operations of a “normal” criminal cabal as in #1. That dimension is that Clickbait gets no satisfaction out of anything (making money, accumulating power) unless in the process of accomplishing it he is also shoving filthy slime all over everything and everyone within reach. That’s how he really gets his kicks.
And that’s enough about him for another day.
I don’t know anything about the Gambino crime family, but…
1. It’s easy enough to imagine a crime family, or any family for that matter, being generally more competent at everything from taking out the garbage to running the country than SFJ-fka-Clickbait and his slimy crew. (Not that being competent plays any role in their goals, but that’s covered below.)
2. This of russell’s: The (R) organization at this point is about seizing and holding power seems as true and obvious to me as that the sun rises every day. These people do not give a flying banana about our country. It’s not that they’re sort of trying to govern, but their other agenda is bigger and has priority. It’s that at the core of their agenda is the specific intent to destroy the country’s capacity to be governed.
But 3. SFA-fka-Clickbait adds a dimension to the whole operation that I think is in no way intrinsic to the agenda in #2, or to the operations of a “normal” criminal cabal as in #1. That dimension is that Clickbait gets no satisfaction out of anything (making money, accumulating power) unless in the process of accomplishing it he is also shoving filthy slime all over everything and everyone within reach. That’s how he really gets his kicks.
And that’s enough about him for another day.
Speaking of the Gambinos
https://www.dw.com/en/mexico-drug-cartels-turn-charities-in-coronavirus-pandemic/a-53222555
After the Kobe Earthquake and the Tohoku tsunami, yakuza groups pitched in
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/mobsters-on-a-mission-how-japans-mafia-launched-an-aid-effort-2264031.html
(the reporter, Jake Adelstein, is not the most reliable of narrators, but in this case, I think he was right)
Of course, there is an ulterior motive. But the answer is to have the state provide the safety net quickly and efficiently. Unfortunately, the current administration doesn’t understand that.
https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-coronavirus-response-chaos-helps-china-propaganda-2020-5
Speaking of the Gambinos
https://www.dw.com/en/mexico-drug-cartels-turn-charities-in-coronavirus-pandemic/a-53222555
After the Kobe Earthquake and the Tohoku tsunami, yakuza groups pitched in
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/mobsters-on-a-mission-how-japans-mafia-launched-an-aid-effort-2264031.html
(the reporter, Jake Adelstein, is not the most reliable of narrators, but in this case, I think he was right)
Of course, there is an ulterior motive. But the answer is to have the state provide the safety net quickly and efficiently. Unfortunately, the current administration doesn’t understand that.
https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-coronavirus-response-chaos-helps-china-propaganda-2020-5
Clickbait gets no satisfaction out of anything (making money, accumulating power) unless in the process of accomplishing it he is also shoving filthy slime all over everything and everyone within reach. That’s how he really gets his kicks.
Actually, I think he gets his kicks from being the best, the greatest, etc. . . . and having everyone acknowledge that. But he’s incapable of actually achieving anything significant, so the closest he can come is trying to make everyone around him smaller. The agony for him is that on some level he knows just how pathetic he is and it gnaws at him.
Clickbait gets no satisfaction out of anything (making money, accumulating power) unless in the process of accomplishing it he is also shoving filthy slime all over everything and everyone within reach. That’s how he really gets his kicks.
Actually, I think he gets his kicks from being the best, the greatest, etc. . . . and having everyone acknowledge that. But he’s incapable of actually achieving anything significant, so the closest he can come is trying to make everyone around him smaller. The agony for him is that on some level he knows just how pathetic he is and it gnaws at him.
lj, it comes down to this: our country is being run by an inferior class of criminals.
lj, it comes down to this: our country is being run by an inferior class of criminals.
This might make your heart skip a beat wj
https://www.thedailybeast.com/biden-campaign-is-secretly-building-a-republican-group
I pass it on but am completely agnostic about it. Though there are some funny grafs
“This is about killing the alligator closest to the boat,” said Rick Tyler, who served as Sen. Ted Cruz’s (R-TX) communications director during his 2016 presidential campaign. “People say how can you support Biden? The alligator that’s going to kill us is the closest one, and that’s Trump,” he said.
This might make your heart skip a beat wj
https://www.thedailybeast.com/biden-campaign-is-secretly-building-a-republican-group
I pass it on but am completely agnostic about it. Though there are some funny grafs
“This is about killing the alligator closest to the boat,” said Rick Tyler, who served as Sen. Ted Cruz’s (R-TX) communications director during his 2016 presidential campaign. “People say how can you support Biden? The alligator that’s going to kill us is the closest one, and that’s Trump,” he said.
wrs. I have renounced magical thinking, these separate realities can’t be bridged at the moment. As for analysing how Jackass gets his jollies, although as you know I am usually keen to do long distance psychoanalysis, to me he is something of a black hole: I don’t know what’s in there, but anyone who gets too close gets destroyed. wj’s theory does sound right to me, though.
wrs. I have renounced magical thinking, these separate realities can’t be bridged at the moment. As for analysing how Jackass gets his jollies, although as you know I am usually keen to do long distance psychoanalysis, to me he is something of a black hole: I don’t know what’s in there, but anyone who gets too close gets destroyed. wj’s theory does sound right to me, though.
That’s one way to dissolve a task force:
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/5/9/1943955/-Task-force-exposed-to-it-Dr-Fauci-Dr-Redfield-and-Dr-Hahn-self-isolating-exposed-to-COVID19
What do Republicans for (using) Biden want and expect to get in return?
To not be executed? What else?
Stalin got half of Europe from Churchill and Roosevelt for his troubles.
I’d settle for eternal cold war thereafter against all republicans with nuclear weapons pointed at them on high alert at all times.
Take their votes and then they can get back under the bed with the commies and the nazis.
Forever embargo all of their attempts at governance.
No kumbaya this time around.
Total surrender.
That’s one way to dissolve a task force:
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/5/9/1943955/-Task-force-exposed-to-it-Dr-Fauci-Dr-Redfield-and-Dr-Hahn-self-isolating-exposed-to-COVID19
What do Republicans for (using) Biden want and expect to get in return?
To not be executed? What else?
Stalin got half of Europe from Churchill and Roosevelt for his troubles.
I’d settle for eternal cold war thereafter against all republicans with nuclear weapons pointed at them on high alert at all times.
Take their votes and then they can get back under the bed with the commies and the nazis.
Forever embargo all of their attempts at governance.
No kumbaya this time around.
Total surrender.
https://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2020/05/are-tests-useless-because-they-only-come-up-positive-when-people-are-sick-views-differ
America wants a second opinion.
Here it is:
You’re ugly too.
https://www.lawyersgunsmoneyblog.com/2020/05/are-tests-useless-because-they-only-come-up-positive-when-people-are-sick-views-differ
America wants a second opinion.
Here it is:
You’re ugly too.
lj, one of the quotes in your article is: “A coalition like this has to be knitted together very carefully because it can very quickly fall apart and everyone is made to look stupid.” Which is quite true. And it makes one wonder, Why would one do such a thing, and take that risk? Why not just proceed independently?
That latter appears to be the approach of the Lincoln Project. And Trump’s reaction to their first video, “Mourning in America”, (raging fury**) suggests just how effective it the be. Yet, no coordination at all.
** Not to mention a barrage of furious tweets. Which did far more to publicize it than any advertising they might have paid for.
lj, one of the quotes in your article is: “A coalition like this has to be knitted together very carefully because it can very quickly fall apart and everyone is made to look stupid.” Which is quite true. And it makes one wonder, Why would one do such a thing, and take that risk? Why not just proceed independently?
That latter appears to be the approach of the Lincoln Project. And Trump’s reaction to their first video, “Mourning in America”, (raging fury**) suggests just how effective it the be. Yet, no coordination at all.
** Not to mention a barrage of furious tweets. Which did far more to publicize it than any advertising they might have paid for.
Promising news:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/07/health/coronavirus-antibody-prevalence.html?smid=tw-nytimesscience&smtyp=cur
Promising news:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/07/health/coronavirus-antibody-prevalence.html?smid=tw-nytimesscience&smtyp=cur
Actually, I think he gets his kicks from being the best, the greatest, etc. . . . and having everyone acknowledge that. But he’s incapable of actually achieving anything significant, so the closest he can come is trying to make everyone around him smaller.
One good quibble deserves another: I think they’re two sides of the same coin, a chicken and an egg, pick your metaphor. I have known a couple of people whose entire framework for relating to other folks was to poke and prod and bully until a fight broke out of a kind the provoker could always win. So yes, self-aggrandizing in the winning of it, but also, the fighting itself was the way these people energized themselves and kept telling themselves they were real.
The whole formulation owes something, I think, to one of russell’s recent framings, that the only thing Clickbait is good at is provoking pissing contests of the sort he knows how to win.
Actually, I think he gets his kicks from being the best, the greatest, etc. . . . and having everyone acknowledge that. But he’s incapable of actually achieving anything significant, so the closest he can come is trying to make everyone around him smaller.
One good quibble deserves another: I think they’re two sides of the same coin, a chicken and an egg, pick your metaphor. I have known a couple of people whose entire framework for relating to other folks was to poke and prod and bully until a fight broke out of a kind the provoker could always win. So yes, self-aggrandizing in the winning of it, but also, the fighting itself was the way these people energized themselves and kept telling themselves they were real.
The whole formulation owes something, I think, to one of russell’s recent framings, that the only thing Clickbait is good at is provoking pissing contests of the sort he knows how to win.
So yes, self-aggrandizing in the winning of it, but also, the fighting itself was the way these people energized themselves and kept telling themselves they were real.
Well, to confirm that observation, that was probably why he loved those Covid press conferences so much at the beginning. He got to fight with people, and insult them, and then move on, and since he was controlling it he could fool himself that he was winning every exchange, and that visibly energised him. It was only when broader public reaction started trickling through to him (as with the disinfectant injections) that he got the message that what was happening wasn’t what he thought was happening.
So yes, self-aggrandizing in the winning of it, but also, the fighting itself was the way these people energized themselves and kept telling themselves they were real.
Well, to confirm that observation, that was probably why he loved those Covid press conferences so much at the beginning. He got to fight with people, and insult them, and then move on, and since he was controlling it he could fool himself that he was winning every exchange, and that visibly energised him. It was only when broader public reaction started trickling through to him (as with the disinfectant injections) that he got the message that what was happening wasn’t what he thought was happening.
South Korea has a setback:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/vigilance-and-surveillance
But at least they are on top of it.
It is too bad they don’t enjoy our American-style freedoms, with viruses having personhood bestowed on them, or maybe placing the concealed carrying of viruses under the auspices of the Second Amendment (the NVA), and could just let those 50 new cases go bar-hopping at will too and start the whole mess over again.
South Korea has a setback:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/vigilance-and-surveillance
But at least they are on top of it.
It is too bad they don’t enjoy our American-style freedoms, with viruses having personhood bestowed on them, or maybe placing the concealed carrying of viruses under the auspices of the Second Amendment (the NVA), and could just let those 50 new cases go bar-hopping at will too and start the whole mess over again.
So that bar-hopping guy who exposed 2000+ of his fellow South Koreans, something must have happened.
One day he is not a Covid-19 carrier and tests negative, and then suddenly he tests positive for the infection, just like that. I can’t think what might have happened from one day to to the next and one test to the next, but I wish we had a branch of science that could explain it to us.
Weird, huh?
Sure makes he and the others look bad, not to mention his country.
The guy’s vanity really must have taken a hit.
What are the chances that Stephen Miller’s wife, at her better’s insistence, deliberately got herself infected and then breathed all over the task force scientists to put them out of commission?
I’d lay even odds.
So that bar-hopping guy who exposed 2000+ of his fellow South Koreans, something must have happened.
One day he is not a Covid-19 carrier and tests negative, and then suddenly he tests positive for the infection, just like that. I can’t think what might have happened from one day to to the next and one test to the next, but I wish we had a branch of science that could explain it to us.
Weird, huh?
Sure makes he and the others look bad, not to mention his country.
The guy’s vanity really must have taken a hit.
What are the chances that Stephen Miller’s wife, at her better’s insistence, deliberately got herself infected and then breathed all over the task force scientists to put them out of commission?
I’d lay even odds.
I recall this article on the subhuman Evil that is Mitch McConnell was mentioned recently here, but read it:
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2020/04/20/how-mitch-mcconnell-became-trumps-enabler-in-chief
His wife is corrupt evil as well. It’s got nothing to do with the fact that she is Chinese.
She’s a Republican conservative.
I recall this article on the subhuman Evil that is Mitch McConnell was mentioned recently here, but read it:
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2020/04/20/how-mitch-mcconnell-became-trumps-enabler-in-chief
His wife is corrupt evil as well. It’s got nothing to do with the fact that she is Chinese.
She’s a Republican conservative.
As with Trump and company, it is difficult to compile a hierarchy of McConnell’s evil acts, but this causes one to think that the conservative movement led my Trump and McConnell knew what was coming disease-wise in 2020.
Only John McCain stopped them. How did he die again?
They are genocidal murderers:
“The costs of the Senate’s dysfunction stretch in all directions, and include America’s vulnerability in the face of the covid-19 outbreak. For seven years after Obama’s signature domestic achievement, the Affordable Care Act, passed, in 2010, Republicans in Congress tried at least sixty times to repeal it. In 2017, McConnell, who called it “the worst bill in modern history,” led the charge again and, among other things, personally introduced a little-noticed amendment to eliminate the Prevention and Public Health Fund at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which provided grants to states for detecting and responding to infectious-disease outbreaks, among other things. The fund received approximately a billion dollars a year and constituted more than twelve per cent of the C.D.C.’s annual budget. Almost two-thirds of the money went to state and local health departments, including a program called Epidemiology and Laboratory Capacity for Prevention and Control of Emerging Infectious Diseases, in Kentucky.
Hundreds of health organizations, including the Association for Professionals in Infection Control and Epidemiology, sent a letter to McConnell and other congressional leaders, warning them of “dire consequences” if the Prevention Fund was eliminated. Public-health programs dealing with infectious-disease outbreaks had never been restored to the levels they were at before the 2008 crash and were “critically underfunded.” The letter concluded, “Eliminating the Prevention Fund would be disastrous.”
In a column in Forbes, Judy Stone, an infectious-disease specialist, asked, “Worried about bird flu coming from Asia? Ebola? Zika? You damn well should be. Monitoring and control will be slashed by the Senate proposal and outbreaks of illness (infectious and other) will undoubtedly worsen.” The cuts, she wrote, were “unconscionable—particularly given that the savings will go to tax cuts for the wealthiest rather than meeting the basic health needs of the public.”
On July 28, 2017, a dramatic thumbs-down vote by Senator John McCain stopped Senate Republicans from eliminating the entire Affordable Care Act, including money for the Prevention Fund. McConnell and other Republicans subsequently tried again to gut the C.D.C. fund. Much of the funding survived, although some of it was later shifted, with bipartisan support, to cancer research and other activities. McConnell’s attempt to kill the fund was just a small piece of the Republicans’ much larger undermining of Obamacare. According to Jeff Levi, a professor of public health at George Washington University, one result of the Republicans’ efforts is that many Americans who lack insurance “will likely avoid getting tested and treated for covid-19, because they fear the costs.”
As with Trump and company, it is difficult to compile a hierarchy of McConnell’s evil acts, but this causes one to think that the conservative movement led my Trump and McConnell knew what was coming disease-wise in 2020.
Only John McCain stopped them. How did he die again?
They are genocidal murderers:
“The costs of the Senate’s dysfunction stretch in all directions, and include America’s vulnerability in the face of the covid-19 outbreak. For seven years after Obama’s signature domestic achievement, the Affordable Care Act, passed, in 2010, Republicans in Congress tried at least sixty times to repeal it. In 2017, McConnell, who called it “the worst bill in modern history,” led the charge again and, among other things, personally introduced a little-noticed amendment to eliminate the Prevention and Public Health Fund at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which provided grants to states for detecting and responding to infectious-disease outbreaks, among other things. The fund received approximately a billion dollars a year and constituted more than twelve per cent of the C.D.C.’s annual budget. Almost two-thirds of the money went to state and local health departments, including a program called Epidemiology and Laboratory Capacity for Prevention and Control of Emerging Infectious Diseases, in Kentucky.
Hundreds of health organizations, including the Association for Professionals in Infection Control and Epidemiology, sent a letter to McConnell and other congressional leaders, warning them of “dire consequences” if the Prevention Fund was eliminated. Public-health programs dealing with infectious-disease outbreaks had never been restored to the levels they were at before the 2008 crash and were “critically underfunded.” The letter concluded, “Eliminating the Prevention Fund would be disastrous.”
In a column in Forbes, Judy Stone, an infectious-disease specialist, asked, “Worried about bird flu coming from Asia? Ebola? Zika? You damn well should be. Monitoring and control will be slashed by the Senate proposal and outbreaks of illness (infectious and other) will undoubtedly worsen.” The cuts, she wrote, were “unconscionable—particularly given that the savings will go to tax cuts for the wealthiest rather than meeting the basic health needs of the public.”
On July 28, 2017, a dramatic thumbs-down vote by Senator John McCain stopped Senate Republicans from eliminating the entire Affordable Care Act, including money for the Prevention Fund. McConnell and other Republicans subsequently tried again to gut the C.D.C. fund. Much of the funding survived, although some of it was later shifted, with bipartisan support, to cancer research and other activities. McConnell’s attempt to kill the fund was just a small piece of the Republicans’ much larger undermining of Obamacare. According to Jeff Levi, a professor of public health at George Washington University, one result of the Republicans’ efforts is that many Americans who lack insurance “will likely avoid getting tested and treated for covid-19, because they fear the costs.”
Why would one do such a thing, and take that risk? Why not just proceed independently?
Making an assumption that it is true, a couple of possibilities
-Biden’s gut instinct is to push bipartisan stuff (setting aside whether it is a good idea or not)
-Biden is convinced that if he doesn’t bring some Republicans in, you are going to have Trump refusing to step down, or some of the other dumb shit he’s capable of as a sore loser
-Biden thinks that he has to have those republicans to make things work in the long term
It could also just be a balloon floated to try and get some other Republicans to join in and Biden might think that those republicans who are sane by some standards need a landing place
That’s just speculation, but I think those are plausible.
Why would one do such a thing, and take that risk? Why not just proceed independently?
Making an assumption that it is true, a couple of possibilities
-Biden’s gut instinct is to push bipartisan stuff (setting aside whether it is a good idea or not)
-Biden is convinced that if he doesn’t bring some Republicans in, you are going to have Trump refusing to step down, or some of the other dumb shit he’s capable of as a sore loser
-Biden thinks that he has to have those republicans to make things work in the long term
It could also just be a balloon floated to try and get some other Republicans to join in and Biden might think that those republicans who are sane by some standards need a landing place
That’s just speculation, but I think those are plausible.
A lot of Republican politicians are sheltering in place until Trump is over…
A lot of Republican politicians are sheltering in place until Trump is over…
Maybe it’s not being driven by Biden. Maybe the (R)’s are coming to him.
Maybe it’s not being driven by Biden. Maybe the (R)’s are coming to him.
lj, agreed it is plausible that Biden will wish to visibly bring on some Republicans in his administration. But that’s after the election. I don’t see him willing to reduce (if, perhaps, only slightly) the partisan enthusiasm of Democratic voters. Not in an election which might, if Trump doesn’t manage to turn it into a Democratic tsunami, hinge on who can better turn out their partisans.
lj, agreed it is plausible that Biden will wish to visibly bring on some Republicans in his administration. But that’s after the election. I don’t see him willing to reduce (if, perhaps, only slightly) the partisan enthusiasm of Democratic voters. Not in an election which might, if Trump doesn’t manage to turn it into a Democratic tsunami, hinge on who can better turn out their partisans.
Sure, it might by the (R)s coming to him. But even so, for the reasons given I’d expect him to tell them “arms’ length, not coordination.”
Sure, it might by the (R)s coming to him. But even so, for the reasons given I’d expect him to tell them “arms’ length, not coordination.”
to me it sounded like he’s just trying to get the never-Trumper GOP comfortable with him.
maybe then they won’t do something stupid like endorse a 3rd party conservative or tell people to sit it out.
nothing wrong with allies.
the Dem base doesn’t like to hear this, but they’re not big enough (in the right places) to elect a President on their own. they need help from others.
to me it sounded like he’s just trying to get the never-Trumper GOP comfortable with him.
maybe then they won’t do something stupid like endorse a 3rd party conservative or tell people to sit it out.
nothing wrong with allies.
the Dem base doesn’t like to hear this, but they’re not big enough (in the right places) to elect a President on their own. they need help from others.
I suspect that if Biden reaches out to Republicans, the rest of the party is going to demand some entry hurdles. Eg, support for restoring and improving Obamacare, and moving on climate change. Means might be up for some discussion, but not ends.
I suspect that if Biden reaches out to Republicans, the rest of the party is going to demand some entry hurdles. Eg, support for restoring and improving Obamacare, and moving on climate change. Means might be up for some discussion, but not ends.
JFC:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/ivanka-trump-personal-assistant-test-positive-coronavirus
JFC:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/ivanka-trump-personal-assistant-test-positive-coronavirus
I hope Biden, when reaching out to infectious Republicans, doesn’t actually touch them.
They obviously are willing plague carriers. Maybe they are trying to get close enough to him to kill him.
Covid-19 and conservatism have, whatchamallit, a symbiotic relationship, like mosquitos and malaria.
https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/coronavirus/illinois-governors-stay-home-order-infringes-civil-liberties-rules#.XqhGQQuP8Bg.twitter
So, say you are masked-up and in line at a grocery store and Darren baby is crowding with you his infected breath.
First Amendment or Second Amendment in self-defense?
I hope Biden, when reaching out to infectious Republicans, doesn’t actually touch them.
They obviously are willing plague carriers. Maybe they are trying to get close enough to him to kill him.
Covid-19 and conservatism have, whatchamallit, a symbiotic relationship, like mosquitos and malaria.
https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/coronavirus/illinois-governors-stay-home-order-infringes-civil-liberties-rules#.XqhGQQuP8Bg.twitter
So, say you are masked-up and in line at a grocery store and Darren baby is crowding with you his infected breath.
First Amendment or Second Amendment in self-defense?
JT, thank you for reposting that New Yorker piece on McConnell. A friend recommended it very heavily several weeks ago, and I meant to read it, then forgot all about it. Jesus. Just when you think you can’t be any more shocked by the crookery, the corruption and the complete lack of any morals combined with naked self-interest, you read something so profoundly appalling that the word shock doesn’t come anywhere near it. We need a whole new metric or scale for this kind of thing, the old ones don’t do the job.
JT, thank you for reposting that New Yorker piece on McConnell. A friend recommended it very heavily several weeks ago, and I meant to read it, then forgot all about it. Jesus. Just when you think you can’t be any more shocked by the crookery, the corruption and the complete lack of any morals combined with naked self-interest, you read something so profoundly appalling that the word shock doesn’t come anywhere near it. We need a whole new metric or scale for this kind of thing, the old ones don’t do the job.
https://abc7ny.com/is-it-safe-to-fly-social-distancing-flights-united-coronavirus-airlines/6169245/
United Airlines management are obviously full-in murderous Republican.
They told baldfaced lies, so what else is new, to prospective passengers regarding precautions they were taking.
Typical Republicans.
We’re living (temporarily) among zombie filth killers.
Fully nationalize the meat packers and the airlines.
I hope the workers in American meatpacking plants are spitting into our meat for what we have forced our malignant government to do to them.
They know Stephen Miller will arrest and deport them if they revolt, so they are captive, just as Republican filth like their labor to be.
I hope Miller and his wife had relations recently while she was asymptomatic, or was it him who deliberately infected her and pointed her in Fauci’s direction?
But maybe it’s not that kind of marriage.
That sadist must visit BDSM clubs.
https://abc7ny.com/is-it-safe-to-fly-social-distancing-flights-united-coronavirus-airlines/6169245/
United Airlines management are obviously full-in murderous Republican.
They told baldfaced lies, so what else is new, to prospective passengers regarding precautions they were taking.
Typical Republicans.
We’re living (temporarily) among zombie filth killers.
Fully nationalize the meat packers and the airlines.
I hope the workers in American meatpacking plants are spitting into our meat for what we have forced our malignant government to do to them.
They know Stephen Miller will arrest and deport them if they revolt, so they are captive, just as Republican filth like their labor to be.
I hope Miller and his wife had relations recently while she was asymptomatic, or was it him who deliberately infected her and pointed her in Fauci’s direction?
But maybe it’s not that kind of marriage.
That sadist must visit BDSM clubs.
“That sadist must visit BDSM clubs.”
I hear they’re called “ICE detention centers”.
“That sadist must visit BDSM clubs.”
I hear they’re called “ICE detention centers”.
Graphs updated to today.
Graphs updated to today.
We need a whole new metric or scale for this kind of thing, the old ones don’t do the job.
There’s always Putin. Grab power, privatize everything, and dole it out to your friends.
(R) squad goals.
We need a whole new metric or scale for this kind of thing, the old ones don’t do the job.
There’s always Putin. Grab power, privatize everything, and dole it out to your friends.
(R) squad goals.
Also, as an aside, as regards the Gambinos and their like, and competence:
Competence as we normally think of it is almost irrelevant to success as a mafiosa. What is crucial is a capacity for cruelty, and an utter lack of personal and social conscience.
There are areas where actual professional skill are useful – law, accountancy, logistics – but you can hire that talent.
Briefly, it’s a career path for sociopaths.
Also, as an aside, as regards the Gambinos and their like, and competence:
Competence as we normally think of it is almost irrelevant to success as a mafiosa. What is crucial is a capacity for cruelty, and an utter lack of personal and social conscience.
There are areas where actual professional skill are useful – law, accountancy, logistics – but you can hire that talent.
Briefly, it’s a career path for sociopaths.
Sociopaths of another stripe. If their deity was anything more than a tinpot idol, they’d burn.
I’ve just about had it with the murderous stupidity.
Sociopaths of another stripe. If their deity was anything more than a tinpot idol, they’d burn.
I’ve just about had it with the murderous stupidity.
There’s always Putin. Grab power, privatize everything, and dole it out to your friends.
(R) squad goals.
But unlike the current Republican leadership, Putin is at least semi-competent.
Defining “competent” as able to actually manage something. As evidenced by, to put it bluntly, “not skinning the marks to the point where they cease to be a potential source of revenue.” Granted, Putin isn’t very good at it — witness the sad shape of the Russian economy. But still head and shoulders above McConnell et al.
There’s always Putin. Grab power, privatize everything, and dole it out to your friends.
(R) squad goals.
But unlike the current Republican leadership, Putin is at least semi-competent.
Defining “competent” as able to actually manage something. As evidenced by, to put it bluntly, “not skinning the marks to the point where they cease to be a potential source of revenue.” Granted, Putin isn’t very good at it — witness the sad shape of the Russian economy. But still head and shoulders above McConnell et al.
But still head and shoulders above McConnell et al.
I don’t know. Assuming that they are purely selfish, their system does not need to work in the long run; just as long as they themselves can profit from it.Après nous le Déluge.
But still head and shoulders above McConnell et al.
I don’t know. Assuming that they are purely selfish, their system does not need to work in the long run; just as long as they themselves can profit from it.Après nous le Déluge.
Going to try and get a post or two up, but I put this here.
Holy shit…
https://www.theatlantic.com/video/archive/2020/05/icu-delirium/611155/
Going to try and get a post or two up, but I put this here.
Holy shit…
https://www.theatlantic.com/video/archive/2020/05/icu-delirium/611155/
I expect most have seen this, but it contains useful intelligence about the virus’ transmission pathways:
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/5/10/1944028/-Dr-Muge-Cevik-on-COVID-19-Transmission-Dynamics?utm_campaign=trending
Here too, if Daily Kos is not your cup of anti-coagulant; you’ll need to scroll down a couple of pages:
https://spinstrangenesscharm.wordpress.com/tag/covid-19/
I expect most have seen this, but it contains useful intelligence about the virus’ transmission pathways:
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/5/10/1944028/-Dr-Muge-Cevik-on-COVID-19-Transmission-Dynamics?utm_campaign=trending
Here too, if Daily Kos is not your cup of anti-coagulant; you’ll need to scroll down a couple of pages:
https://spinstrangenesscharm.wordpress.com/tag/covid-19/
I own a little Tesla stock because I like to share in equal parts spectacular engineering brilliance and some really baseline bovine stupidity and mouth diarrhea:
https://www.eschatonblog.com/2020/05/full-covid-truther.html
I own a little Tesla stock because I like to share in equal parts spectacular engineering brilliance and some really baseline bovine stupidity and mouth diarrhea:
https://www.eschatonblog.com/2020/05/full-covid-truther.html
Literature soothes:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/the-bards-creativity-during-lockdown/
Literature soothes:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/the-bards-creativity-during-lockdown/
RIP Jerry Stiller.
RIP Jerry Stiller.
That stopped me short.
That stopped me short.
he was one in a million
he was one in a million
From lj’s link: The problem is that the mind transmogrifies reality into something much scarier.
From lj’s link: The problem is that the mind transmogrifies reality into something much scarier.
carrying a bazooka and two pistols into Subway might be overcompensating…
no word on how many knives he had.
carrying a bazooka and two pistols into Subway might be overcompensating…
no word on how many knives he had.
Knives? Only libertarians would think to fall back on those legalities.
Hell, I expect he had a couple of senorita pistols strapped under each of his compression socks in case a high-stakes poker game broke out.
“An armed society is a polite society.”
Did you a … want p ..p.. pa… pickles with that? I mean, you don’t have to have pickles, I … Iya… I, I d… d.. don …don’t m..me..ean to fa..fa..fa.force you to have pa, bidi, bidiya, pa.. pa.. pickles. I’m, I’m, I’m j..j.j..just saying we have p-pa… rocket launchers, no, sorry ah, I mean … pickles if you so de .. da de (gulp) desire.
“Mum, mumamumamu ma m..mustard?”
“We don’t want to make it look like we’re threatening or intimidating anyone, which is why I ask.”
Thank you so much for asking, sir. I too try not to make it look like I’m walking around with instruments of mass destruction which would appear to signify that I’m about to shoot every one of you f3g gook republican f8cks in your brainless heads, and then take your wallets out of your pockets, after slitting your throats to make sure America is even safer, and check your home addresses, and go over there and burn your houses to the ground, while safeguarding your zero IQ whore get children and raising them up to be spineless RINOs who can someday work in a carnival as the main attractions, or perhaps guest post at Redstate.
FUCK you conservatives and libertarians.
You have weapons. What are you going to do about this shit?
Knives? Only libertarians would think to fall back on those legalities.
Hell, I expect he had a couple of senorita pistols strapped under each of his compression socks in case a high-stakes poker game broke out.
“An armed society is a polite society.”
Did you a … want p ..p.. pa… pickles with that? I mean, you don’t have to have pickles, I … Iya… I, I d… d.. don …don’t m..me..ean to fa..fa..fa.force you to have pa, bidi, bidiya, pa.. pa.. pickles. I’m, I’m, I’m j..j.j..just saying we have p-pa… rocket launchers, no, sorry ah, I mean … pickles if you so de .. da de (gulp) desire.
“Mum, mumamumamu ma m..mustard?”
“We don’t want to make it look like we’re threatening or intimidating anyone, which is why I ask.”
Thank you so much for asking, sir. I too try not to make it look like I’m walking around with instruments of mass destruction which would appear to signify that I’m about to shoot every one of you f3g gook republican f8cks in your brainless heads, and then take your wallets out of your pockets, after slitting your throats to make sure America is even safer, and check your home addresses, and go over there and burn your houses to the ground, while safeguarding your zero IQ whore get children and raising them up to be spineless RINOs who can someday work in a carnival as the main attractions, or perhaps guest post at Redstate.
FUCK you conservatives and libertarians.
You have weapons. What are you going to do about this shit?
Riiiight. “We don’t want to make it look like we’re threatening or intimidating anyone”. And if you believe that, even for an instant, I can both sell you this great bridge and put you in touch with a Nigerian prince.
Riiiight. “We don’t want to make it look like we’re threatening or intimidating anyone”. And if you believe that, even for an instant, I can both sell you this great bridge and put you in touch with a Nigerian prince.
what’s great is that was a training rocket launcher. and his buddy was carrying a giant wooden rifle. they’re doing some theater with their toys.
Tamir Rice is not amused.
what’s great is that was a training rocket launcher. and his buddy was carrying a giant wooden rifle. they’re doing some theater with their toys.
Tamir Rice is not amused.
Still an efficient cudgel, if proper wood is used.
Still an efficient cudgel, if proper wood is used.
Did they have any Skittles on their persons?
Did they have any Skittles on their persons?
I tend to favor a fully loaded super soaker squirt gun when I’m ordering over the counter.
I tend to favor a fully loaded super soaker squirt gun when I’m ordering over the counter.
You gotta admit, whether it’s health care or the law, he is remarkably consistent in demanding different treatment from everyone else.
I confess that I find it amusing that White House staffers are getting quoted, by name, saying that they are fearful about going to work. In an environment where they, and everyone else, is getting daily testing, careful contact tracing, etc. While the rest of us are supposed to just suck it up and get back to work without any of that.
You gotta admit, whether it’s health care or the law, he is remarkably consistent in demanding different treatment from everyone else.
I confess that I find it amusing that White House staffers are getting quoted, by name, saying that they are fearful about going to work. In an environment where they, and everyone else, is getting daily testing, careful contact tracing, etc. While the rest of us are supposed to just suck it up and get back to work without any of that.
follow-up:
her lawyer also says the check issue wasn’t the cause of her termination. (though, of course he’d say that)
follow-up:
her lawyer also says the check issue wasn’t the cause of her termination. (though, of course he’d say that)
And we have this, from CBS news:
After all, it’s his reaseach that’s the basis for all the work that developed tests for covid-19. So of course we’d want to slash that!
And we have this, from CBS news:
After all, it’s his reaseach that’s the basis for all the work that developed tests for covid-19. So of course we’d want to slash that!
always remember, the GOP has no problem with any of this.
always remember, the GOP has no problem with any of this.
The conservative filth can’t say NO to the Trump/Pence Republican death cult.
They carry Death with them. They smell like rotting carrion, the ghouls.
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/death-wish/
Kinda looked like Jonestown.
Murderers.
America is done.
The conservative filth can’t say NO to the Trump/Pence Republican death cult.
They carry Death with them. They smell like rotting carrion, the ghouls.
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/death-wish/
Kinda looked like Jonestown.
Murderers.
America is done.
I was reminded this weekend of cleek’s Lowe’s story, about how only half of the people there wearing masks. The wife and I went to a nursery to get some plants. Aside from going inside a few greenhouses that were open at each end, the majority of the plant-seeking was outside.
Even in a well-spaced, outdoor environment, everyone was wearing a mask. You’d at least look like a dick without one, even if it wasn’t mandated. I don’t know if it was mandated there. I don’t recall a sign, but I don’t think it mattered either way. People were going to wear them.
I don’t know if it’s because we’re in NJ and it’s such a hard-hit state, even though we’re in South Jersey and our county’s per-capita numbers are pretty close to national averages.
I really don’t get this resistance to the mask thing. It’s such an easy ask.
I was reminded this weekend of cleek’s Lowe’s story, about how only half of the people there wearing masks. The wife and I went to a nursery to get some plants. Aside from going inside a few greenhouses that were open at each end, the majority of the plant-seeking was outside.
Even in a well-spaced, outdoor environment, everyone was wearing a mask. You’d at least look like a dick without one, even if it wasn’t mandated. I don’t know if it was mandated there. I don’t recall a sign, but I don’t think it mattered either way. People were going to wear them.
I don’t know if it’s because we’re in NJ and it’s such a hard-hit state, even though we’re in South Jersey and our county’s per-capita numbers are pretty close to national averages.
I really don’t get this resistance to the mask thing. It’s such an easy ask.
It’s such an easy ask.
Apparently not.
I tend to believe we are really fucked.
It’s such an easy ask.
Apparently not.
I tend to believe we are really fucked.
Wearing a mask is so trivial, the only “reason” I can see for resistance is to make a political statement. (Or, I suppose, to announce publicly: “I am a d*ck who doesn’t give a sh*t about anyone but myself.” Which seems to be the rationale for those in the White House.)
Wearing a mask is so trivial, the only “reason” I can see for resistance is to make a political statement. (Or, I suppose, to announce publicly: “I am a d*ck who doesn’t give a sh*t about anyone but myself.” Which seems to be the rationale for those in the White House.)
My limited experience is that some people are treating masks like a talisman that creates an impenetrable barrier between them and the virus. They put on a mask and wander idly about stores crowding other shoppers and picking up things they don’t buy.
My limited experience is that some people are treating masks like a talisman that creates an impenetrable barrier between them and the virus. They put on a mask and wander idly about stores crowding other shoppers and picking up things they don’t buy.
We will get the Swedish model without acting like Swedes or benefiting from the social safety net they benefit from.
Thousands of our poor shall be denied public support (go to work or die–pick one), and die totally unnecessary deaths.
This is cold blooded murder.
We will get the Swedish model without acting like Swedes or benefiting from the social safety net they benefit from.
Thousands of our poor shall be denied public support (go to work or die–pick one), and die totally unnecessary deaths.
This is cold blooded murder.
My limited experience is that some people are treating masks like a talisman that creates an impenetrable barrier between them and the virus.
Mine is that people nervously avoid each other and look like they want to get the f**k out of the store ASAP.
My limited experience is that some people are treating masks like a talisman that creates an impenetrable barrier between them and the virus.
Mine is that people nervously avoid each other and look like they want to get the f**k out of the store ASAP.
They put on a mask and wander idly about stores crowding other shoppers and picking up things they don’t buy.
first thing i touch when i get back in my car is my trusty bottle of hand sanitizer. long may she provide.
They put on a mask and wander idly about stores crowding other shoppers and picking up things they don’t buy.
first thing i touch when i get back in my car is my trusty bottle of hand sanitizer. long may she provide.
McSweeney’s is on point again:
https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/sure-the-velociraptors-are-still-on-the-loose-but-thats-no-reason-not-to-reopen-jurassic-park
“In addition to satisfying our customers, the decision to reopen the park is also about allowing the furloughed employees of Jurassic Park to get back to the work they love. Could we have continued to pay their salaries for several months until we got the velociraptor situation under control? Definitely. We’re the wealthiest nature preserve on the planet after all. And will some of the employees returning to work have their limbs torn off and tossed into the air like a juggler tossing bowling pins? Undoubtedly. But we’re confident that with a few safety precautions put in place, we’ll be able to keep the level of workplace injuries and deaths just below levels that would elicit widespread public outrage. And keeping things just below widespread public outrage levels is our gold standard for all of the decisions we make here at Jurassic Park.”
McSweeney’s is on point again:
https://www.mcsweeneys.net/articles/sure-the-velociraptors-are-still-on-the-loose-but-thats-no-reason-not-to-reopen-jurassic-park
“In addition to satisfying our customers, the decision to reopen the park is also about allowing the furloughed employees of Jurassic Park to get back to the work they love. Could we have continued to pay their salaries for several months until we got the velociraptor situation under control? Definitely. We’re the wealthiest nature preserve on the planet after all. And will some of the employees returning to work have their limbs torn off and tossed into the air like a juggler tossing bowling pins? Undoubtedly. But we’re confident that with a few safety precautions put in place, we’ll be able to keep the level of workplace injuries and deaths just below levels that would elicit widespread public outrage. And keeping things just below widespread public outrage levels is our gold standard for all of the decisions we make here at Jurassic Park.”
first thing i touch when i get back in my car is my trusty bottle of hand sanitizer. long may she provide.
I carefully remove the latex gloves I wore into the store and throw them in the trash can before getting in the car. We need to party one of these days, cleek. Animals…
first thing i touch when i get back in my car is my trusty bottle of hand sanitizer. long may she provide.
I carefully remove the latex gloves I wore into the store and throw them in the trash can before getting in the car. We need to party one of these days, cleek. Animals…
living on the edge ! [edge of shelter in place]
i just found a box of latex gloves that i had bought for a furniture refinish project i did last year ! got them for the same project i bought my precious box of N95 masks for. if i start wearing the goggles i bought for that same project, i’ll complete the ensemble.
living on the edge ! [edge of shelter in place]
i just found a box of latex gloves that i had bought for a furniture refinish project i did last year ! got them for the same project i bought my precious box of N95 masks for. if i start wearing the goggles i bought for that same project, i’ll complete the ensemble.
I’m just injecting disinfectant straight into my body.
And by disinfectant, I mean rye whisky. Injected orally.
I’m just injecting disinfectant straight into my body.
And by disinfectant, I mean rye whisky. Injected orally.
It’s such an easy ask.
Yes, it is easy. And people will refuse because it’s the government asking them to do it.
People surrender insane amounts of information every day just to play a stupid facebook game, or to let their phone tell them where the nearest McDonalds is. They probably don’t even know they’re doing it.
If the government – not the freaking CIA or the FBI, just some public health agency, most likely local – asks them for similar information to trace their contact history, they’ll not only refuse, somebody might get shot in the head.
There are pretty straightforward ways to manage the risks posed by COVID. They all involve testing, contact tracing, isolation of people who are at risk or potentially at risk, and monitoring all of that for compliance.
Americans won’t do those things in sufficient numbers to make it effective. Instead, they’ll complain about not being able to work or, more trivially, not being able to get a haircut or go to a party. They’ll complain, but they will not agree to do the simple things that would begin to make all of the things they want possible without undue risk to their own and other people’s lives.
MA, where I live, will probably be among the last places to lift lockdown. Even so, when that happens, I’m not going anywhere for a good long while. I’m sure as hell not leaving the state for the forseeable future.
Folks “don’t trust the government”, and want to do whatever the hell they like. I “don’t trust the government” either, like I “don’t trust” any other large bureaucratic organization. But I “trust the government” a hell of a lot more than I trust irresponsible knuckleheads who won’t even wear a freaking mask in public places.
It’s such an easy ask.
Yes, it is easy. And people will refuse because it’s the government asking them to do it.
People surrender insane amounts of information every day just to play a stupid facebook game, or to let their phone tell them where the nearest McDonalds is. They probably don’t even know they’re doing it.
If the government – not the freaking CIA or the FBI, just some public health agency, most likely local – asks them for similar information to trace their contact history, they’ll not only refuse, somebody might get shot in the head.
There are pretty straightforward ways to manage the risks posed by COVID. They all involve testing, contact tracing, isolation of people who are at risk or potentially at risk, and monitoring all of that for compliance.
Americans won’t do those things in sufficient numbers to make it effective. Instead, they’ll complain about not being able to work or, more trivially, not being able to get a haircut or go to a party. They’ll complain, but they will not agree to do the simple things that would begin to make all of the things they want possible without undue risk to their own and other people’s lives.
MA, where I live, will probably be among the last places to lift lockdown. Even so, when that happens, I’m not going anywhere for a good long while. I’m sure as hell not leaving the state for the forseeable future.
Folks “don’t trust the government”, and want to do whatever the hell they like. I “don’t trust the government” either, like I “don’t trust” any other large bureaucratic organization. But I “trust the government” a hell of a lot more than I trust irresponsible knuckleheads who won’t even wear a freaking mask in public places.
The cuck vermin can’t handle it, turns tail and runs:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-press-conference-today-coronavirus-white-house-live-a9509476.html
I’m not going to sell Tesla stock, but Musk, like Trump, needs (to be hung by the neck) to have every bone in his face crushed.
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a32437591/tesla-factory-production-restarts/
All of these vermin are now Covid-19 spreaders pretty close to me. Five-hundred of the bat-eating, pangolin-licking animals walking the streets now, crowding me at the grocery store, etc. How am I to know whom is whom on the street?
Is one of those fucks going to take up hospital bed space I might need? Are they going to use a test I fucking deserve ahead of them?
Who do I have to kill to preserve my well-being?
I’m 68 years old. In great health, but why am I taking precautions when I could have gone to that luncheon and kicked some fucking republican vermin ass and maybe saved one Coloradan’s life whom one of those diseased subhumans are at this moment breathing on.
I’m 68 years old. I’m in great health, but why am I taking the precautions I do when I could have showed up at that luncheon and started some military-style self-defense drills as a preventative measure.
Obviously large clip automatic weapons are going to be required as these filth sweep thru Denver and the Front Range, attempting to kill us.
Fuck their conservative vermin mothers. I hope they are dead by Labor Day.
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/would-you-be-comfortable-eating-in-this-packed-restaurant-hundreds-of-customers-in-colorado-seem-totally-fine-with-it-2020-05-11
The cuck vermin can’t handle it, turns tail and runs:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-press-conference-today-coronavirus-white-house-live-a9509476.html
I’m not going to sell Tesla stock, but Musk, like Trump, needs (to be hung by the neck) to have every bone in his face crushed.
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a32437591/tesla-factory-production-restarts/
All of these vermin are now Covid-19 spreaders pretty close to me. Five-hundred of the bat-eating, pangolin-licking animals walking the streets now, crowding me at the grocery store, etc. How am I to know whom is whom on the street?
Is one of those fucks going to take up hospital bed space I might need? Are they going to use a test I fucking deserve ahead of them?
Who do I have to kill to preserve my well-being?
I’m 68 years old. In great health, but why am I taking precautions when I could have gone to that luncheon and kicked some fucking republican vermin ass and maybe saved one Coloradan’s life whom one of those diseased subhumans are at this moment breathing on.
I’m 68 years old. I’m in great health, but why am I taking the precautions I do when I could have showed up at that luncheon and started some military-style self-defense drills as a preventative measure.
Obviously large clip automatic weapons are going to be required as these filth sweep thru Denver and the Front Range, attempting to kill us.
Fuck their conservative vermin mothers. I hope they are dead by Labor Day.
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/would-you-be-comfortable-eating-in-this-packed-restaurant-hundreds-of-customers-in-colorado-seem-totally-fine-with-it-2020-05-11
Look like it’s going to be medical masks or death masks.
Yet another pure binary choice:
https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2020/05/trump-masks-for-me-but-not-for-thee/
Kill all government.
Then when conservatives and libertarians ask where did that thing go that was securing their rights and protecting their asses, kill them for asking.
Look like it’s going to be medical masks or death masks.
Yet another pure binary choice:
https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2020/05/trump-masks-for-me-but-not-for-thee/
Kill all government.
Then when conservatives and libertarians ask where did that thing go that was securing their rights and protecting their asses, kill them for asking.
Vermin scum republican governor goes into hiding after possibly catching the Covid-19 in the fucking White House …. IN THE FUCKING WHITE HOUSE!!!! … and after ordering Iowa’s citizens to die … or die starving.
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/5/11/1944330/-Iowa-governor-who-declared-victory-over-coronavirus-now-quarantining-after-White-House-visit
What you gonna do decent conservatives?
It’s little hard to use those trigger fingers when the thumbs they are attached to are stuck up your asses.
Vermin scum republican governor goes into hiding after possibly catching the Covid-19 in the fucking White House …. IN THE FUCKING WHITE HOUSE!!!! … and after ordering Iowa’s citizens to die … or die starving.
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/5/11/1944330/-Iowa-governor-who-declared-victory-over-coronavirus-now-quarantining-after-White-House-visit
What you gonna do decent conservatives?
It’s little hard to use those trigger fingers when the thumbs they are attached to are stuck up your asses.
How many people would stop brushing their teeth if their governor released an unenforceable directive for citizens to brush their teeth?
How many people would stop brushing their teeth if their governor released an unenforceable directive for citizens to brush their teeth?
I’m waiting for JDT to suggest that the governor issue an (unenforceable) edict that citizens not commit suicide. Just to see what would happen.
I’m waiting for JDT to suggest that the governor issue an (unenforceable) edict that citizens not commit suicide. Just to see what would happen.
Four out of five dentists are elitist know-it-alls.
The fifth one charges more than the others anyhow, on account of the fact that you run up the bills to maintain a good case of the trench mouth.
If you notice the teeth of red staters, I do believe they may have never started brushing.
Fluoride. The chemical that has never passed Larry Kudlow’s lips.
The tooth fairy has lobbied for years against including dentistry benefits in Medicaid.
Bend over and say Owww!
Four out of five dentists are elitist know-it-alls.
The fifth one charges more than the others anyhow, on account of the fact that you run up the bills to maintain a good case of the trench mouth.
If you notice the teeth of red staters, I do believe they may have never started brushing.
Fluoride. The chemical that has never passed Larry Kudlow’s lips.
The tooth fairy has lobbied for years against including dentistry benefits in Medicaid.
Bend over and say Owww!
her lawyer also says the check issue wasn’t the cause of her termination.
Link to Wigdor’s statement? I can’t find anything.
(though, of course he’d say that)
Is there any evidence to the contrary?
her lawyer also says the check issue wasn’t the cause of her termination.
Link to Wigdor’s statement? I can’t find anything.
(though, of course he’d say that)
Is there any evidence to the contrary?
Ufficio — I found this earlier today, because one of the other obscure tweets or references mentioned Townhall, whatever that is (“conservative media” apparently).
It’s still someone saying they spoke to Wigdor, not Wigdor directly. And not a major news source. And no independent corroboration, just another train of cites of cites of cites of someone who looked something up or purports to have talked to someone.
I don’t get it. Is the theory that if this can be proven, people who believe her accusations against Biden will stop believing her? Rather than people who believe her simply not believing the “proof”? And if this is what constitutes “proof,” good luck with that anyhow.
Ufficio — I found this earlier today, because one of the other obscure tweets or references mentioned Townhall, whatever that is (“conservative media” apparently).
It’s still someone saying they spoke to Wigdor, not Wigdor directly. And not a major news source. And no independent corroboration, just another train of cites of cites of cites of someone who looked something up or purports to have talked to someone.
I don’t get it. Is the theory that if this can be proven, people who believe her accusations against Biden will stop believing her? Rather than people who believe her simply not believing the “proof”? And if this is what constitutes “proof,” good luck with that anyhow.
I don’t get it.
Taking a break from lurking to explain what I think of this.
In most criminal cases, credibility of the witness is an issue. Obviously, in sexual assault cases, that’s problematic. It’s still relevant though, because someone who isn’t very trustworthy, who maybe has an ulterior motive that isn’t the truth, and whose story doesn’t shake out: it’s probably a good idea to consider it.
This isn’t a matter of: “Why was she wearing that dress? Wasn’t she asking for it?” or “She has sex with a lot of people. Why is this different?”
This is a matter of: This woman has a strange affiliation with Biden’s political enemies, including Putin. Her witnesses were coached. She has changed her story a number of times. Now, it appears, she resigned from Biden’s staff abruptly not (perhaps) because of sexual abuse? harassment? but because she was charged with a crime involving dishonesty.
Okay, when I was a young person, I lost track of my checkbook balance from time to time, and bounced a check occasionally. I was fortunate later in life to be able to afford to keep a cushion (and avoid those horrible fees). Many people can’t afford a cushion – I get that. But people are rarely charged with a criminal offense simply for bouncing a check from time to time. Just saying – has anyone else bounced a check and not been charged? And been charged?
In summary, of course: a lot of people are not going to change their mind. But there’s context here about whether this story is credible.
I don’t get it.
Taking a break from lurking to explain what I think of this.
In most criminal cases, credibility of the witness is an issue. Obviously, in sexual assault cases, that’s problematic. It’s still relevant though, because someone who isn’t very trustworthy, who maybe has an ulterior motive that isn’t the truth, and whose story doesn’t shake out: it’s probably a good idea to consider it.
This isn’t a matter of: “Why was she wearing that dress? Wasn’t she asking for it?” or “She has sex with a lot of people. Why is this different?”
This is a matter of: This woman has a strange affiliation with Biden’s political enemies, including Putin. Her witnesses were coached. She has changed her story a number of times. Now, it appears, she resigned from Biden’s staff abruptly not (perhaps) because of sexual abuse? harassment? but because she was charged with a crime involving dishonesty.
Okay, when I was a young person, I lost track of my checkbook balance from time to time, and bounced a check occasionally. I was fortunate later in life to be able to afford to keep a cushion (and avoid those horrible fees). Many people can’t afford a cushion – I get that. But people are rarely charged with a criminal offense simply for bouncing a check from time to time. Just saying – has anyone else bounced a check and not been charged? And been charged?
In summary, of course: a lot of people are not going to change their mind. But there’s context here about whether this story is credible.
I, too, have bounced a check or two (decades ago!), and was charged. A fee.
But criminal charges? That’s a whole different world. That’s not mere sloppyness, or running too close to the edge; that takes intent to be dishonest.
I, too, have bounced a check or two (decades ago!), and was charged. A fee.
But criminal charges? That’s a whole different world. That’s not mere sloppyness, or running too close to the edge; that takes intent to be dishonest.
How many people would stop brushing their teeth if their governor released an unenforceable directive for citizens to brush their teeth?
You know, I went to link to Vermin Supreme’s campaign site, because mandatory tooth brushing was part of his platform. The other part was a pony for everyone.
But Supreme’s a Libertarian now, and tooth brushes and ponies have disappeared from his platform, only to be replaced by free market bushwah.
So, no link. Even the true Vermin, the once and future Vermin, has sold out.
It’s a sad day for America. 🙁
How many people would stop brushing their teeth if their governor released an unenforceable directive for citizens to brush their teeth?
You know, I went to link to Vermin Supreme’s campaign site, because mandatory tooth brushing was part of his platform. The other part was a pony for everyone.
But Supreme’s a Libertarian now, and tooth brushes and ponies have disappeared from his platform, only to be replaced by free market bushwah.
So, no link. Even the true Vermin, the once and future Vermin, has sold out.
It’s a sad day for America. 🙁
@sapient — that’s all tolerably obvious. What I was referring to when I wrote “I don’t get it” was the credence given to some dude on Twitter.
There’s more to be said, but never mind, I need to get something useful done.
@sapient — that’s all tolerably obvious. What I was referring to when I wrote “I don’t get it” was the credence given to some dude on Twitter.
There’s more to be said, but never mind, I need to get something useful done.
Graphs updated.
Graphs updated.
Is the theory that if this can be proven, people who believe her accusations against Biden will stop believing her?
Well, I think the theory is if more chum is in the water, attention can be diverted from other things. All it takes is some fake accounts to start putting stuff up. If Reade gets ripped apart in the process, hey, she shouldn’t have worked for Biden in the first place. This then paints anyone who may really have something to say about the topic as being false etc etc.
I think that FB, either consciously or by accident, has discovered this. The way everything is set up (likes, replies that break off into different subthreads, indifferent ordering and dating) is to raise the heat and attract eyeballs and then sell shit to them.
I’m sure most people have read this, but if you haven’t, do take a look at Frankfurt’s On Bullshit.
http://ruby.fgcu.edu/courses/twimberley/EnviroPhilo/bullshit.pdf
Is the theory that if this can be proven, people who believe her accusations against Biden will stop believing her?
Well, I think the theory is if more chum is in the water, attention can be diverted from other things. All it takes is some fake accounts to start putting stuff up. If Reade gets ripped apart in the process, hey, she shouldn’t have worked for Biden in the first place. This then paints anyone who may really have something to say about the topic as being false etc etc.
I think that FB, either consciously or by accident, has discovered this. The way everything is set up (likes, replies that break off into different subthreads, indifferent ordering and dating) is to raise the heat and attract eyeballs and then sell shit to them.
I’m sure most people have read this, but if you haven’t, do take a look at Frankfurt’s On Bullshit.
http://ruby.fgcu.edu/courses/twimberley/EnviroPhilo/bullshit.pdf
I wrote too quickly. I don’t know if it is true or not, but I can easily see people hopping on it, who just don’t care if it is true or false, but pushing it out.
I wrote too quickly. I don’t know if it is true or not, but I can easily see people hopping on it, who just don’t care if it is true or false, but pushing it out.
And sorry, this seems mansplaining-ish, just been dealing with a FB thread on a local group and it’s on my mind.
And sorry, this seems mansplaining-ish, just been dealing with a FB thread on a local group and it’s on my mind.
“Check fraud” sounds sinister, like she could be running an international forgery ring or something, but if you read the statute she was charged under, the offense is bouncing a check. There is that “willful intent to defraud” language, but SLO county has a program (linked upthread) where a merchant can file a complaint and you either enter a diversion program or are automatically prosecuted. It sounds like draconian policy and another excuse to harass poor people to me, but hey they’ve recovered $11M since 1989.
I did finally find a report in a large but distinctly non-reputable organization that reports that the charge was dropped according to Wigdor. (I refuse to link to Fox, it’s easily Googleable.)
So we’ve got a misdemeanor charge that was eventually dropped, consistent with a person in some financial trouble making an honest mistake. I’ll reconsider if more facts come to light, but right now this has zero bearing on Reade’s credible to me. I concede reasonable minds could differ on that point.
What really gets me though are people (some of those in Twitter threads linked to above), running with this and stating as fact that Reade was fired over this incident, which was the real reason she couldn’t find employment, the sexual harassment claim was a cover story because she couldn’t deal with the shame, etc., etc. (Aside: how much sense would it make to turn your cover story into a national affair thirty years after the fact?)
If you’re going to go there, you need to bring the goods. Otherwise, it’s just a smear. The eagerness to smear an alleged victim and the attendant impugning of anyone who’s had a brush with the law or been down on their luck is what I find sordid.
I wish a pleasant evening to all.
“Check fraud” sounds sinister, like she could be running an international forgery ring or something, but if you read the statute she was charged under, the offense is bouncing a check. There is that “willful intent to defraud” language, but SLO county has a program (linked upthread) where a merchant can file a complaint and you either enter a diversion program or are automatically prosecuted. It sounds like draconian policy and another excuse to harass poor people to me, but hey they’ve recovered $11M since 1989.
I did finally find a report in a large but distinctly non-reputable organization that reports that the charge was dropped according to Wigdor. (I refuse to link to Fox, it’s easily Googleable.)
So we’ve got a misdemeanor charge that was eventually dropped, consistent with a person in some financial trouble making an honest mistake. I’ll reconsider if more facts come to light, but right now this has zero bearing on Reade’s credible to me. I concede reasonable minds could differ on that point.
What really gets me though are people (some of those in Twitter threads linked to above), running with this and stating as fact that Reade was fired over this incident, which was the real reason she couldn’t find employment, the sexual harassment claim was a cover story because she couldn’t deal with the shame, etc., etc. (Aside: how much sense would it make to turn your cover story into a national affair thirty years after the fact?)
If you’re going to go there, you need to bring the goods. Otherwise, it’s just a smear. The eagerness to smear an alleged victim and the attendant impugning of anyone who’s had a brush with the law or been down on their luck is what I find sordid.
I wish a pleasant evening to all.
Times like this I would wish Marty & McKT would drop a brief note and acknowledge that this isn’t a “Left echo chamber” and give a nod to the evidence-based discussion.
Returning to lurking and despair.
Times like this I would wish Marty & McKT would drop a brief note and acknowledge that this isn’t a “Left echo chamber” and give a nod to the evidence-based discussion.
Returning to lurking and despair.
My impression is that facts do not matter in the whole affair except for the fact that accusations against Biden are made (and that he is an establishment Democrat of course). The truth or lack of it does not. Those who care beyond political exploitability are, unfortunately, a small minority.
My impression is that facts do not matter in the whole affair except for the fact that accusations against Biden are made (and that he is an establishment Democrat of course). The truth or lack of it does not. Those who care beyond political exploitability are, unfortunately, a small minority.
Which thing Priest? But if we are talking about Reade, this certainly reinforces the existence of disparate echo chambers. The right is as unwilling to question the victims credibility today as the left was in the Kavanaugh case and others.
Its unclear that talking about things that may or may not have happened thirty years ago, barring any more recent corroborated events that actually form a pattern, is productive.
But I dont get redo the past so karmas a bitch.
Which thing Priest? But if we are talking about Reade, this certainly reinforces the existence of disparate echo chambers. The right is as unwilling to question the victims credibility today as the left was in the Kavanaugh case and others.
Its unclear that talking about things that may or may not have happened thirty years ago, barring any more recent corroborated events that actually form a pattern, is productive.
But I dont get redo the past so karmas a bitch.
I *told* GOPers, over and over, that ObummerCare tyrannically prohibited (with tyranny!) the ingestion of chlorine bleach.
And they ignored that tyrannical limitation on their FREEDUM until He, Trump suggested it might be a cure for Karmavirus.
I guess I should count that as a “win”.
I *told* GOPers, over and over, that ObummerCare tyrannically prohibited (with tyranny!) the ingestion of chlorine bleach.
And they ignored that tyrannical limitation on their FREEDUM until He, Trump suggested it might be a cure for Karmavirus.
I guess I should count that as a “win”.
here is a report on the check fraud, Fox News (straight news segment, not one their disinfotainment pieces) . [FWIW, Wigdor is a big time Trump donor]
But people are rarely charged with a criminal offense simply for bouncing a check from time to time. Just saying – has anyone else bounced a check and not been charged? And been charged?
you seem to be assuming the bank is the plaintiff here. it wasn’t. it looks like the state of CA was, because Reade was failing to adhere to the terms of a state-sponsored ‘bad-check-writers’ program she was involved with.
here is a report on the check fraud, Fox News (straight news segment, not one their disinfotainment pieces) . [FWIW, Wigdor is a big time Trump donor]
But people are rarely charged with a criminal offense simply for bouncing a check from time to time. Just saying – has anyone else bounced a check and not been charged? And been charged?
you seem to be assuming the bank is the plaintiff here. it wasn’t. it looks like the state of CA was, because Reade was failing to adhere to the terms of a state-sponsored ‘bad-check-writers’ program she was involved with.
Priest: Times like this I would wish Marty & McKT would drop a brief note and acknowledge that this isn’t a “Left echo chamber” and give a nod to the evidence-based discussion.
Marty: The right is as unwilling to question the victims credibility today as the left was in the Kavanaugh case and others.
Is it even theoretically possible to construct a reply that misses the point more thoroughly?
Priest: Times like this I would wish Marty & McKT would drop a brief note and acknowledge that this isn’t a “Left echo chamber” and give a nod to the evidence-based discussion.
Marty: The right is as unwilling to question the victims credibility today as the left was in the Kavanaugh case and others.
Is it even theoretically possible to construct a reply that misses the point more thoroughly?
Well, it depends on who is seen as the victim in either case, doesn’t it?
Well, it depends on who is seen as the victim in either case, doesn’t it?
Hartmut, if you’re responding to me, I don’t see the relevance.
Priest made a very particular statement about an evidence-based discussion going on here, and Marty addressed him by name and then very pointedly ignored his point. The FSM forbid that anyone here should get any credit for anything; begrudgery is alive and well and comes when evoked.
Carry on.
Hartmut, if you’re responding to me, I don’t see the relevance.
Priest made a very particular statement about an evidence-based discussion going on here, and Marty addressed him by name and then very pointedly ignored his point. The FSM forbid that anyone here should get any credit for anything; begrudgery is alive and well and comes when evoked.
Carry on.
“The right is as unwilling to question the victims credibility today as the left was in the Kavanaugh case and others.”
“so karmas a bitch.”
Anita Hill says Instant Karma is a motherfucker.
Let’s say everything going back to Sally Hemmings is true. We’ll leave out all that went before that.
Sorry Lucrece.
Makes no difference in the Bullshit America we now inhabit.
That fake Christian America even misuses the term “Karma” is nuts. It’s as meaningless as when use they the terms “Shariah”, or “Deep State”.
Pigshit, dogshit, Bullshit!
But it’s the fake Christian filth America that will re-elect Trump* BECAUSE he has molested more women than Biden ever dreamed of, and that is winning to them as it defeats both liberals and the MeToo Movement, to mention just two fatalities.
So that he and the Republican Party are free to murder those now insured by Obamacare, the ones that are left after Trump has murdered tens of thousands by using Covid-19 as an election strategy, and maybe have a little nuclear contest with China (not that I would weep if both the Chinese and American governments were violently overthrown, with Bolsonaro going first as a dress rehearsal), just to mention a few more sordid things coming sown the road.
Karma is such a chameleon that the karma police can’t figure out who to arrest, so they take the piano player in the whore house into custody too just to make sure.
*The only reason some will vote third party and then feel virtuous and above it all is because third party candidates are so irrelevant that those who they have assaulted or raped in the past figure what’s the point of going public, not to mention the fact that both Republican and Democratic operatives aren’t going to waste perfectly good Citizens United bribe money on irrelevancies.
“The right is as unwilling to question the victims credibility today as the left was in the Kavanaugh case and others.”
“so karmas a bitch.”
Anita Hill says Instant Karma is a motherfucker.
Let’s say everything going back to Sally Hemmings is true. We’ll leave out all that went before that.
Sorry Lucrece.
Makes no difference in the Bullshit America we now inhabit.
That fake Christian America even misuses the term “Karma” is nuts. It’s as meaningless as when use they the terms “Shariah”, or “Deep State”.
Pigshit, dogshit, Bullshit!
But it’s the fake Christian filth America that will re-elect Trump* BECAUSE he has molested more women than Biden ever dreamed of, and that is winning to them as it defeats both liberals and the MeToo Movement, to mention just two fatalities.
So that he and the Republican Party are free to murder those now insured by Obamacare, the ones that are left after Trump has murdered tens of thousands by using Covid-19 as an election strategy, and maybe have a little nuclear contest with China (not that I would weep if both the Chinese and American governments were violently overthrown, with Bolsonaro going first as a dress rehearsal), just to mention a few more sordid things coming sown the road.
Karma is such a chameleon that the karma police can’t figure out who to arrest, so they take the piano player in the whore house into custody too just to make sure.
*The only reason some will vote third party and then feel virtuous and above it all is because third party candidates are so irrelevant that those who they have assaulted or raped in the past figure what’s the point of going public, not to mention the fact that both Republican and Democratic operatives aren’t going to waste perfectly good Citizens United bribe money on irrelevancies.
OK John Thullen, I’m with you for the most part but could you please refrain from using the term “vermin” in the future.
Imagery like this has been used by the Nazis to describe Jews, Slavic people, mentally and physically handicapped people etc. etc. e.g.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Eternal_Jew_(1940_film)#Jews_as_an_uncivilized_and_parasitic_people
And it is still used today mainly against immigrants and Muslims, e.g.
https://bit.ly/2Lkl9mv
Thanks
OK John Thullen, I’m with you for the most part but could you please refrain from using the term “vermin” in the future.
Imagery like this has been used by the Nazis to describe Jews, Slavic people, mentally and physically handicapped people etc. etc. e.g.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Eternal_Jew_(1940_film)#Jews_as_an_uncivilized_and_parasitic_people
And it is still used today mainly against immigrants and Muslims, e.g.
https://bit.ly/2Lkl9mv
Thanks
As far as Marty’s comment goes, it does take whataboutery to a whole new level in insisting that we can’t get any credit, not because of, say, Mao, but because of Fox News. Now we’re responsible for the failings of both the left *and* the right!
As far as Marty’s comment goes, it does take whataboutery to a whole new level in insisting that we can’t get any credit, not because of, say, Mao, but because of Fox News. Now we’re responsible for the failings of both the left *and* the right!
Now we’re responsible for the failings of both the left *and* the right!
Marty has been blaming the left for Trump since the very beginning (of the dark times).
the party of personal responsibility, donchakno
Now we’re responsible for the failings of both the left *and* the right!
Marty has been blaming the left for Trump since the very beginning (of the dark times).
the party of personal responsibility, donchakno
bc believes deeply in the rule of law.
And when asked about it by the FBI, he lied.
. . .Lawfare on Flynn
Sorry to do this out of order, but I started to respond and then life got really busy.
At risk of having a conversation russell doesn’t want to have, but also kinda sorta invited, I will simply offer another point of view (caveat: I’m not responding to all the “Trump” stuff, just the Flynn prosecution).
The problem with the Lawfare post IMHO is it completely misses the point and the analogy is way off base. This wasn’t an interview based on an anonymous tip that needed to be checked out. As the recently released docs show, at the time of the Flynn interview, the FBI had already cleared Flynn and Crossfire Razor was supposed to be closed. There was no active investigation. There was no basis to interview Flynn. And most importantly, they knew he was clean of any collusion (that is why Crossfire Razor was supposed to be closed). Thus, IMHO, the purpose was to get him fired. Flynn would have to be informed or would find out on his own of the other investigations into alleged Russian collusion.
That they could interview Flynn at all was simply because of the “amazing” mistake that they failed to formally close out the prior investigation and “our utter incompetence actually helps us.” Comey and McCabe were behind this (“7th Floor”) and Comey later bragged about sandbagging the incoming administration and bypassing normal protocol to interview Flynn.
The FBI knew exactly what Flynn and Kislyak talked about and knew it was entirely proper.
According to the agents that interviewed Flynn, in response to a question about whether he encouraged Kislyak to not “escalate the situation” in response to sanctions, Flynn said “Not really. I don’t remember. It wasn’t, ‘Don’t do anything.'” Flynn also stated that although it was possible, he did not recall the ambassador stating that Russia would moderate its response due to Flynn’s request. Flynn said he did not have a long conversation with Kislyak to “don’t do something.” That sounds equivocal to me.
And to the agents too. Flynn noted to the agents that they could just go listen to the tapes if they wanted to know exactly what was said. Based on this interview, both agents did not think Flynn was lying. And one of them was Strzok! I admit to being surprised that Strzok would state that given his bias.
But then the report (the 302) went through what appears to have been heavy editing. Texts between Page and Strzok (the biased lovers) show that Strzok was editing the 302 and, in his own words, trying not to completely re-write it. While 302s are supposed to be submitted in five days, this 302 went through multiple drafts and was edited by no other than Lisa Page. It was not finalized for weeks.
There is no tape on the Flynn interview. All we have is Strzok and Pientka’s 302.
The 302 was not disclosed to Flynn’s defense. Then, when pressed, two 302’s were presented one with “deliberative” on it. The prosecution had to explain to the judge why that was so because it was so out of the ordinary.
There is more. Read the exhibits to the motion to dismiss. You don’t have to accept the motion to dismiss as true. Just rely on the exhibits.
I interned at the U.S. Attorney’s office during the Clinton administration and had the privilege of working with the appointed U.S. Attorney at the time, obviously a Democrat. The professionalism in the office was readily apparent. Politics had no place there. The U.S. Attorney I worked under would never have countenanced such behavior by the FBI, nor would the FBI agents I interacted with have engaged in such behavior.
bc believes deeply in the rule of law.
And when asked about it by the FBI, he lied.
. . .Lawfare on Flynn
Sorry to do this out of order, but I started to respond and then life got really busy.
At risk of having a conversation russell doesn’t want to have, but also kinda sorta invited, I will simply offer another point of view (caveat: I’m not responding to all the “Trump” stuff, just the Flynn prosecution).
The problem with the Lawfare post IMHO is it completely misses the point and the analogy is way off base. This wasn’t an interview based on an anonymous tip that needed to be checked out. As the recently released docs show, at the time of the Flynn interview, the FBI had already cleared Flynn and Crossfire Razor was supposed to be closed. There was no active investigation. There was no basis to interview Flynn. And most importantly, they knew he was clean of any collusion (that is why Crossfire Razor was supposed to be closed). Thus, IMHO, the purpose was to get him fired. Flynn would have to be informed or would find out on his own of the other investigations into alleged Russian collusion.
That they could interview Flynn at all was simply because of the “amazing” mistake that they failed to formally close out the prior investigation and “our utter incompetence actually helps us.” Comey and McCabe were behind this (“7th Floor”) and Comey later bragged about sandbagging the incoming administration and bypassing normal protocol to interview Flynn.
The FBI knew exactly what Flynn and Kislyak talked about and knew it was entirely proper.
According to the agents that interviewed Flynn, in response to a question about whether he encouraged Kislyak to not “escalate the situation” in response to sanctions, Flynn said “Not really. I don’t remember. It wasn’t, ‘Don’t do anything.'” Flynn also stated that although it was possible, he did not recall the ambassador stating that Russia would moderate its response due to Flynn’s request. Flynn said he did not have a long conversation with Kislyak to “don’t do something.” That sounds equivocal to me.
And to the agents too. Flynn noted to the agents that they could just go listen to the tapes if they wanted to know exactly what was said. Based on this interview, both agents did not think Flynn was lying. And one of them was Strzok! I admit to being surprised that Strzok would state that given his bias.
But then the report (the 302) went through what appears to have been heavy editing. Texts between Page and Strzok (the biased lovers) show that Strzok was editing the 302 and, in his own words, trying not to completely re-write it. While 302s are supposed to be submitted in five days, this 302 went through multiple drafts and was edited by no other than Lisa Page. It was not finalized for weeks.
There is no tape on the Flynn interview. All we have is Strzok and Pientka’s 302.
The 302 was not disclosed to Flynn’s defense. Then, when pressed, two 302’s were presented one with “deliberative” on it. The prosecution had to explain to the judge why that was so because it was so out of the ordinary.
There is more. Read the exhibits to the motion to dismiss. You don’t have to accept the motion to dismiss as true. Just rely on the exhibits.
I interned at the U.S. Attorney’s office during the Clinton administration and had the privilege of working with the appointed U.S. Attorney at the time, obviously a Democrat. The professionalism in the office was readily apparent. Politics had no place there. The U.S. Attorney I worked under would never have countenanced such behavior by the FBI, nor would the FBI agents I interacted with have engaged in such behavior.
I specifically said I wasnt sure what Priest was looking for response on, a simple answer may have cleared that up.
I specifically said I wasnt sure what Priest was looking for response on, a simple answer may have cleared that up.
Yes, I’m very aware of and familiar with the use of the word “vermin” throughout history.
It has been used by powerful bullies to describe the Other, the vulnerable, and their perceived lessers, who are in the bullies’ eyes, expendable for one hateful bogus reason or another, and used as a pretext for mass murder.
Thus my use of the term to describe in America in 2020 our current crop of powerful right-wing haters.
It’s about time they were labeled as they label and treat the Other.
I really don’t see why it is that Jews throughout history, including those in Israel and the Mideast classified as vermin by certain Muslim countries, Slavic people, and the mentally and physically handicapped, and Muslims in America and Israel who are classified as vermin by our right wing conservative movements, and immigrants all over the globe, but especially in bullshit America which flaunts and then flouts its bullshit ideals (and demands credit for both), and the Uighurs in China, and even liberal American Jews who are considered ‘vermin” by a right wing American Jew now in power, Stephen Miller, are prohibited from using the term against those who want them dead, for it is the powerful killers who are the parasites and uncivilized, and today in America those people are the conservative movement personified by Donald J. Trump, even though even in his case, as Janie reports, it’s we vermin who get blamed for his rise to power, like goddamned fucking always.
Not that the historical victims of all this hate aren’t saints.
THEY didn’t use the term “vermin”, to their credit. Well, perhaps under their breath as they were asphyxiated.
Murder was their reward for their forbearance.
But yes, novakant, I will give it another try.
But it may mean shutting up altogether, which it would be in all of our interests for me to to do, and that’s OK by me.
More time left for the reading and the hunting up of Covid-19 testing, because Pence the Christian doesn’t seem inclined to share.
There has to be a word for his behavior.
Yes, I’m very aware of and familiar with the use of the word “vermin” throughout history.
It has been used by powerful bullies to describe the Other, the vulnerable, and their perceived lessers, who are in the bullies’ eyes, expendable for one hateful bogus reason or another, and used as a pretext for mass murder.
Thus my use of the term to describe in America in 2020 our current crop of powerful right-wing haters.
It’s about time they were labeled as they label and treat the Other.
I really don’t see why it is that Jews throughout history, including those in Israel and the Mideast classified as vermin by certain Muslim countries, Slavic people, and the mentally and physically handicapped, and Muslims in America and Israel who are classified as vermin by our right wing conservative movements, and immigrants all over the globe, but especially in bullshit America which flaunts and then flouts its bullshit ideals (and demands credit for both), and the Uighurs in China, and even liberal American Jews who are considered ‘vermin” by a right wing American Jew now in power, Stephen Miller, are prohibited from using the term against those who want them dead, for it is the powerful killers who are the parasites and uncivilized, and today in America those people are the conservative movement personified by Donald J. Trump, even though even in his case, as Janie reports, it’s we vermin who get blamed for his rise to power, like goddamned fucking always.
Not that the historical victims of all this hate aren’t saints.
THEY didn’t use the term “vermin”, to their credit. Well, perhaps under their breath as they were asphyxiated.
Murder was their reward for their forbearance.
But yes, novakant, I will give it another try.
But it may mean shutting up altogether, which it would be in all of our interests for me to to do, and that’s OK by me.
More time left for the reading and the hunting up of Covid-19 testing, because Pence the Christian doesn’t seem inclined to share.
There has to be a word for his behavior.
Maybe this belongs somewhere else, but looking today at Iceland, which has had only 10 COVID-19 deaths and is down to 15 active cases, all of which are now reported as being mild, the death rate is 0.56%. That is the result whether you use total cases or cases with an outcome as the denominator. Both percentages round to the same hundredth of a percent.
The problem is that 10 is such a small number to work with. It could have been half as much or twice as much as a matter of dumb luck. But Iceland is the only country to have all three of the following (from what I could find): 1 – at least 1000 total cases, 2 – a very small number of active cases relative to total cases, and 3 – a robust testing regime.
China, for example, has the first two, but not the last – not according to reporting, at least. (They’re supposed to be starting on an effort to test everyone in Wuhan, though. The results of that will be interesting, assuming it happens.)
For reference, COVID-19 as killed 1 in 400 NYC residents so far. That’s 0.25% of the entire population of the city. Depending on what percentage of the city’s residents you think have been infected, the Iceland number and the NYC number could be reasonably consistent.
Thoughts?
Maybe this belongs somewhere else, but looking today at Iceland, which has had only 10 COVID-19 deaths and is down to 15 active cases, all of which are now reported as being mild, the death rate is 0.56%. That is the result whether you use total cases or cases with an outcome as the denominator. Both percentages round to the same hundredth of a percent.
The problem is that 10 is such a small number to work with. It could have been half as much or twice as much as a matter of dumb luck. But Iceland is the only country to have all three of the following (from what I could find): 1 – at least 1000 total cases, 2 – a very small number of active cases relative to total cases, and 3 – a robust testing regime.
China, for example, has the first two, but not the last – not according to reporting, at least. (They’re supposed to be starting on an effort to test everyone in Wuhan, though. The results of that will be interesting, assuming it happens.)
For reference, COVID-19 as killed 1 in 400 NYC residents so far. That’s 0.25% of the entire population of the city. Depending on what percentage of the city’s residents you think have been infected, the Iceland number and the NYC number could be reasonably consistent.
Thoughts?
I look forward to Trump and Barr arresting Obama and the FBI hippies and the detailed explanations from the usual suspects about why those prosecutions might be a bit sketchy.
$13 million for Benghazi and not a fucking peep all that time except for “both sides do it”.
Too many deep states in the kitchen does not a government make.
I look forward to Trump and Barr arresting Obama and the FBI hippies and the detailed explanations from the usual suspects about why those prosecutions might be a bit sketchy.
$13 million for Benghazi and not a fucking peep all that time except for “both sides do it”.
Too many deep states in the kitchen does not a government make.
An antibody study showed about 25% of NYC residents had been infected, so about 2 million.
https://www.livescience.com/covid-antibody-test-results-new-york-test.html
The higher relative prevalence means that the number is less likely to be overwhelmed by false positives, as in the Santa Clara study.
20k confirmed and probable deaths would put the NYC death rate right around 1%. The antibody study was form a few weeks ago which would tend to put that number lower. Deaths lag and reported deaths are much lower than excess deaths, which would tend to put that number higher.
An antibody study showed about 25% of NYC residents had been infected, so about 2 million.
https://www.livescience.com/covid-antibody-test-results-new-york-test.html
The higher relative prevalence means that the number is less likely to be overwhelmed by false positives, as in the Santa Clara study.
20k confirmed and probable deaths would put the NYC death rate right around 1%. The antibody study was form a few weeks ago which would tend to put that number lower. Deaths lag and reported deaths are much lower than excess deaths, which would tend to put that number higher.
JDT: I’m with novakant, as I wrote several months ago. On that occasion, all I got for my pains was the mockery of an increased and more “creative” throwing around of the word “vermin.”
As to “there has to be a word…” — the English language has a staggeringly large and varied vocabulary. Check it out.
I still wonder what you think you’re accomplishing.
JDT: I’m with novakant, as I wrote several months ago. On that occasion, all I got for my pains was the mockery of an increased and more “creative” throwing around of the word “vermin.”
As to “there has to be a word…” — the English language has a staggeringly large and varied vocabulary. Check it out.
I still wonder what you think you’re accomplishing.
bc, would it be too much to ask for sources on the state of the investigations when Flynn was interviewed? And for the quotes attributed to Comey et al on the subject. Just a couple of links would be sufficient.
Thanks
bc, would it be too much to ask for sources on the state of the investigations when Flynn was interviewed? And for the quotes attributed to Comey et al on the subject. Just a couple of links would be sufficient.
Thanks
JanieM, I was simply sarcastic. In both the case of Kavanaugh and Biden one has to ask people whom they consider as the victim and whom the attacker. The answer is of course usually a good indicator of party affiliation (and to a lesser degree of sex). I an unkind reading one could have construed a certain kind of consistency in Marty’s (rather vague) post by assuming that he answered the victim/attacker question differently for both cases (my personal guess is that he does not).
JanieM, I was simply sarcastic. In both the case of Kavanaugh and Biden one has to ask people whom they consider as the victim and whom the attacker. The answer is of course usually a good indicator of party affiliation (and to a lesser degree of sex). I an unkind reading one could have construed a certain kind of consistency in Marty’s (rather vague) post by assuming that he answered the victim/attacker question differently for both cases (my personal guess is that he does not).
hey bc, thank you for your thoughtful reply.
There was no basis to interview Flynn.
My understanding is that the plain fact of Flynn reaching out to Kislyak after sanctions were imposed by Obama was ample justification for investigating him. Whether that was a continuation of an existing investigation or not.
Based on this comment of yours:
The FBI knew exactly what Flynn and Kislyak talked about and knew it was entirely proper.
My guess is that you find that justification insufficient. If so, I disagree.
I don’t disagree that the FBI has become politicized, however as far as I can tell that’s in both directions. The Clinton email “October Surprise” BS was apparently prompted by the intensely anti-Clinton vibe in the FBI’s NY bureau. And I’m not sure the “has become” part is accurate either, the FBI has been a highly political, and highly conservative, organization since J Edgar’s days.
Why the hell was Flynn reaching out to Kislyak immediately after sanctions were imposed? Why the hell were Flynn and Kushner talking to Kislyak about setting up communications back channels using Russian infrastructure?
Right?
The whole “there was no there there” argument fails to pass the smell test. What Comey bragged about, and whether Strzok and Page were canoodling, is beside the freaking point.
What the hell is the incoming national security advisor doing chatting with the Russian ambassador about sanctions imposed on the Russians for interfering in our electoral process?
It seems like an entirely reasonable question for the FBI to want to answer. It’s hard for me to imagine anybody disagreeing with that, but I’ve grown used to living in a world of hard to imagine things.
hey bc, thank you for your thoughtful reply.
There was no basis to interview Flynn.
My understanding is that the plain fact of Flynn reaching out to Kislyak after sanctions were imposed by Obama was ample justification for investigating him. Whether that was a continuation of an existing investigation or not.
Based on this comment of yours:
The FBI knew exactly what Flynn and Kislyak talked about and knew it was entirely proper.
My guess is that you find that justification insufficient. If so, I disagree.
I don’t disagree that the FBI has become politicized, however as far as I can tell that’s in both directions. The Clinton email “October Surprise” BS was apparently prompted by the intensely anti-Clinton vibe in the FBI’s NY bureau. And I’m not sure the “has become” part is accurate either, the FBI has been a highly political, and highly conservative, organization since J Edgar’s days.
Why the hell was Flynn reaching out to Kislyak immediately after sanctions were imposed? Why the hell were Flynn and Kushner talking to Kislyak about setting up communications back channels using Russian infrastructure?
Right?
The whole “there was no there there” argument fails to pass the smell test. What Comey bragged about, and whether Strzok and Page were canoodling, is beside the freaking point.
What the hell is the incoming national security advisor doing chatting with the Russian ambassador about sanctions imposed on the Russians for interfering in our electoral process?
It seems like an entirely reasonable question for the FBI to want to answer. It’s hard for me to imagine anybody disagreeing with that, but I’ve grown used to living in a world of hard to imagine things.
My take on the Tara Reade / Biden story is that I find her generally credible, but I’m not going to spend much time looking into it because I (would?) have no choice but to vote for Biden even if Reade’s allegations were true. (The parenthetical “would?” added because my state is going for Biden with near certainty regardless of how I vote, so I could vote third party or abstain with very little risk.)
Given a binary choice between the current president and a Biden guilty of sexually assaulting Tara Reade in 1993, I’d be stuck with the lesser evil of the latter. A sh*t choice, but that’s what is possibly being offered.
I’m also open to the possibility that Tara Reade is a self-serving liar. It’s just not something I’m putting much energy into figuring out.
My take on the Tara Reade / Biden story is that I find her generally credible, but I’m not going to spend much time looking into it because I (would?) have no choice but to vote for Biden even if Reade’s allegations were true. (The parenthetical “would?” added because my state is going for Biden with near certainty regardless of how I vote, so I could vote third party or abstain with very little risk.)
Given a binary choice between the current president and a Biden guilty of sexually assaulting Tara Reade in 1993, I’d be stuck with the lesser evil of the latter. A sh*t choice, but that’s what is possibly being offered.
I’m also open to the possibility that Tara Reade is a self-serving liar. It’s just not something I’m putting much energy into figuring out.
Janie wrote:
“I still wonder what you think you’re accomplishing.”
I don’t kid myself that my commentary anywhere accomplishes anything in the world, although I thanked the nice asthmatic lady who is forced to clean the hallways in my apartment building in spite of the dangers her livelihood exposes her to and slipped her some cash for her trouble.
I apologize for the earlier mockery. And thank you for your contributions here.
‘”there has to be a word…” — the English language has a staggeringly large and varied vocabulary. Check it out.’
I’m fully aware of the vocabulary. We require new words.
I’ve run out.
Silence is a word.
Janie wrote:
“I still wonder what you think you’re accomplishing.”
I don’t kid myself that my commentary anywhere accomplishes anything in the world, although I thanked the nice asthmatic lady who is forced to clean the hallways in my apartment building in spite of the dangers her livelihood exposes her to and slipped her some cash for her trouble.
I apologize for the earlier mockery. And thank you for your contributions here.
‘”there has to be a word…” — the English language has a staggeringly large and varied vocabulary. Check it out.’
I’m fully aware of the vocabulary. We require new words.
I’ve run out.
Silence is a word.
My take on the Tara Reade / Biden story is that I find her generally credible
FWIW, not so much “my take”, but what seems likely to be so, to me.
I find it completely believable that Biden would have asked her to serve drinks etc because he thought she was attractive and “liked her legs”.
I find it completely believable that Biden behaved in ways that would have made her uncomfortable, including behavior that in today’s world would absolutely be considered to be sexual harassment. And not just Biden, I’d find it completely believable that such behavior was typical in Senate offices, then and, to a lesser but still unacceptable degree, now.
And I’d vote for Biden given all of the above, because he’s the ham sandwich. For good or ill.
The thing that is far more consequential, and for which I have neither an answer nor a clue, is whether Biden went beyond that kind of Senate-is-a-boys-club stuff to the kind of physical assault that Reade did not claim then, but claims now.
I would be, frankly, surprised to find that it was so, because it seems out of character for Biden. Then again, I don’t really know Joe Biden, and I’m no stranger to being surprised.
Nobody should assume Reade is lying, she does not deserve the kinds of attacks that I’m sure she is, and will be, receiving. And nobody should assume she’s telling the truth. She should have the opportunity to make her case, and then we should all proceed based on whatever reliable information comes from that.
Most likely, we’ll never know, and we’ll have to make our own choices from there.
My take on the Tara Reade / Biden story is that I find her generally credible
FWIW, not so much “my take”, but what seems likely to be so, to me.
I find it completely believable that Biden would have asked her to serve drinks etc because he thought she was attractive and “liked her legs”.
I find it completely believable that Biden behaved in ways that would have made her uncomfortable, including behavior that in today’s world would absolutely be considered to be sexual harassment. And not just Biden, I’d find it completely believable that such behavior was typical in Senate offices, then and, to a lesser but still unacceptable degree, now.
And I’d vote for Biden given all of the above, because he’s the ham sandwich. For good or ill.
The thing that is far more consequential, and for which I have neither an answer nor a clue, is whether Biden went beyond that kind of Senate-is-a-boys-club stuff to the kind of physical assault that Reade did not claim then, but claims now.
I would be, frankly, surprised to find that it was so, because it seems out of character for Biden. Then again, I don’t really know Joe Biden, and I’m no stranger to being surprised.
Nobody should assume Reade is lying, she does not deserve the kinds of attacks that I’m sure she is, and will be, receiving. And nobody should assume she’s telling the truth. She should have the opportunity to make her case, and then we should all proceed based on whatever reliable information comes from that.
Most likely, we’ll never know, and we’ll have to make our own choices from there.
Why the hell was Flynn reaching out to Kislyak immediately after sanctions were imposed? . . . What the hell is the incoming national security advisor doing chatting with the Russian ambassador about sanctions imposed on the Russians for interfering in our electoral process?
According to the 302, Flynn said he was trying to cultivate a working relationship with Kislyak prior to the sanctions for, among other things, the war on terror. Kislyak reached out to Flynn on 12/28 (not the other way around). The SOI on Flynn alleges that too. Flynn stated he was in the Dominican Republic on vacation and had spotty reception (hence the multiple calls).
I can be convinced otherwise if/when the transcript is released, but my understanding is that Flynn is alleged to have encouraged Kislyak to not escalate matters. I haven’t read that there was anything else said about the sanctions. Nothing, for example, suggesting that the Trump Administration would lift them, change them, a quid pro quo, etc. Just “don’t fire back please.”
If that is all that was said, that is entirely in line with the Obama Administration’s foreign policy. I’m sure Obama did not want to escalate matters further. I haven’t read that Flynn undercut the sanctions. Those sanctions were not in fact lifted, but the Russians agreed to not retaliate.
Hence we arrive at the good old ambiguities in language, memory and processing. If I don’t discuss the substance of the sanctions or lifting the sanctions but simply state “please don’t fire back” am I talking about the sanctions? Yes, in a way, but not in a substantive way as in undercutting the current and outgoing administration. Would it have been clearer to simply say “yes, I discussed them, but not substantively, and only in the context of not retaliating?” Yep. Absolutely.
But according to the 302, Flynn said in response to whether he discussed sanctions that it was “possible but he did not recall doing so.” So this is lying? See my drift?
And it seems to me that Flynn might have been confused about the timeline. Maybe because he was on vacation at the time? In the 302 he appears to be talking about a conversation prior to the sanctions, because he says he wouldn’t have been talking about sanctions he didn’t know about and that he found out about them in the press. So maybe he was conflating a conversation prior to the 28th with one prior?
Why the hell was Flynn reaching out to Kislyak immediately after sanctions were imposed? . . . What the hell is the incoming national security advisor doing chatting with the Russian ambassador about sanctions imposed on the Russians for interfering in our electoral process?
According to the 302, Flynn said he was trying to cultivate a working relationship with Kislyak prior to the sanctions for, among other things, the war on terror. Kislyak reached out to Flynn on 12/28 (not the other way around). The SOI on Flynn alleges that too. Flynn stated he was in the Dominican Republic on vacation and had spotty reception (hence the multiple calls).
I can be convinced otherwise if/when the transcript is released, but my understanding is that Flynn is alleged to have encouraged Kislyak to not escalate matters. I haven’t read that there was anything else said about the sanctions. Nothing, for example, suggesting that the Trump Administration would lift them, change them, a quid pro quo, etc. Just “don’t fire back please.”
If that is all that was said, that is entirely in line with the Obama Administration’s foreign policy. I’m sure Obama did not want to escalate matters further. I haven’t read that Flynn undercut the sanctions. Those sanctions were not in fact lifted, but the Russians agreed to not retaliate.
Hence we arrive at the good old ambiguities in language, memory and processing. If I don’t discuss the substance of the sanctions or lifting the sanctions but simply state “please don’t fire back” am I talking about the sanctions? Yes, in a way, but not in a substantive way as in undercutting the current and outgoing administration. Would it have been clearer to simply say “yes, I discussed them, but not substantively, and only in the context of not retaliating?” Yep. Absolutely.
But according to the 302, Flynn said in response to whether he discussed sanctions that it was “possible but he did not recall doing so.” So this is lying? See my drift?
And it seems to me that Flynn might have been confused about the timeline. Maybe because he was on vacation at the time? In the 302 he appears to be talking about a conversation prior to the sanctions, because he says he wouldn’t have been talking about sanctions he didn’t know about and that he found out about them in the press. So maybe he was conflating a conversation prior to the 28th with one prior?
Man who knowingly walked around Covid-19 positive exposing his “friends” and “colleagues” to a deadly virus pleads for humility from others (the Other) who quarantine immediately after being notified of their proximity to possible infection:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/fauci-fires-back-after-sen-paul-asks-for-humility-never-said-i-was-end-all-authority
Man who knowingly walked around Covid-19 positive exposing his “friends” and “colleagues” to a deadly virus pleads for humility from others (the Other) who quarantine immediately after being notified of their proximity to possible infection:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/fauci-fires-back-after-sen-paul-asks-for-humility-never-said-i-was-end-all-authority
All of what you say here could be true, and it still be worth the FBI’s attention.
Plus, the business about the back channel.
Plus, the sheer number and variety of contacts between Trump’s campaign and Russian actors.
Plus, Flynn was working for the Turks without disclosing it.
Plus, he lied to the FBI.
Plus, he pled guilty to that.
All of what you say here could be true, and it still be worth the FBI’s attention.
Plus, the business about the back channel.
Plus, the sheer number and variety of contacts between Trump’s campaign and Russian actors.
Plus, Flynn was working for the Turks without disclosing it.
Plus, he lied to the FBI.
Plus, he pled guilty to that.
Plus, Flynn was working for the Turks without disclosing it.
This, to me, was the BFD. Flynn took $500,000 from the Turkish government to specifically and explicitly change US policy.
Flynn was also part of a plot to kidnap a Turkish kidnap a Turkish dissident cleric living in the US and fly him to an island prison in Turkey.
I believe these are illegal actions on their very face.
Plus, Flynn was working for the Turks without disclosing it.
This, to me, was the BFD. Flynn took $500,000 from the Turkish government to specifically and explicitly change US policy.
Flynn was also part of a plot to kidnap a Turkish kidnap a Turkish dissident cleric living in the US and fly him to an island prison in Turkey.
I believe these are illegal actions on their very face.
I find it completely believable that Biden behaved in ways that would have made her uncomfortable, including behavior that in today’s world would absolutely be considered to be sexual harassment.
…
The thing that is far more consequential, and for which I have neither an answer nor a clue, is whether Biden went beyond that kind of Senate-is-a-boys-club stuff to the kind of physical assault that Reade did not claim then, but claims now.
I definitely agree with the first paragraph. And that the physical assault now claimed would be more consequential. But I have a real problem with, to be blunt, the mechanics of what she is now claiming there. To put it crudely, perhaps: pantyhose — how is he supposed to have gotten around those while standing in a Senate corridor?
Maybe she wasn’t wearing them on that occasion. Maybe something else. But it was definitely my first thought. And if what she is now claiming is true, I would expect it to have been addressed.
I find it completely believable that Biden behaved in ways that would have made her uncomfortable, including behavior that in today’s world would absolutely be considered to be sexual harassment.
…
The thing that is far more consequential, and for which I have neither an answer nor a clue, is whether Biden went beyond that kind of Senate-is-a-boys-club stuff to the kind of physical assault that Reade did not claim then, but claims now.
I definitely agree with the first paragraph. And that the physical assault now claimed would be more consequential. But I have a real problem with, to be blunt, the mechanics of what she is now claiming there. To put it crudely, perhaps: pantyhose — how is he supposed to have gotten around those while standing in a Senate corridor?
Maybe she wasn’t wearing them on that occasion. Maybe something else. But it was definitely my first thought. And if what she is now claiming is true, I would expect it to have been addressed.
bc, please forgive my massive ignorance. But what is “the 302”?
bc, please forgive my massive ignorance. But what is “the 302”?
FD-302. FBI form. Report/Summary of an interview.
FD-302. FBI form. Report/Summary of an interview.
From now on, my mental image of bc will be Scott Glenn in The Silence of the Lambs.
From now on, my mental image of bc will be Scott Glenn in The Silence of the Lambs.
They get tested constantly for Covid-19 AND all of them vote by mail:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/cafe/congress-ignore-trump-gop-lies-vote-by-mail
We don’t
The language fails me.
They get tested constantly for Covid-19 AND all of them vote by mail:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/cafe/congress-ignore-trump-gop-lies-vote-by-mail
We don’t
The language fails me.
Front-line postal workers can’t deliver McKinney’s mail, but they are clever enough to throw the election to Biden:
https://www.mediamatters.org/one-america-news-network/oan-newsweek-editor-suggests-unionized-postal-workers-would-manipulate
Meanwhile, front line medical folks saving lives while faking the Covid-19 are managing to have orgies while wearing garbage bags and week-old masks for protection from the fake Covid-19:
https://www.mediamatters.org/coronavirus-covid-19/alex-jones-claims-frontline-coronavirus-health-care-workers-are-killing
The White House and millions of so-called Americans are the willing audience for this stuff.
Yet my ratings continue to fall below 1:
Front-line postal workers can’t deliver McKinney’s mail, but they are clever enough to throw the election to Biden:
https://www.mediamatters.org/one-america-news-network/oan-newsweek-editor-suggests-unionized-postal-workers-would-manipulate
Meanwhile, front line medical folks saving lives while faking the Covid-19 are managing to have orgies while wearing garbage bags and week-old masks for protection from the fake Covid-19:
https://www.mediamatters.org/coronavirus-covid-19/alex-jones-claims-frontline-coronavirus-health-care-workers-are-killing
The White House and millions of so-called Americans are the willing audience for this stuff.
Yet my ratings continue to fall below 1:
Meanwhile, front line medical folks saving lives while faking the Covid-19 are managing to have orgies while wearing garbage bags and week-old masks for protection from the fake Covid-19
And you forgot to mention they are also stealing and selling the thousands of masks Trump was gracious and generous enough to send to NYC.
I may have renounced magical thinking, and thus engaging with rightwingers on political stuff, but I still want to say: wrs @01.16 and what CaseyL said @01.37.
Meanwhile, front line medical folks saving lives while faking the Covid-19 are managing to have orgies while wearing garbage bags and week-old masks for protection from the fake Covid-19
And you forgot to mention they are also stealing and selling the thousands of masks Trump was gracious and generous enough to send to NYC.
I may have renounced magical thinking, and thus engaging with rightwingers on political stuff, but I still want to say: wrs @01.16 and what CaseyL said @01.37.
From has a good article on the Trump BS:
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/05/trump-has-lost-plot/611548/
So you’re saying that the deep state set up this whole elaborate plot to entrap Trump, but instead of using any of that material, it instead sabotaged Hillary Clinton 10 days before the election?…
Meanwhile, the electorate has made up its mind…
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/05/12/donald-trump-haters-joe-biden-clinton-244629
… President Donald Trump is losing a critical constituency: voters who see two choices on the ballot — and hate them both.
Unlike in 2016, when a large group of voters who disliked both Trump and Hillary Clinton broke sharply for Trump, the opposite is happening now…
From has a good article on the Trump BS:
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/05/trump-has-lost-plot/611548/
So you’re saying that the deep state set up this whole elaborate plot to entrap Trump, but instead of using any of that material, it instead sabotaged Hillary Clinton 10 days before the election?…
Meanwhile, the electorate has made up its mind…
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/05/12/donald-trump-haters-joe-biden-clinton-244629
… President Donald Trump is losing a critical constituency: voters who see two choices on the ballot — and hate them both.
Unlike in 2016, when a large group of voters who disliked both Trump and Hillary Clinton broke sharply for Trump, the opposite is happening now…
Autocorrect REALLY doesn’t like Frum at the beginning of a sentence.
Autocorrect REALLY doesn’t like Frum at the beginning of a sentence.
Polls of Americans murdered by trump’s expert medical advice show, well … silence from the dead, or are they merely neutral, neither for nor against:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/trump-death-cult-5/
I remember when favorability polls among Pol Pot’s eyeglass-wearing faithful Cambodians began to plummet in the very early 1970s.
He believed those who wore eyeglasses were the elite but myopic intelligensia, the progressive know-it-alls, the near-sided professoriate, the suspiciously deep state, the pointy-headed educated jaspers with astigmatisms from out a town.
Course, as trump attended, which may be too strong of a word, Wharton, so Pol Pot attended the Sorbonne.
Kinda like Rand Paul certified himself to diagnose eye problems.
The declining polls were a mystery until they began finding piles of eyeglasses in the killing fields, but they couldn’t locate the owners.
I wonder how many more thousands of Americans would be dying right now if Flynn hadn’t been prevented by a legal technicality from whispering Putin’s advice into trump’s ear these last three years, perhaps as he served as Trump’s Covid-19 Czar after replacing the chumps who were testing too many Americans and saving too many lives, and thereby making America look bad.
Polls of Americans murdered by trump’s expert medical advice show, well … silence from the dead, or are they merely neutral, neither for nor against:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/trump-death-cult-5/
I remember when favorability polls among Pol Pot’s eyeglass-wearing faithful Cambodians began to plummet in the very early 1970s.
He believed those who wore eyeglasses were the elite but myopic intelligensia, the progressive know-it-alls, the near-sided professoriate, the suspiciously deep state, the pointy-headed educated jaspers with astigmatisms from out a town.
Course, as trump attended, which may be too strong of a word, Wharton, so Pol Pot attended the Sorbonne.
Kinda like Rand Paul certified himself to diagnose eye problems.
The declining polls were a mystery until they began finding piles of eyeglasses in the killing fields, but they couldn’t locate the owners.
I wonder how many more thousands of Americans would be dying right now if Flynn hadn’t been prevented by a legal technicality from whispering Putin’s advice into trump’s ear these last three years, perhaps as he served as Trump’s Covid-19 Czar after replacing the chumps who were testing too many Americans and saving too many lives, and thereby making America look bad.
The David Frum piece in Nigel’s link is seductive, but it’s way too early to be putting much stock in notions of how Clickbait’s voters are hearing reasons to abandon him. November is six long months away.
The David Frum piece in Nigel’s link is seductive, but it’s way too early to be putting much stock in notions of how Clickbait’s voters are hearing reasons to abandon him. November is six long months away.
Haven’t read the Frum piece yet, but Janie’s caution sounds all too reasonable and right. Nobody ever went broke etc etc.
Haven’t read the Frum piece yet, but Janie’s caution sounds all too reasonable and right. Nobody ever went broke etc etc.
I agree with the caution.
Trump will eat plenty more pieces on what WE think is the by the rules chess board in the next six months, before this election we think so innocently is going to happen.
Have you ever seen him eat a Rubik’s Cube? He makes a snack of it and the algorithm it rode in on.
William Barr is working on making a meal out of Monopoly, Chutes and Ladders, Clue, and Battleship.
As are McConnell and company.
You’ve heard of game theory? No, you haven’t. Not the one they are improvising as they go along.
Remember, the Post Office might be out of business by then. Trump will announce that postal workers are a danger to the country because, due to a shortage of testing kits, who knows where they went, we don’t know what else they might be carrying and spreading besides the mail.
Is it the Covid, or is it Democratic Blue State votes?
We ain’t seen nothing yet.
We have no idea, but I’ll try to anticipate for us, and I can barely keep up.
But maybe I’ll get me to nunnery instead.
I agree with the caution.
Trump will eat plenty more pieces on what WE think is the by the rules chess board in the next six months, before this election we think so innocently is going to happen.
Have you ever seen him eat a Rubik’s Cube? He makes a snack of it and the algorithm it rode in on.
William Barr is working on making a meal out of Monopoly, Chutes and Ladders, Clue, and Battleship.
As are McConnell and company.
You’ve heard of game theory? No, you haven’t. Not the one they are improvising as they go along.
Remember, the Post Office might be out of business by then. Trump will announce that postal workers are a danger to the country because, due to a shortage of testing kits, who knows where they went, we don’t know what else they might be carrying and spreading besides the mail.
Is it the Covid, or is it Democratic Blue State votes?
We ain’t seen nothing yet.
We have no idea, but I’ll try to anticipate for us, and I can barely keep up.
But maybe I’ll get me to nunnery instead.
There’s more to be said, but never mind, I need to get something useful done.
Of course. Why look in here at all?
you seem to be assuming the bank is the plaintiff here. it wasn’t.
No. I used the word “charged” as in “charged with a crime” which means the state is bringing the charge.
What I was getting at is that it’s a common scenario that people make errors, and accidentally write a check with insufficient funds in the bank. The person writing the check is charged (different use of that word) a fee by the bank, and the merchant is also charged a fee by the bank (at least, that’s how I remember it). The merchant will want the person writing the check to make it right, not only by paying the original amount but also the fee, and maybe an additional fee for all the trouble. It is embarrassing and costly for the person making the error.
This usually doesn’t turn into a criminal offense until there’s more bad faith shown by check writer.
It’s certainly true that the less money someone has, the less opportunity to make things right with the merchant, as Ufficio points out, but a crime is usually not charged for a simple error. Many people have made an error like this once in a while. Few people are criminally charged, because in order to be “willful”, there has to be more evidence of bad faith, when it looks more like theft than an accident.
There’s more to be said, but never mind, I need to get something useful done.
Of course. Why look in here at all?
you seem to be assuming the bank is the plaintiff here. it wasn’t.
No. I used the word “charged” as in “charged with a crime” which means the state is bringing the charge.
What I was getting at is that it’s a common scenario that people make errors, and accidentally write a check with insufficient funds in the bank. The person writing the check is charged (different use of that word) a fee by the bank, and the merchant is also charged a fee by the bank (at least, that’s how I remember it). The merchant will want the person writing the check to make it right, not only by paying the original amount but also the fee, and maybe an additional fee for all the trouble. It is embarrassing and costly for the person making the error.
This usually doesn’t turn into a criminal offense until there’s more bad faith shown by check writer.
It’s certainly true that the less money someone has, the less opportunity to make things right with the merchant, as Ufficio points out, but a crime is usually not charged for a simple error. Many people have made an error like this once in a while. Few people are criminally charged, because in order to be “willful”, there has to be more evidence of bad faith, when it looks more like theft than an accident.
Also, looking at the the website for San Luis Obispo, it’s about making it right with the merchant. My guess is that a staffer for a Congressman made more money than, say, I did, when I made my mistakes.
There are people who are bad with money, and I don’t resent them for it. But a down and out Congressional staffer in the ’90’s? She made more money than I did when my mistakes were made. Maybe it would be ignorable if it were the only thing.
Also, looking at the the website for San Luis Obispo, it’s about making it right with the merchant. My guess is that a staffer for a Congressman made more money than, say, I did, when I made my mistakes.
There are people who are bad with money, and I don’t resent them for it. But a down and out Congressional staffer in the ’90’s? She made more money than I did when my mistakes were made. Maybe it would be ignorable if it were the only thing.
Graphs updated.
Graphs updated.
What would a staffer for Biden (Senator for Delaware), be doing writing bad checks in San Luis Obispo, CA?
I’d expect her to be working in DC, or perhaps DE. Not on the other coast.
What would a staffer for Biden (Senator for Delaware), be doing writing bad checks in San Luis Obispo, CA?
I’d expect her to be working in DC, or perhaps DE. Not on the other coast.
I’d expect her to be working in DC, or perhaps DE. Not on the other coast.
No need to explain, right? I mean, it’s obvious Biden did it, right? Right?
I’d expect her to be working in DC, or perhaps DE. Not on the other coast.
No need to explain, right? I mean, it’s obvious Biden did it, right? Right?
Graphs updated.
Assuming this is what you meant by Graphs updated.
Just trying to be a [useful] friend. Without the link, nobody coming here without context knows what you’re talking about.
You’re welcome.
Graphs updated.
Assuming this is what you meant by Graphs updated.
Just trying to be a [useful] friend. Without the link, nobody coming here without context knows what you’re talking about.
You’re welcome.
Overdue, but thanks JanieM. I thought my point was not obscure – folks here were discussing an issue of some possible political importance and were not (to my limited powers of comprehension) responding mindlessly out of partisan expedience. I was vainly hoping get an acknowledgement of that. To be fair, since I called out certain commenters by name, I don’t think there was anything wrong by a similar response.
And to repeat myself, back to lurking and despair.
Overdue, but thanks JanieM. I thought my point was not obscure – folks here were discussing an issue of some possible political importance and were not (to my limited powers of comprehension) responding mindlessly out of partisan expedience. I was vainly hoping get an acknowledgement of that. To be fair, since I called out certain commenters by name, I don’t think there was anything wrong by a similar response.
And to repeat myself, back to lurking and despair.
The U.S. Covid-19 death toll has trumped the number of people who attended trump’s inauguration ceremony.
Unfortunately, they aren’t the same people.
Not a Maureen Dowd fan, but she had a few juicy bon mots in her column the other day.
“According to Trump biographer Michael D’Antonio, the president’s own grandfather, Friedrich, a German immigrant, might have died of the Spanish flu, contracted as he walked around Queens looking for real estate properties in 1918.”
“Trump has been leaning into his son-in-law, the pallid nonentity. Jared is like Renfield, the “zoophagous maniac” in Bram Stoker’s “Dracula” who eats flies and death’s head moths and does the vampire king’s bidding.”
Apparently, at one time, Trump even lied/exaggerated about the number of stories in the Trump Tower.
The U.S. Covid-19 death toll has trumped the number of people who attended trump’s inauguration ceremony.
Unfortunately, they aren’t the same people.
Not a Maureen Dowd fan, but she had a few juicy bon mots in her column the other day.
“According to Trump biographer Michael D’Antonio, the president’s own grandfather, Friedrich, a German immigrant, might have died of the Spanish flu, contracted as he walked around Queens looking for real estate properties in 1918.”
“Trump has been leaning into his son-in-law, the pallid nonentity. Jared is like Renfield, the “zoophagous maniac” in Bram Stoker’s “Dracula” who eats flies and death’s head moths and does the vampire king’s bidding.”
Apparently, at one time, Trump even lied/exaggerated about the number of stories in the Trump Tower.
You’ll want to scroll down this twitter feed and hear what New York Times reporter Donald J McNeil has to say about this mess:
https://twitter.com/camanpour?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1260274348977532928&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ftalkingpointsmemo.com%2F
I realize Amanapour and McNeil and the New York Times are Stalinist fellow traveler pinkos crawling with Mao cooties, but at least they don’t repeatedly lie about their allegiances to Mother Russia and other countries besides our own, like in-like-Flynn and company do.
You’ll want to scroll down this twitter feed and hear what New York Times reporter Donald J McNeil has to say about this mess:
https://twitter.com/camanpour?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1260274348977532928&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ftalkingpointsmemo.com%2F
I realize Amanapour and McNeil and the New York Times are Stalinist fellow traveler pinkos crawling with Mao cooties, but at least they don’t repeatedly lie about their allegiances to Mother Russia and other countries besides our own, like in-like-Flynn and company do.
In various cracker confederacy states, he could have stood his ground and defended his castle with deadly force and shot them all dead:
https://www.thedailybeast.com/lockdown-protesters-try-to-force-their-way-into-fresno-city-council-presidents-home?via=newsletter&source=CSAMedition
If the protesters had been black and/or immigrant and been across town, he could gotten in his car and driven to where they were and shot them dead in a couple of states.
In various cracker confederacy states, he could have stood his ground and defended his castle with deadly force and shot them all dead:
https://www.thedailybeast.com/lockdown-protesters-try-to-force-their-way-into-fresno-city-council-presidents-home?via=newsletter&source=CSAMedition
If the protesters had been black and/or immigrant and been across town, he could gotten in his car and driven to where they were and shot them dead in a couple of states.
I think it’s pretty cool that the Democratic Party can hire and coach so many method actors to fake the Covid-19 and its aftermath.
https://www.balloon-juice.com/2020/05/13/youve-recovered-now-what/
Most of those bodies inside the body bags the White House is distributing are liberals playing possum in order to get trump, and will emerge bright-eyed and bushy-tailed the day after the the election when their jobs faking the pandemic come to an end.
That’s why there are so few public funerals.
New York City isn’t really burying the fake dead in mass graves.
They are using taxpayer dollars to house these liberal snowflakes with the sniffles in tony apartment dwellings with concierge services and private chefs on hand until this hoax blows over.
Elon Musk has their number, believe you me.
I think it’s pretty cool that the Democratic Party can hire and coach so many method actors to fake the Covid-19 and its aftermath.
https://www.balloon-juice.com/2020/05/13/youve-recovered-now-what/
Most of those bodies inside the body bags the White House is distributing are liberals playing possum in order to get trump, and will emerge bright-eyed and bushy-tailed the day after the the election when their jobs faking the pandemic come to an end.
That’s why there are so few public funerals.
New York City isn’t really burying the fake dead in mass graves.
They are using taxpayer dollars to house these liberal snowflakes with the sniffles in tony apartment dwellings with concierge services and private chefs on hand until this hoax blows over.
Elon Musk has their number, believe you me.
This will end in total, bloody Civil War from sea to shining sea:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/lock-her-up-too/
This will end in total, bloody Civil War from sea to shining sea:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/lock-her-up-too/
I took a day to think about this.So the point was that questioning Reade’s credibility based on whether she had been arrested for bouncing checks, what might have really happened, etc was an “evidence based discussion” showing that OBWi isnt a left leaning echo chamber? Because one of the news sources was FOX?
And then, my response that the whole discussion was meant to justify (or not) discrediting the victim, just as the right did in the Kavanagh case thus demonstrating the very premise of the assertion was questionable was somehow nonresponsive?
The difference between the two is that voting for Biden even if he is a predator is considered acceptable, while voting for Trump even if he is a predator is [pick your epithet].
That’s pure echo chamber stuff.
I took a day to think about this.So the point was that questioning Reade’s credibility based on whether she had been arrested for bouncing checks, what might have really happened, etc was an “evidence based discussion” showing that OBWi isnt a left leaning echo chamber? Because one of the news sources was FOX?
And then, my response that the whole discussion was meant to justify (or not) discrediting the victim, just as the right did in the Kavanagh case thus demonstrating the very premise of the assertion was questionable was somehow nonresponsive?
The difference between the two is that voting for Biden even if he is a predator is considered acceptable, while voting for Trump even if he is a predator is [pick your epithet].
That’s pure echo chamber stuff.
No need to explain, right? I mean, it’s obvious Biden did it, right? Right?
My point (and I have one. A-hem) is that there’s something odd about the check-fraud allegations, particularly the claim that it was the cause of Reade’s firing.
No need to explain, right? I mean, it’s obvious Biden did it, right? Right?
My point (and I have one. A-hem) is that there’s something odd about the check-fraud allegations, particularly the claim that it was the cause of Reade’s firing.
Yes, given the binary choice, I will vote for the predatory house cat who takes out the occasional song bird or field mouse over the mass murdering beauty queen pussy-grabbing rabid wolf in order to possibly save the country, though Biden will have to wear a bullet-proof vest for the duration of his Presidency, if he even makes that far alive.
You stay above it all, Marty, so you and others can come back here next year and blame moderate liberals for whomever is elected and whatever happens.
I accept full blame ahead of time.
Jill Stein and Gary “What is Aleppo” await your pristine ballot.
Make sure you wash your hands after voting.
Some telltale responsibility might have stuck to your fingers.
Yes, given the binary choice, I will vote for the predatory house cat who takes out the occasional song bird or field mouse over the mass murdering beauty queen pussy-grabbing rabid wolf in order to possibly save the country, though Biden will have to wear a bullet-proof vest for the duration of his Presidency, if he even makes that far alive.
You stay above it all, Marty, so you and others can come back here next year and blame moderate liberals for whomever is elected and whatever happens.
I accept full blame ahead of time.
Jill Stein and Gary “What is Aleppo” await your pristine ballot.
Make sure you wash your hands after voting.
Some telltale responsibility might have stuck to your fingers.
Credit where credit is due.
Dreher gets it right:
https://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/rusty-reno-melts-down/
No word on who Dreher will vote for yet: it’s several million Covid-19 cases and deaths up against about a dozen obnoxious activist transsexuals across the country in his pristine moral calculus.
Credit where credit is due.
Dreher gets it right:
https://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/rusty-reno-melts-down/
No word on who Dreher will vote for yet: it’s several million Covid-19 cases and deaths up against about a dozen obnoxious activist transsexuals across the country in his pristine moral calculus.
What would a staffer for Biden (Senator for Delaware), be doing writing bad checks in San Luis Obispo, CA?
that’s where she lived at the time.
The difference between the two is that voting for Biden even if he is a predator is considered acceptable, while voting for Trump even if he is a predator is [pick your epithet].
there are no other choices.
Trump is on tape literally BRAGGING about doing what Biden is only (somewhat absurdly, IMO) accused of doing. Trump is literally encouraging Billy Bush to sexually assault women, and saying that his position gives him the opportunity and license to do it.
so, please shove that false equivalency.
What would a staffer for Biden (Senator for Delaware), be doing writing bad checks in San Luis Obispo, CA?
that’s where she lived at the time.
The difference between the two is that voting for Biden even if he is a predator is considered acceptable, while voting for Trump even if he is a predator is [pick your epithet].
there are no other choices.
Trump is on tape literally BRAGGING about doing what Biden is only (somewhat absurdly, IMO) accused of doing. Trump is literally encouraging Billy Bush to sexually assault women, and saying that his position gives him the opportunity and license to do it.
so, please shove that false equivalency.
I saw at Kushner was suggesting that the presidential election be delayed because of the pandemic.
Someone should tell him that it’s a really great idea, Demoncrats should vote on Nov 4, followed by a week of deep-cleaning of polling places to remove Democrat cooties, and then the Trumpers can vote on Nov 11.
I see no problem with this plan.
I saw at Kushner was suggesting that the presidential election be delayed because of the pandemic.
Someone should tell him that it’s a really great idea, Demoncrats should vote on Nov 4, followed by a week of deep-cleaning of polling places to remove Democrat cooties, and then the Trumpers can vote on Nov 11.
I see no problem with this plan.
About McNeil, his employer has his back….not
https://www.businessinsider.com/nyt-donald-mcneil-went-too-far-criticized-cdc-trump-2020-5
About McNeil, his employer has his back….not
https://www.businessinsider.com/nyt-donald-mcneil-went-too-far-criticized-cdc-trump-2020-5
So doing it, Biden, is ok as long as you dont brag about it?
Bullshit
So doing it, Biden, is ok as long as you dont brag about it?
Bullshit
I’m guessing Marty is feeling threatened by bc, and he’s really emoting so he can keep his role as Curly. Don’t worry Marty, bc can be Shemp…
I’m guessing Marty is feeling threatened by bc, and he’s really emoting so he can keep his role as Curly. Don’t worry Marty, bc can be Shemp…
I do not have to make the choice but my opinion is that another 4 years of Jabbabonk is not an option. What I would wish for is Biden agreeing to a full, transparent and in-depth investigation into the allegations and a binding formal declaration that, should he get elected and the case against him proven after that, he would then immediately resign without conditions (in particular without formal impeachment procedures*) and independent of any statute of limitation etc.
Maybe the VP candidate could also pre-name a potential mate for that case.
As for Kavanaugh: Should there be a Dem administration then it should order the justice department to start a new, this time non-sham, investigation into the allegations against Kavanaugh independent of whether there is a sufficient majority for impeachment or not and should publish the results in full and unabridged form. Also Congress should make a law to make this kind of investigation mandatory for any future candidate for the judiciary (in combination with making a vote on any presidential judicial nominee mandatory as well of course, or we’ll have not just Borking but Garlanding as a permanent feature).
*which the GOP will start (or demand to be started should they lack the numbers in Congress) anyway on whatever pretense.
I do not have to make the choice but my opinion is that another 4 years of Jabbabonk is not an option. What I would wish for is Biden agreeing to a full, transparent and in-depth investigation into the allegations and a binding formal declaration that, should he get elected and the case against him proven after that, he would then immediately resign without conditions (in particular without formal impeachment procedures*) and independent of any statute of limitation etc.
Maybe the VP candidate could also pre-name a potential mate for that case.
As for Kavanaugh: Should there be a Dem administration then it should order the justice department to start a new, this time non-sham, investigation into the allegations against Kavanaugh independent of whether there is a sufficient majority for impeachment or not and should publish the results in full and unabridged form. Also Congress should make a law to make this kind of investigation mandatory for any future candidate for the judiciary (in combination with making a vote on any presidential judicial nominee mandatory as well of course, or we’ll have not just Borking but Garlanding as a permanent feature).
*which the GOP will start (or demand to be started should they lack the numbers in Congress) anyway on whatever pretense.
So doing it, Biden, is ok as long as you dont brag about it?
I think cleek’s position is that Biden likely didn’t “do it.”
My position is that there’s a good enough chance that Biden “did it” that I have to consider what to do under the assumption that he did “do it.” Nowhere under any circumstances did anyone say it was okay to “do it.”
That’s bullsh*t, Marty, and you’re crossing a line where you go from a good guy I happen to disagree with most of the time to an a**hole.
I would be voting for Biden in spite of the possibility that he did something that was not in any way “okay,” because the only other viable alternative is even worse. And I mean “even worse” as an overall choice, not “even worse” because of pussy grabbing. I mean that the current occupant of the White House is disastrously incompetent, corrupt, cruel, vulgar excuse for a human being.
So doing it, Biden, is ok as long as you dont brag about it?
I think cleek’s position is that Biden likely didn’t “do it.”
My position is that there’s a good enough chance that Biden “did it” that I have to consider what to do under the assumption that he did “do it.” Nowhere under any circumstances did anyone say it was okay to “do it.”
That’s bullsh*t, Marty, and you’re crossing a line where you go from a good guy I happen to disagree with most of the time to an a**hole.
I would be voting for Biden in spite of the possibility that he did something that was not in any way “okay,” because the only other viable alternative is even worse. And I mean “even worse” as an overall choice, not “even worse” because of pussy grabbing. I mean that the current occupant of the White House is disastrously incompetent, corrupt, cruel, vulgar excuse for a human being.
Sheesh, how DO calendars work?
3 Nov normal, 10 Nov for Trumpers.
Okay, you get the idea.
Sheesh, how DO calendars work?
3 Nov normal, 10 Nov for Trumpers.
Okay, you get the idea.
So doing it, Biden, is ok as long as you dont brag about it?
lolwut
on one hand: an unverifiable accusation of sexual assault
on the other: not only an accusation. but an admission. and not only admission, but full-throated, boastful advocacy of sexual assault.
yes. they’re exactly the same!
christ. everyone knew you’d find some reason to stick with Trump. but this is more than i could have imagined.
So doing it, Biden, is ok as long as you dont brag about it?
lolwut
on one hand: an unverifiable accusation of sexual assault
on the other: not only an accusation. but an admission. and not only admission, but full-throated, boastful advocacy of sexual assault.
yes. they’re exactly the same!
christ. everyone knew you’d find some reason to stick with Trump. but this is more than i could have imagined.
Biden should be tried for sexual assault if the evidence is there and if found guilty, serve time in jail.
And then I will vote for him to govern the country for four years from his jail cell unless the Democratic Party replaces him on the ticket.
If they replace him with Daffy Duck, that’ll be President Daffy Duck for four years over the quacks now unlawfully installed in the White House.
IF there is an election, (and even if there is, the Republican Party will steal it; Barr will guarantee that) because here we go.
First, float/introduce the alternative conservative fascist reality, and then make it operational:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/05/13/jared-kushner-election-delay-coronavirus/
If there is no election at the designated time, there will be no country over which to govern, so who raped who and how many will be a moot point, the rule of law being absent and utterly irrelevant.
I’ll make sure of it.
Biden should be tried for sexual assault if the evidence is there and if found guilty, serve time in jail.
And then I will vote for him to govern the country for four years from his jail cell unless the Democratic Party replaces him on the ticket.
If they replace him with Daffy Duck, that’ll be President Daffy Duck for four years over the quacks now unlawfully installed in the White House.
IF there is an election, (and even if there is, the Republican Party will steal it; Barr will guarantee that) because here we go.
First, float/introduce the alternative conservative fascist reality, and then make it operational:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/05/13/jared-kushner-election-delay-coronavirus/
If there is no election at the designated time, there will be no country over which to govern, so who raped who and how many will be a moot point, the rule of law being absent and utterly irrelevant.
I’ll make sure of it.
I remember the olden days when conservatives loudly and righteously proclaimed, “If you are innocent, you have nothing to hide!” when it came to criminal procedural law, and similarly in the political realm with the HUAC investigations.
Those were the days.
I remember the olden days when conservatives loudly and righteously proclaimed, “If you are innocent, you have nothing to hide!” when it came to criminal procedural law, and similarly in the political realm with the HUAC investigations.
Those were the days.
Tucker Carlson:
https://www.mediamatters.org/tucker-carlson/tucker-carlson-if-america-doesnt-deport-undocumented-essential-workers-democrats
Deport his children, after neutering them.
Surely, the front door of his home is due for some harder knocking.
Tucker Carlson:
https://www.mediamatters.org/tucker-carlson/tucker-carlson-if-america-doesnt-deport-undocumented-essential-workers-democrats
Deport his children, after neutering them.
Surely, the front door of his home is due for some harder knocking.
hsh I think lots of people agree with your position. But you have to be able to see how people that held their nose and voted for Trump were crucified, even on this blog, for not really having principles.
So now the shoe is on the other foot and I believe that people that vote for Biden may still hold their principles and be in the position of making that hard choice. But it points out that all of the contempt in the other case was uncalled for.
If I recall correctly russell at some point said he didnt know how he might vote if the situation were reversed, but recognized the possibility he might vote for a Dem despite the accusation.
So I want to specifically say the awareness of the Hobsons choice was noted in this blog also at times.
hsh I think lots of people agree with your position. But you have to be able to see how people that held their nose and voted for Trump were crucified, even on this blog, for not really having principles.
So now the shoe is on the other foot and I believe that people that vote for Biden may still hold their principles and be in the position of making that hard choice. But it points out that all of the contempt in the other case was uncalled for.
If I recall correctly russell at some point said he didnt know how he might vote if the situation were reversed, but recognized the possibility he might vote for a Dem despite the accusation.
So I want to specifically say the awareness of the Hobsons choice was noted in this blog also at times.
I don’t see that there was a similar choice in the last election. But I don’t believe a bunch of ludicrous stuff about Hillary, so that’s probably why.
I don’t see that there was a similar choice in the last election. But I don’t believe a bunch of ludicrous stuff about Hillary, so that’s probably why.
what’s so great about Kushner is the way he assumed that he had some role in deciding whether to hold the election or not. he has no idea what he’s talking about, but he knows he’s always, somehow, in charge.
what’s so great about Kushner is the way he assumed that he had some role in deciding whether to hold the election or not. he has no idea what he’s talking about, but he knows he’s always, somehow, in charge.
But you have to be able to see how people that held their nose and voted for Trump were crucified, even on this blog, for not really having principles.
on one hand, an unverifiable and ever-changing accusation.
on the other hand, a racist, thrice-married, child-peeping, daughter-lusting, porn-star-whoring, serial bankruptor and accused rapist, who publicly encouraged foreign interference in the election while feigning religiosity and gushing a torrent of easily verified lies, who is then TOTALLY embraced and worshiped by the same people who have spent decades telling us how THEY are the ONLY Americans who value truth, honor, religion, family, sovereignty and personal responsibility.
totally the same.
if you have the brain of a weevil.
But you have to be able to see how people that held their nose and voted for Trump were crucified, even on this blog, for not really having principles.
on one hand, an unverifiable and ever-changing accusation.
on the other hand, a racist, thrice-married, child-peeping, daughter-lusting, porn-star-whoring, serial bankruptor and accused rapist, who publicly encouraged foreign interference in the election while feigning religiosity and gushing a torrent of easily verified lies, who is then TOTALLY embraced and worshiped by the same people who have spent decades telling us how THEY are the ONLY Americans who value truth, honor, religion, family, sovereignty and personal responsibility.
totally the same.
if you have the brain of a weevil.
@cleek re Kushner: I’m sure you’re right about Kushner in that respect. But I think ther emight be more to this little episode, i.e. it might be just one play in what is going to be a long campaign to delay/cancel the election, and/or to get the “base” (with all their weaponry and dumbfuckery) to believe that it’s legit to cancel the election.
Kushner says one thing today, walks it back, someone else says another thing tomorrow, walks it back, Clickbait blathers about the unreliability of mail-in voting, many states don’t have enough polling places to give people a shred of a prayer of social distancing while they vote, etc.
It’s going to be a long six months and an even longer winter, I fear, what with all the diseases we’re faced with.
@cleek re Kushner: I’m sure you’re right about Kushner in that respect. But I think ther emight be more to this little episode, i.e. it might be just one play in what is going to be a long campaign to delay/cancel the election, and/or to get the “base” (with all their weaponry and dumbfuckery) to believe that it’s legit to cancel the election.
Kushner says one thing today, walks it back, someone else says another thing tomorrow, walks it back, Clickbait blathers about the unreliability of mail-in voting, many states don’t have enough polling places to give people a shred of a prayer of social distancing while they vote, etc.
It’s going to be a long six months and an even longer winter, I fear, what with all the diseases we’re faced with.
I agree with every word of hsh’s 09.38, and his 10.48.
I agree with every word of hsh’s 09.38, and his 10.48.
if you have the brain of a weevil.
LOL.
if you have the brain of a weevil.
LOL.
one important point: the only election at the federal level is the EC. the elections citizens actually participate in are all run by the individual states.
i welcome and encourage all GOP-run states to cancel their elections.
one important point: the only election at the federal level is the EC. the elections citizens actually participate in are all run by the individual states.
i welcome and encourage all GOP-run states to cancel their elections.
Werk!?
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/think-of-not-working-and-die/
At this pace, Maynard J. Krebs (no testing required because he never shows up for work) and Donald Trump (daily testing required because he works us to death) will be the lone human survivors of our workaday pandemic world.
Werk!?
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/think-of-not-working-and-die/
At this pace, Maynard J. Krebs (no testing required because he never shows up for work) and Donald Trump (daily testing required because he works us to death) will be the lone human survivors of our workaday pandemic world.
G. Gwalter
G. Gwalter
hsh
From a pure policy standpoint Hillary was unacceptable enough to create the hard choice, believing she was also a crook probably made it easier for some. Add in a SC seat and it was a hard vote.
I readily admit that my vote was based on not being able to vote for either of them, so I picked the next best person that supported many of my positions. I think it is hard to make that principled vote against your own self interest (recognizing that self interest may include the belief it is best for the country).
I couldnt vote for Clinton for both actual positions and my brief she is a crook, and Trump will never get a vote from me. So I didnt really have a choice.
hsh
From a pure policy standpoint Hillary was unacceptable enough to create the hard choice, believing she was also a crook probably made it easier for some. Add in a SC seat and it was a hard vote.
I readily admit that my vote was based on not being able to vote for either of them, so I picked the next best person that supported many of my positions. I think it is hard to make that principled vote against your own self interest (recognizing that self interest may include the belief it is best for the country).
I couldnt vote for Clinton for both actual positions and my brief she is a crook, and Trump will never get a vote from me. So I didnt really have a choice.
A very brief summary of the policy-position choice we were faced with in 2016:
Republican-lite vs. indiscriminate institutional destruction
A very brief summary of the policy-position choice we were faced with in 2016:
Republican-lite vs. indiscriminate institutional destruction
https://www.thedailybeast.com/team-trump-pushes-cdc-to-dial-down-covid-death-counts?via=newsletter&source=DDMorning
These revised numbers just in:
Genghis Khan caused only 12 deaths during his lifetime and those were people who fell down manholes while having their attention diverted by his hilarious stand-up routine.
Union Army dead: 13,567,231 million, not including Abraham Lincoln and Martin Luther King. Confederate Army dead: Zero, and if you count Lindsay Graham, they are actually up one.
Cubbies World Series Record: Cubs Lose, Cubs Lose, Cubs Lose
9/11 death toll: six million murdered
The Nazi Death Camps: What Nazi Death Camps?
New England Patriots Super Bowl Victories: 52
Number of clowns in the Clown Car: two: John Wayne Gacy and Donald J Trump. The rest of the clowns took the subway out of abject fear.
Donald J Trump’s golf handicap: Varies according to who is asking, but minus seven would be a good guess if he’s putting on a green with 22 cups.
Number of people who attended Trump’s 2017 Inaugural: Everyone but me.
Death Toll from the Spanish Flu during World War I: Three Spaniards and George Orwell
Number of angels that can dance on a pinhead: Describe the pinhead’s comb over and warn the angels to dance elsewhere.
How much change do Chico Marx and Donald J. Trump give for a $20 bill? Check yer pockets once you around the corner.
Expected Death Toll from a nuclear winter: Every person on the globe except for the staff of the Wall Street Journal editorial page, so what’s the problem?
Expected American death toll from the Corona-19 epidemic: Dropping daily, so the White House and the Lieutenant Governor are taking volunteers to beef those numbers up.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/team-trump-pushes-cdc-to-dial-down-covid-death-counts?via=newsletter&source=DDMorning
These revised numbers just in:
Genghis Khan caused only 12 deaths during his lifetime and those were people who fell down manholes while having their attention diverted by his hilarious stand-up routine.
Union Army dead: 13,567,231 million, not including Abraham Lincoln and Martin Luther King. Confederate Army dead: Zero, and if you count Lindsay Graham, they are actually up one.
Cubbies World Series Record: Cubs Lose, Cubs Lose, Cubs Lose
9/11 death toll: six million murdered
The Nazi Death Camps: What Nazi Death Camps?
New England Patriots Super Bowl Victories: 52
Number of clowns in the Clown Car: two: John Wayne Gacy and Donald J Trump. The rest of the clowns took the subway out of abject fear.
Donald J Trump’s golf handicap: Varies according to who is asking, but minus seven would be a good guess if he’s putting on a green with 22 cups.
Number of people who attended Trump’s 2017 Inaugural: Everyone but me.
Death Toll from the Spanish Flu during World War I: Three Spaniards and George Orwell
Number of angels that can dance on a pinhead: Describe the pinhead’s comb over and warn the angels to dance elsewhere.
How much change do Chico Marx and Donald J. Trump give for a $20 bill? Check yer pockets once you around the corner.
Expected Death Toll from a nuclear winter: Every person on the globe except for the staff of the Wall Street Journal editorial page, so what’s the problem?
Expected American death toll from the Corona-19 epidemic: Dropping daily, so the White House and the Lieutenant Governor are taking volunteers to beef those numbers up.
“So I didn’t really have a choice.”
And here we are.
“So I didn’t really have a choice.”
And here we are.
“So I didn’t really have a choice.”
And here we are.
Four words which not only win the thread, and every other thread in the world, but make almost all future US political discussion tautologous.
“So I didn’t really have a choice.”
And here we are.
Four words which not only win the thread, and every other thread in the world, but make almost all future US political discussion tautologous.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-who/who-sees-potentially-positive-data-in-treating-coronavirus-idUSKBN22O1HG?il=0
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-who/who-sees-potentially-positive-data-in-treating-coronavirus-idUSKBN22O1HG?il=0
@hsh, GftNC, cleek — If enough people view their choices as “my way or let the country burn,” then we no longer have even a semi-functioning democracy.
@hsh, GftNC, cleek — If enough people view their choices as “my way or let the country burn,” then we no longer have even a semi-functioning democracy.
But you have to be able to see how people that held their nose and voted for Trump were crucified, even on this blog, for not really having principles.
I know folks who pre-2016 were totally aware of what a piece of shit Trump is, but pulled the GOP lever anyway because they wanted tax cuts, de-regulation, dismantling of the New Deal state, and conservative judges.
So political expediency overrode all their so vociferously espoused and strident “principles”. As I have stated before, I shall laugh at anyone who points fingers claiming that “the left” believes the ends justifies the means.
Nonetheless, despite their unrelenting hypocrisy, they defend Trump at every turn, and most have joined the Trump cult going all in for the lies, the cruelty, the narcissism, the incompetence, and the authoritarianism.
They have earned their crucifixion.
As stated so eloquently above, “And here we are.”
But you have to be able to see how people that held their nose and voted for Trump were crucified, even on this blog, for not really having principles.
I know folks who pre-2016 were totally aware of what a piece of shit Trump is, but pulled the GOP lever anyway because they wanted tax cuts, de-regulation, dismantling of the New Deal state, and conservative judges.
So political expediency overrode all their so vociferously espoused and strident “principles”. As I have stated before, I shall laugh at anyone who points fingers claiming that “the left” believes the ends justifies the means.
Nonetheless, despite their unrelenting hypocrisy, they defend Trump at every turn, and most have joined the Trump cult going all in for the lies, the cruelty, the narcissism, the incompetence, and the authoritarianism.
They have earned their crucifixion.
As stated so eloquently above, “And here we are.”
A nice little read.
A nice little read.
I kinda figured it was the Christian right wing, bobby, and a good part of the Christian mainstream for that matter, who are trying to kill us with their infestation of government by their malign operatives.
And, the traditional providers of INFORMation and the usual levers of change have been utterly neutered, purposefully, and it seems with cowardly acquiescence to murderous EVIL.
https://washingtonmonthly.com/2020/05/13/why-arent-more-newspapers-calling-on-trump-to-resign/
I kinda figured it was the Christian right wing, bobby, and a good part of the Christian mainstream for that matter, who are trying to kill us with their infestation of government by their malign operatives.
And, the traditional providers of INFORMation and the usual levers of change have been utterly neutered, purposefully, and it seems with cowardly acquiescence to murderous EVIL.
https://washingtonmonthly.com/2020/05/13/why-arent-more-newspapers-calling-on-trump-to-resign/
A nice little read.
blech.
but, you have to admit that the Dems (who don’t control any of that) didn’t scream loud enough. therefore, it’s all their fault.
A nice little read.
blech.
but, you have to admit that the Dems (who don’t control any of that) didn’t scream loud enough. therefore, it’s all their fault.
Cramer fluffing trump as the latter calls out rich guys shorting the stock market, as of course the Treasury Department secretly and illegally supports the market with taxpayer dollars:
https://twitter.com/jimcramer/status/1260577850110984194
Cramer, minutes later, heavy in cash all the way from the bottom:
https://twitter.com/jimcramer/status/1260613385596608514
The ZONE and SHIT are now one in pig fucker America.
Expect Trump to issue an executive order prohibiting all short selling (it ultimately makes the market go up anyway, but never mind) and put buying and the outright selling of stock by institutions and individuals and insiders as we approach the election.
Cramer and Musk and the Trump family and insiders of course will be exempted.
They’ll sell to their mothers.
Cramer fluffing trump as the latter calls out rich guys shorting the stock market, as of course the Treasury Department secretly and illegally supports the market with taxpayer dollars:
https://twitter.com/jimcramer/status/1260577850110984194
Cramer, minutes later, heavy in cash all the way from the bottom:
https://twitter.com/jimcramer/status/1260613385596608514
The ZONE and SHIT are now one in pig fucker America.
Expect Trump to issue an executive order prohibiting all short selling (it ultimately makes the market go up anyway, but never mind) and put buying and the outright selling of stock by institutions and individuals and insiders as we approach the election.
Cramer and Musk and the Trump family and insiders of course will be exempted.
They’ll sell to their mothers.
So doing it, Biden, is ok as long as you dont brag about it?
There’s a bit of a difference between someone who is accused, but pleads innocent. And someone who not only admits guilt but brags about it. Just for openers, the presumption of innocence doesn’t apply.
Now if Biden changes his story and admits sexual assault, or if he gets convicted of same, fine we can have a discussion of which is worse or whether they are equally bad. But until then?
So doing it, Biden, is ok as long as you dont brag about it?
There’s a bit of a difference between someone who is accused, but pleads innocent. And someone who not only admits guilt but brags about it. Just for openers, the presumption of innocence doesn’t apply.
Now if Biden changes his story and admits sexual assault, or if he gets convicted of same, fine we can have a discussion of which is worse or whether they are equally bad. But until then?
This restaurant is a few miles from the house in which I grew up in Pittsburgh. Driven by dozens of times:
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/red-lobster-customer-tangles-with-staff-in-this-ridiculous-mothers-day-melee-2020-05-13?siteid=bigcharts&dist=bigcharts
Make up your own commentary.
Imagine Trayvon Martin putting those moves on.
This restaurant is a few miles from the house in which I grew up in Pittsburgh. Driven by dozens of times:
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/red-lobster-customer-tangles-with-staff-in-this-ridiculous-mothers-day-melee-2020-05-13?siteid=bigcharts&dist=bigcharts
Make up your own commentary.
Imagine Trayvon Martin putting those moves on.
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/red-lobster-customer-tangles-with-staff-in-this-ridiculous-mothers-day-melee-2020-05-13?siteid=bigcharts&dist=bigcharts
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/red-lobster-customer-tangles-with-staff-in-this-ridiculous-mothers-day-melee-2020-05-13?siteid=bigcharts&dist=bigcharts
Maybe if Biden bragged about it, a few trump lovers would be convinced that Biden is the man for the times, given their predilections.
Maybe if Biden bragged about it, a few trump lovers would be convinced that Biden is the man for the times, given their predilections.
Nah. Consider that they’re buying Trump’s nonsense about the horrors of voting by mail. Totally unfazed by the fact that Trump (and Pence and numerous other Republican leaders) have been voting by mail for years. For them, in the end, it’s all and entirely about “my side” vs “them.” The specifics don’t matter.
Nah. Consider that they’re buying Trump’s nonsense about the horrors of voting by mail. Totally unfazed by the fact that Trump (and Pence and numerous other Republican leaders) have been voting by mail for years. For them, in the end, it’s all and entirely about “my side” vs “them.” The specifics don’t matter.
Speaking of which:
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/there-is-no-evidence-that-voting-by-mail-gives-one-party-an-advantage/
It’s not some wild, untested idea.
It’s like universal health coverage or gun control laws in that some people pretend there are no real-world examples from which to gain empirical evidence for what works and how well.
Speaking of which:
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/there-is-no-evidence-that-voting-by-mail-gives-one-party-an-advantage/
It’s not some wild, untested idea.
It’s like universal health coverage or gun control laws in that some people pretend there are no real-world examples from which to gain empirical evidence for what works and how well.
Yet more dirt on Obama, Clinton, and Biden:
https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a32461956/saudi-embassy-9-11-fbi-documents/
Yet more dirt on Obama, Clinton, and Biden:
https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a32461956/saudi-embassy-9-11-fbi-documents/
blech.
LOL…I didn’t see anything in the article about the Dems at all, but I am old and my attention sometimes wanders…or maybe you just assumed Matt Taibbi wrote the thing?
blech.
LOL…I didn’t see anything in the article about the Dems at all, but I am old and my attention sometimes wanders…or maybe you just assumed Matt Taibbi wrote the thing?
sorry. too much sarcasm, not enough wink-wink.
sorry. too much sarcasm, not enough wink-wink.
It’s not some wild, untested idea.
Indeed. Look, seniors are a bastion of GOP voting strength. Given a higher propensity of this group to vote in the first place and the commonality of “mobility issues” universal no questions asked vote by mail makes a lot of sense for those supporting the GOP.
But no. Make them stand in line.
It’s not some wild, untested idea.
Indeed. Look, seniors are a bastion of GOP voting strength. Given a higher propensity of this group to vote in the first place and the commonality of “mobility issues” universal no questions asked vote by mail makes a lot of sense for those supporting the GOP.
But no. Make them stand in line.
Given a higher propensity of this group to vote in the first place and the commonality of “mobility issues” universal no questions asked vote by mail makes a lot of sense for those supporting the GOP.
But no. Make them stand in line.
The principle of “If they (i.e. the libs) are for it, we are against it!” trumps actual vote gain benefit interest. And since the Democrats were the ones suggesting more vote by mail….
Given a higher propensity of this group to vote in the first place and the commonality of “mobility issues” universal no questions asked vote by mail makes a lot of sense for those supporting the GOP.
But no. Make them stand in line.
The principle of “If they (i.e. the libs) are for it, we are against it!” trumps actual vote gain benefit interest. And since the Democrats were the ones suggesting more vote by mail….
New antibody study from Spain estimates that 5% of the population (~2.35 million) has been infected:
https://www.publico.es/sociedad/primera-oleada-del-estudio-seroprevalencia.html
That would put Spain’s death rate at about 1.15%, subject to similar caveats as for the NYC numbers.
New antibody study from Spain estimates that 5% of the population (~2.35 million) has been infected:
https://www.publico.es/sociedad/primera-oleada-del-estudio-seroprevalencia.html
That would put Spain’s death rate at about 1.15%, subject to similar caveats as for the NYC numbers.
I was just about to post this, Ufficio, before seeing your comment. The same thing happened last week with another regular. Anyway…
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/without-a-vaccine-herd-immunity-wont-save-us/
The entire article is good read.
I was just about to post this, Ufficio, before seeing your comment. The same thing happened last week with another regular. Anyway…
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/without-a-vaccine-herd-immunity-wont-save-us/
The entire article is good read.
The Post Master General was fired for not falling in line with fascist Republican and Putin plans to steal the election by refusing to deliver all mail-in ballots, except those tens of millions mailed by Trump himself from the White House mail room.
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/vote-by-mail-under-assault/
Fuck you America. You think you are going to live through the savage killing violence that is going to topple your government once and for all?
The Post Master General was fired for not falling in line with fascist Republican and Putin plans to steal the election by refusing to deliver all mail-in ballots, except those tens of millions mailed by Trump himself from the White House mail room.
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/vote-by-mail-under-assault/
Fuck you America. You think you are going to live through the savage killing violence that is going to topple your government once and for all?
My son was just ordered back to work in Ann Arbor, Michigan.
He leaves Colorado on Sunday so he can follow the rule of law and quarantine himself for two seeks before starting back to work in the labs at University of Michigan.
https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2020/05/michigan-is-ground-zero-for-covid-19-resistance/
Looks like he’s heading into the shitty hell of American conservative republican fucking assholes on their fascist, disease-spreading rampages.
They had better hope nothing happens to him.
My son was just ordered back to work in Ann Arbor, Michigan.
He leaves Colorado on Sunday so he can follow the rule of law and quarantine himself for two seeks before starting back to work in the labs at University of Michigan.
https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2020/05/michigan-is-ground-zero-for-covid-19-resistance/
Looks like he’s heading into the shitty hell of American conservative republican fucking assholes on their fascist, disease-spreading rampages.
They had better hope nothing happens to him.
What is the essence of white conservative privilege? I’m glad you asked.
What is the essence of white conservative privilege? I’m glad you asked.
A doctor in Queens fights thru the pile of bodies:
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2020/04/27/a-new-doctor-faces-the-coronavirus-in-queens
You know Queens, where one abortion 73 years ago could have saved America.
A doctor in Queens fights thru the pile of bodies:
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2020/04/27/a-new-doctor-faces-the-coronavirus-in-queens
You know Queens, where one abortion 73 years ago could have saved America.
So doing it, Biden, is ok as long as you dont brag about it?
I’m just trying to keep track of which analogy is which.
Are we comparing Biden and Reade to Kavanaugh and Ford, or to Trump and the various women who claim he assaulted them plus the one whose assault he described in public?
Biden-Reade and Kavanaugh-Ford seem like a reasonable comparison, and I think that, way way upthread, Priest made what seems like an uncontroversial observation that “liberal” folks in this thread seemed open to the idea that Reade might be telling the truth. In contrast to the general conservative response (here and elsewhere) to Ford’s claims.
Biden-Reade and Trump-cast of dozens is not really an apt analogy. Biden has so far been accused of assault, but the merits of the accusation are at this point an open question. Trump literally described his own assault of a woman, publicly, as in, for broadcast.
When Biden does that, you’ll have a point.
To clarify my own position, if the merits of Reade’s case are no more substantial in November than they are now, I’ll vote for Biden. If Biden is found to have assaulted Reade in the manner she describes, I’ll find it hard to vote for Biden, and I’m not sure what I’ll do.
Hopefully, should that happen, the (D)’s will find a way to cough somebody else up, and I’ll vote for that person. Here’s hoping Reade either makes a truly persuasive case before August, or stands down.
But yes, a hard choice.
The difference between my hard choice, and the hard choice of the folks who have been “crucified” here by the likes of us, is the difference between the available candidates.
We all understand that you think Clinton is a crook. In contrast, we all know that Trump is a crook. Many of the people who voted for Trump knew, and know, he’s a crook, and they didn’t give a shit.
“That’s just business!”. Right?
And they voted for him anyway.
I could go on at length about all of the differences between my hard choice, and their hard choice, but I’ll leave it there.
Basically, Trump has exploded “tu quoque” as an argument for a generation. There isn’t any comparison between him and anybody else, and there isn’t really any comparison between people who support him and people who support anybody else.
He is sui generis, and I reject any comparison between the folks who voted for him and folks trying to figure out what to do about Biden.
So doing it, Biden, is ok as long as you dont brag about it?
I’m just trying to keep track of which analogy is which.
Are we comparing Biden and Reade to Kavanaugh and Ford, or to Trump and the various women who claim he assaulted them plus the one whose assault he described in public?
Biden-Reade and Kavanaugh-Ford seem like a reasonable comparison, and I think that, way way upthread, Priest made what seems like an uncontroversial observation that “liberal” folks in this thread seemed open to the idea that Reade might be telling the truth. In contrast to the general conservative response (here and elsewhere) to Ford’s claims.
Biden-Reade and Trump-cast of dozens is not really an apt analogy. Biden has so far been accused of assault, but the merits of the accusation are at this point an open question. Trump literally described his own assault of a woman, publicly, as in, for broadcast.
When Biden does that, you’ll have a point.
To clarify my own position, if the merits of Reade’s case are no more substantial in November than they are now, I’ll vote for Biden. If Biden is found to have assaulted Reade in the manner she describes, I’ll find it hard to vote for Biden, and I’m not sure what I’ll do.
Hopefully, should that happen, the (D)’s will find a way to cough somebody else up, and I’ll vote for that person. Here’s hoping Reade either makes a truly persuasive case before August, or stands down.
But yes, a hard choice.
The difference between my hard choice, and the hard choice of the folks who have been “crucified” here by the likes of us, is the difference between the available candidates.
We all understand that you think Clinton is a crook. In contrast, we all know that Trump is a crook. Many of the people who voted for Trump knew, and know, he’s a crook, and they didn’t give a shit.
“That’s just business!”. Right?
And they voted for him anyway.
I could go on at length about all of the differences between my hard choice, and their hard choice, but I’ll leave it there.
Basically, Trump has exploded “tu quoque” as an argument for a generation. There isn’t any comparison between him and anybody else, and there isn’t really any comparison between people who support him and people who support anybody else.
He is sui generis, and I reject any comparison between the folks who voted for him and folks trying to figure out what to do about Biden.
he has no idea what he’s talking about, but he knows he’s always, somehow, in charge.
Hey, he called a plumber. In between classes!!
An executive wunderkind.
he has no idea what he’s talking about, but he knows he’s always, somehow, in charge.
Hey, he called a plumber. In between classes!!
An executive wunderkind.
What are conservative republican officeholders reading?
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/raging-against-mere-life-the-federalist-has-declared-war-on-public-health-orders
We can’t censor them, apparently, even as they kill us.
“Is death the worst thing that could happen to you?”
If you answer “no, torture and suffering is worse” well, for republicans that would be the wrong answer too.
Taxes might be worse than death in their perverted gnarled ingrown world. Apparently, pornography is worse than death, second only to paw to hand combat with cougars and bears.
This, even as Jerry Falwell Junior’s wife, the cougar, orders up free porn on the internet. From the other room, it might sound like she’s dying, but we know how it is in extremis.
But I’m pretty sure Death is the worst, unless it’s the death of one’s child, which is incalculably worse.
Even God used Death as the worst threat in the Bible.
And then lied about everlasting life in order to make our physical death more acceptable during times like these.
I mean God didn’t threaten Abraham by announcing to him that Isaac would have to fight one of Tony Exotic’s tigers paw to hand, or Isaac would be made to watch porn for the duration of his natural life or he died of boredom, whichever came first.
No, God, like a conservative republican, was blackmailing Abraham into choosing HIM over Isaac, natch while God crossed his fingers behind his back and had lamb kabobs in reserve.
It was God’s lethal vanity project, a sort of polling operation, like Donald Trump’s self-idol-worshiping operation.
Of course, what Republicans and Federalists and sadists really mean to ask is “is Death the worst thing that can happen to someone else other than them.”
Especially if their livelihoods suffer, or they are asked to pay more in taxes.
And especially if the Other … us .. manage to vote before we perish.
I’m willing to conduct a double-blind experiment on a large sample population of Republicans to learn if Death is the worst thing that can happen to them.
I’ll be in the placebo group in which living out the rest of my life without any of them any longer living in my world will be the placebo effect.
I’m merely trying to prove that me living and them dying is the preferred outcome and could even be a cure for what ails America.
The Republican Party is a perverted death-loving murderous cult.
The punchline of the Federalist’s cult of Death in the article is this:
‘“Bosnian and Rwandan ditches are full of corpses whose betrayers were lifelong neighbors a week prior,” Skeet wrote, just a few paragraphs after detailing the demise of his in-laws’ street ball game.’
But they always get to suit up as the Hutu team in their stick ball games.
I am Comanche.
What are conservative republican officeholders reading?
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/raging-against-mere-life-the-federalist-has-declared-war-on-public-health-orders
We can’t censor them, apparently, even as they kill us.
“Is death the worst thing that could happen to you?”
If you answer “no, torture and suffering is worse” well, for republicans that would be the wrong answer too.
Taxes might be worse than death in their perverted gnarled ingrown world. Apparently, pornography is worse than death, second only to paw to hand combat with cougars and bears.
This, even as Jerry Falwell Junior’s wife, the cougar, orders up free porn on the internet. From the other room, it might sound like she’s dying, but we know how it is in extremis.
But I’m pretty sure Death is the worst, unless it’s the death of one’s child, which is incalculably worse.
Even God used Death as the worst threat in the Bible.
And then lied about everlasting life in order to make our physical death more acceptable during times like these.
I mean God didn’t threaten Abraham by announcing to him that Isaac would have to fight one of Tony Exotic’s tigers paw to hand, or Isaac would be made to watch porn for the duration of his natural life or he died of boredom, whichever came first.
No, God, like a conservative republican, was blackmailing Abraham into choosing HIM over Isaac, natch while God crossed his fingers behind his back and had lamb kabobs in reserve.
It was God’s lethal vanity project, a sort of polling operation, like Donald Trump’s self-idol-worshiping operation.
Of course, what Republicans and Federalists and sadists really mean to ask is “is Death the worst thing that can happen to someone else other than them.”
Especially if their livelihoods suffer, or they are asked to pay more in taxes.
And especially if the Other … us .. manage to vote before we perish.
I’m willing to conduct a double-blind experiment on a large sample population of Republicans to learn if Death is the worst thing that can happen to them.
I’ll be in the placebo group in which living out the rest of my life without any of them any longer living in my world will be the placebo effect.
I’m merely trying to prove that me living and them dying is the preferred outcome and could even be a cure for what ails America.
The Republican Party is a perverted death-loving murderous cult.
The punchline of the Federalist’s cult of Death in the article is this:
‘“Bosnian and Rwandan ditches are full of corpses whose betrayers were lifelong neighbors a week prior,” Skeet wrote, just a few paragraphs after detailing the demise of his in-laws’ street ball game.’
But they always get to suit up as the Hutu team in their stick ball games.
I am Comanche.
Re vote by mail comments…
A number of Republican governors seem inclined to ignore Trump and lean heavily on vote-by-mail this year. Based on the western experience, those state governments will be under a lot of voter pressure to retain the system in future years unless they mismanage it into a disaster. Once installed, vote-by-mail is popular.
There’s some evidence that the then-new vote-by-mail system in Colorado was a factor in Republican Sen. Cory Gardner’s win in 2014 by making it easier for rural voters and elderly voters in all areas to cast ballots. Not a huge factor — mostly I blame Mark Udall and the Democratic-affiliated PACs, who ran possibly the worst campaign I’ve ever seen.
Re vote by mail comments…
A number of Republican governors seem inclined to ignore Trump and lean heavily on vote-by-mail this year. Based on the western experience, those state governments will be under a lot of voter pressure to retain the system in future years unless they mismanage it into a disaster. Once installed, vote-by-mail is popular.
There’s some evidence that the then-new vote-by-mail system in Colorado was a factor in Republican Sen. Cory Gardner’s win in 2014 by making it easier for rural voters and elderly voters in all areas to cast ballots. Not a huge factor — mostly I blame Mark Udall and the Democratic-affiliated PACs, who ran possibly the worst campaign I’ve ever seen.
Cornyn looks like Van Johnson at a barn dance just before he flicks a cigarette into the hayloft and sets it on fire:
https://juanitajean.com/the-oh-really-could-be-heard-five-states-away/
Cornyn looks like Van Johnson at a barn dance just before he flicks a cigarette into the hayloft and sets it on fire:
https://juanitajean.com/the-oh-really-could-be-heard-five-states-away/
To the American Christian herd, we are just livestock awaiting the culling:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/californias-dreamin/
To the American Christian herd, we are just livestock awaiting the culling:
https://digbysblog.net/2020/05/californias-dreamin/
A vote for Biden is … tell me what again.
Ah yes, a vote for Trump is a vote for O’Reilly, the rapist.
https://www.mediamatters.org/bill-oreilly/hannity-radio-bill-oreilly-says-if-you-vote-joe-biden-you-are-voting-george-soros
A vote for Biden is … tell me what again.
Ah yes, a vote for Trump is a vote for O’Reilly, the rapist.
https://www.mediamatters.org/bill-oreilly/hannity-radio-bill-oreilly-says-if-you-vote-joe-biden-you-are-voting-george-soros
Dr. Fauci heeds to carry a weapon and use it if this guy tries to violate social distancing:
https://www.mediamatters.org/coronavirus-covid-19/barstool-sports-president-and-frequent-fox-news-guest-calls-dr-anthony-fauci
America, you sick fuck.
Dr. Fauci heeds to carry a weapon and use it if this guy tries to violate social distancing:
https://www.mediamatters.org/coronavirus-covid-19/barstool-sports-president-and-frequent-fox-news-guest-calls-dr-anthony-fauci
America, you sick fuck.
https://www.mediamatters.org/michael-flynn/sebastian-gorka-calls-judge-overseeing-case-disgraced-gen-mike-flynn-bipolar
The Judge needs security with orders to shoot to kill.
https://www.mediamatters.org/michael-flynn/sebastian-gorka-calls-judge-overseeing-case-disgraced-gen-mike-flynn-bipolar
The Judge needs security with orders to shoot to kill.
An un-nuked America is not a polite country.
An un-nuked America is not a polite country.
Adam Silverman:
https://www.balloon-juice.com/2020/05/13/the-black-psyop-ix-the-unmasking-of-obamagate/
This Adam Silverman, the deep state expertise guy.
https://www.balloon-juice.com/author/adam-silverman/
You can fuck with him, or you can fuck with me.
Adam Silverman:
https://www.balloon-juice.com/2020/05/13/the-black-psyop-ix-the-unmasking-of-obamagate/
This Adam Silverman, the deep state expertise guy.
https://www.balloon-juice.com/author/adam-silverman/
You can fuck with him, or you can fuck with me.
We all understand that you think Clinton is a crook. In contrast, we all know that Trump is a crook. Many of the people who voted for Trump knew, and know, he’s a crook, and they didn’t give a shit.
Like I said…truth.
We all understand that you think Clinton is a crook. In contrast, we all know that Trump is a crook. Many of the people who voted for Trump knew, and know, he’s a crook, and they didn’t give a shit.
Like I said…truth.
This is, simply put, pure partisan scumbaggery.
These judges advocate death in lieu of political defeat. There is no other way to interpret this decision.
This is, simply put, pure partisan scumbaggery.
These judges advocate death in lieu of political defeat. There is no other way to interpret this decision.
On a lighter note…
https://twitter.com/rhymeswithbeg/status/1260251496345743364
On a lighter note…
https://twitter.com/rhymeswithbeg/status/1260251496345743364
living la vida loca
living la vida loca
https://twitter.com/savag3ap3/status/1260255585565585411
Turn up the volume.
Makes perfect sense to me.
https://twitter.com/savag3ap3/status/1260255585565585411
Turn up the volume.
Makes perfect sense to me.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/connecticut-governor-says-days-commuting-183227412.html
The numbers vary, but there are more vacant houses and other buildings in America than there are homeless people, by some fair margin.
Now, like Godzilla rampaging thru New York City, Covid-19 is about to empty out tens of millions of real estate space of all kinds.
Creating even more homeless people.
But the homeless won’t be permitted to use the extra space. The more space there is devoted to emptiness, the LESS space there is for human beings.
No, America would rather tear down the Empire State Building than give human beings shelter in the abandoned hulk, even with all of their bad habits.
At this rate, King Kong is going to have to climb the Sherry Netherland Hotel on his next visit, if he even gets a visa, on account of because he might take Mighty Joe Young’s job.
While most of America WORKS from their home, the homeless must work to find a home. And the more America works from their homes, the fewer homes there are for the homeless.
Can a human being live in a ZOOM frame and find shelter from the elements, I ask you?
Here, take this algorithm and make an umbrella out of it. The homeless, many of them working, as in Calcutta, aren’t even going to have newspapers any longer to keep out the chill.
I’m sorry. I read the Times on the internet now, so find a grate to sleep on.
You can’t wrap a website around your legs to keep warm, even if you could get thru the paywall.
Now, the good people at Reason Magazine, sitting masked in front of their ZOOM screens, social distancing even during good times, because:Reason will intone perfectly reasonable lists of reasons why these trends make perfectly logical sense.
Like Marie Antoinette and the Czar of Russia patiently explaining why starvation is a perfectly logical outcome and a reasonable expectation given current circumstances and trends.
Without losers, most of us can’t win, now, can we?
You have not, so that I may have. And, it’s your fault.
The prices of vaccines and PPE to prevent the Covid-19 must rise to stimulate people’s motives, their animal spirits, for creating vaccines and manufacturing PPE to prevent the virus, we are told, with nearly giddy certainty.
Otherwise, what is the point of doing anything?
Have anyone actually seen a person pull herself up by her bootstraps?
Think about it. Sure, say you own boots that have straps, first off, and yes a person can pull one foot up by its bootstrap. Now, hold that position, one leg hovering, and NOW, very carefully, lift the OTHER foot up by it’s bootstrap so its evenly hovering above the ground with the other foot.
You are floating and defying gravity.
Now maintain that position for the duration, and in fact, keep pulling yourself higher into thin air.
Can’t do it, can ya. Besides, the guy telling you to lift yourself up by yer bootstraps, when he sees you succeed against all physical odds, will then withdraw the job offer because he would rather hire someone who is sensible and has both feet ON the ground.
Besides, the boot strap thing is LITERALLY a metaphor. We’re kidding.
WHAT!!
OK, so instead, here’s another position you should assume.
Now, turn around and bend over and touch your toes.
The secret is to relax.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/connecticut-governor-says-days-commuting-183227412.html
The numbers vary, but there are more vacant houses and other buildings in America than there are homeless people, by some fair margin.
Now, like Godzilla rampaging thru New York City, Covid-19 is about to empty out tens of millions of real estate space of all kinds.
Creating even more homeless people.
But the homeless won’t be permitted to use the extra space. The more space there is devoted to emptiness, the LESS space there is for human beings.
No, America would rather tear down the Empire State Building than give human beings shelter in the abandoned hulk, even with all of their bad habits.
At this rate, King Kong is going to have to climb the Sherry Netherland Hotel on his next visit, if he even gets a visa, on account of because he might take Mighty Joe Young’s job.
While most of America WORKS from their home, the homeless must work to find a home. And the more America works from their homes, the fewer homes there are for the homeless.
Can a human being live in a ZOOM frame and find shelter from the elements, I ask you?
Here, take this algorithm and make an umbrella out of it. The homeless, many of them working, as in Calcutta, aren’t even going to have newspapers any longer to keep out the chill.
I’m sorry. I read the Times on the internet now, so find a grate to sleep on.
You can’t wrap a website around your legs to keep warm, even if you could get thru the paywall.
Now, the good people at Reason Magazine, sitting masked in front of their ZOOM screens, social distancing even during good times, because:Reason will intone perfectly reasonable lists of reasons why these trends make perfectly logical sense.
Like Marie Antoinette and the Czar of Russia patiently explaining why starvation is a perfectly logical outcome and a reasonable expectation given current circumstances and trends.
Without losers, most of us can’t win, now, can we?
You have not, so that I may have. And, it’s your fault.
The prices of vaccines and PPE to prevent the Covid-19 must rise to stimulate people’s motives, their animal spirits, for creating vaccines and manufacturing PPE to prevent the virus, we are told, with nearly giddy certainty.
Otherwise, what is the point of doing anything?
Have anyone actually seen a person pull herself up by her bootstraps?
Think about it. Sure, say you own boots that have straps, first off, and yes a person can pull one foot up by its bootstrap. Now, hold that position, one leg hovering, and NOW, very carefully, lift the OTHER foot up by it’s bootstrap so its evenly hovering above the ground with the other foot.
You are floating and defying gravity.
Now maintain that position for the duration, and in fact, keep pulling yourself higher into thin air.
Can’t do it, can ya. Besides, the guy telling you to lift yourself up by yer bootstraps, when he sees you succeed against all physical odds, will then withdraw the job offer because he would rather hire someone who is sensible and has both feet ON the ground.
Besides, the boot strap thing is LITERALLY a metaphor. We’re kidding.
WHAT!!
OK, so instead, here’s another position you should assume.
Now, turn around and bend over and touch your toes.
The secret is to relax.
Don’t mess with Texas. (Not even if you’re Wisconsin.)
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/13/us/coronavirus-businesses-lockdown-guns.html
Don’t mess with Texas. (Not even if you’re Wisconsin.)
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/13/us/coronavirus-businesses-lockdown-guns.html
These judges advocate death in lieu of political defeat. There is no other way to interpret this decision.
To be precise, they advocate death for others in lieu of political defeat for themselves. As seems to be usual these days, there’s not the slightest indication of thought beyond today. Like, What happens when the shoe is on the other foot? Which, sooner or later probably sooner, it inevitably will be.
These judges advocate death in lieu of political defeat. There is no other way to interpret this decision.
To be precise, they advocate death for others in lieu of political defeat for themselves. As seems to be usual these days, there’s not the slightest indication of thought beyond today. Like, What happens when the shoe is on the other foot? Which, sooner or later probably sooner, it inevitably will be.
they could be part of the wingnut sub-group who believe it’s all a hoax. and if it’s a hoax then there’s nothing to worry about!
i’ll be in my house until at least July.
video-chatted with my Dr today, she was thinking they’ll probably still be doing Facetime appointments in November.
go on out, GOP. kill your stupid selves. stay the fnck away from me.
they could be part of the wingnut sub-group who believe it’s all a hoax. and if it’s a hoax then there’s nothing to worry about!
i’ll be in my house until at least July.
video-chatted with my Dr today, she was thinking they’ll probably still be doing Facetime appointments in November.
go on out, GOP. kill your stupid selves. stay the fnck away from me.
If someone patronizing that Texas tattoo parlor gets a little Covid-19 all over him, and is assisted in his mission by an anti-American asshole in the parking lot with an AR-15 and wearing a skull mask and then the first guys coughs on me at the local Home Depot a few days later, and I spend some time on a ventilator catching my life breath, when I get out of the hospital, would be OK for me to show up at that tattoo parlor and set up a defensive perimeter around the parking and when the parlor owner, the patron and the dude with the weapon show up in the morning for their song and dance, would it be OK for me to use deadly force on them, for my trouble and their liability for their deadly assault on me?
What are they going to do? Call the government?
Any conservatives and libertarians know what the protocol is in your lawless, fascist country these a days?
Don’t bother getting up removing your thumbs from your butts. Just explain.
These two headlines were side by side on the Daily Beast:
https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-has-had-it-with-coronavirus-he-wants-road-trips-and-fireworks-instead?via=newsletter&source=DDMorning
and
https://www.thedailybeast.com/hulus-the-great-asks-if-catherine-the-great-had-sex-with-a-horse-tvs-fun-new-binge?via=newsletter&source=DDMorning
Sums it up for me.
If someone patronizing that Texas tattoo parlor gets a little Covid-19 all over him, and is assisted in his mission by an anti-American asshole in the parking lot with an AR-15 and wearing a skull mask and then the first guys coughs on me at the local Home Depot a few days later, and I spend some time on a ventilator catching my life breath, when I get out of the hospital, would be OK for me to show up at that tattoo parlor and set up a defensive perimeter around the parking and when the parlor owner, the patron and the dude with the weapon show up in the morning for their song and dance, would it be OK for me to use deadly force on them, for my trouble and their liability for their deadly assault on me?
What are they going to do? Call the government?
Any conservatives and libertarians know what the protocol is in your lawless, fascist country these a days?
Don’t bother getting up removing your thumbs from your butts. Just explain.
These two headlines were side by side on the Daily Beast:
https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-has-had-it-with-coronavirus-he-wants-road-trips-and-fireworks-instead?via=newsletter&source=DDMorning
and
https://www.thedailybeast.com/hulus-the-great-asks-if-catherine-the-great-had-sex-with-a-horse-tvs-fun-new-binge?via=newsletter&source=DDMorning
Sums it up for me.
Well, if there were some place that I’d trust to get the regulations for social contact right in a pandemic, it would be my tattoo shop. Gloves and sanitation and handling of biohazards are all already on point as a matter of course.
Well, if there were some place that I’d trust to get the regulations for social contact right in a pandemic, it would be my tattoo shop. Gloves and sanitation and handling of biohazards are all already on point as a matter of course.
Why should US tatto shops be safer than in other Western countries, where they are a common source for hepatitis infections due to insufficent sanitation?
Why should US tatto shops be safer than in other Western countries, where they are a common source for hepatitis infections due to insufficent sanitation?
It is my fervent hope that all the RWNJs in the Ungovernable Tribal Region formerly known as ‘Texas’ go out and get themselves a Coronavirus tattoo.
With the secret sauce, also, too.
It is my fervent hope that all the RWNJs in the Ungovernable Tribal Region formerly known as ‘Texas’ go out and get themselves a Coronavirus tattoo.
With the secret sauce, also, too.
Congressman King (R-Iowa) was stripped of his committee assignments last year (for asking whether “white supremacist” was really offensive). Now he’s trying to get them back — because not being on the Agriculture Committee could doom his primary campaign. And the House GOP is resisting.
So King is now comparing his plight to that of Gen Flynn, whose case is not being dismissed as he and AG Barr hoped. Who can argue with that? Both are in positions without merit. And both look likely to lose. Nailed it, King!
Congressman King (R-Iowa) was stripped of his committee assignments last year (for asking whether “white supremacist” was really offensive). Now he’s trying to get them back — because not being on the Agriculture Committee could doom his primary campaign. And the House GOP is resisting.
So King is now comparing his plight to that of Gen Flynn, whose case is not being dismissed as he and AG Barr hoped. Who can argue with that? Both are in positions without merit. And both look likely to lose. Nailed it, King!
Repeal Obamacare!
https://apnews.com/2345422037f0f330f4a8b523048324ca
Repeal Obamacare!
https://apnews.com/2345422037f0f330f4a8b523048324ca
the tyranny of a cancer-free life is too much to bear!
the tyranny of a cancer-free life is too much to bear!
Don’t mess with Texas.
My general impression is that that’s how TX wants to live. Seems well beyond insane to me, but I will not stand in their way.
Just keep it over there where you are, and stay the hell out of my state.
Don’t mess with Texas.
My general impression is that that’s how TX wants to live. Seems well beyond insane to me, but I will not stand in their way.
Just keep it over there where you are, and stay the hell out of my state.
Hartmut – don’t know about everywhere in the US, but LA County tattoo shops are highly regulated and the people who own them are highly motivated to keep that regulation in place. The artists have to go through public health training about safe biohazard handling and learn about the effect of tattooing on skin types, etc.. If the shop is legit it will have that certification on prominent display. Every legit shop works hard to keep those standards in place, both to limit competition and to maintain high professional standards. It’s part of why good tattoos cost so much
Every time Adam has tattooed me, I’ve watched him take the needles out of sealed packages. All the ink gets put into disposable cups and taken to the tattoo station and any excess gets disposed of as hazardous waste after the session. Every surface in the place gets cleaned like it is a hospital on a daily basis before anyone comes into the shop in the morning and the stations get another thorough cleaning in between each client.
If Adam takes a break or touches his phone or anything other than his tattooing equipment, he disposes of his nitrile gloves and gets a fresh pair before touching me again. Everything in the shop is single use.
Hartmut – don’t know about everywhere in the US, but LA County tattoo shops are highly regulated and the people who own them are highly motivated to keep that regulation in place. The artists have to go through public health training about safe biohazard handling and learn about the effect of tattooing on skin types, etc.. If the shop is legit it will have that certification on prominent display. Every legit shop works hard to keep those standards in place, both to limit competition and to maintain high professional standards. It’s part of why good tattoos cost so much
Every time Adam has tattooed me, I’ve watched him take the needles out of sealed packages. All the ink gets put into disposable cups and taken to the tattoo station and any excess gets disposed of as hazardous waste after the session. Every surface in the place gets cleaned like it is a hospital on a daily basis before anyone comes into the shop in the morning and the stations get another thorough cleaning in between each client.
If Adam takes a break or touches his phone or anything other than his tattooing equipment, he disposes of his nitrile gloves and gets a fresh pair before touching me again. Everything in the shop is single use.
And back on the Flynn front, looks like the Justice Department failed to include an FBI report denying that there was any “perjury trap” involved in the questioning in their motion to dismiss:
https://news.yahoo.com/ex-fbi-official-reportedly-undercut-075221674.html
And back on the Flynn front, looks like the Justice Department failed to include an FBI report denying that there was any “perjury trap” involved in the questioning in their motion to dismiss:
https://news.yahoo.com/ex-fbi-official-reportedly-undercut-075221674.html
But what would bc say? And how did his/her experience with those upright agents and prosecutors in California, I think it was, square with all the thousands of prosecutors and agents who have written in outrage about Barr and the DOJ’s unprecedented and improper behaviour in dropping the charges?
But what would bc say? And how did his/her experience with those upright agents and prosecutors in California, I think it was, square with all the thousands of prosecutors and agents who have written in outrage about Barr and the DOJ’s unprecedented and improper behaviour in dropping the charges?
If they hadn’t tested for Rush Limbaugh’s fake lung cancer so he could get the sympathy Asshole of the Millenium trophy, we would have fewer cases of lung cancer in this country.
https://www.mediamatters.org/coronavirus-covid-19/rush-limbaugh-more-you-test-coronavirus-guess-what-more-cases-you-have
Trump then put a finer point on it. “If we didn’t test, we would have fewer cases.”
There are words for these creatures.
If Obamacare had not diagnosed more cancer cases and cured them or treated them into remission, there would be less cancer.
If we put two dead people murdered by the Republican Party and the conservative movement into a single body bag and count them as one dead fuck, the death toll in this country will be halved.
Defend them conservatives and libertarians. The silence is deafening, ah, but if a tree falls in the forest and no one hears it fall, you have more trees, right?
Ronald Reagan reasoning. Fuck off.
What was that about the Laughing Curve? If you take in less revenue via taxes, government will have more revenue.
And fewer tumors.
If they hadn’t tested for Rush Limbaugh’s fake lung cancer so he could get the sympathy Asshole of the Millenium trophy, we would have fewer cases of lung cancer in this country.
https://www.mediamatters.org/coronavirus-covid-19/rush-limbaugh-more-you-test-coronavirus-guess-what-more-cases-you-have
Trump then put a finer point on it. “If we didn’t test, we would have fewer cases.”
There are words for these creatures.
If Obamacare had not diagnosed more cancer cases and cured them or treated them into remission, there would be less cancer.
If we put two dead people murdered by the Republican Party and the conservative movement into a single body bag and count them as one dead fuck, the death toll in this country will be halved.
Defend them conservatives and libertarians. The silence is deafening, ah, but if a tree falls in the forest and no one hears it fall, you have more trees, right?
Ronald Reagan reasoning. Fuck off.
What was that about the Laughing Curve? If you take in less revenue via taxes, government will have more revenue.
And fewer tumors.
I don’t know how it is that bc is not counted as Deep State.
I don’t know how it is that bc is not counted as Deep State.
Unmasking is now awesome!!
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/13/us/politics/unmasking-flynn.html
Unmasking is now awesome!!
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/13/us/politics/unmasking-flynn.html
But what would bc say?
Uh, read the motion to dismiss and the exhibits?
Quick look at the list on Medium and saw the Axelrods were all there. Ex-DOJ employees are entitled to their opinions, be they political or based on actually reading the facts.
All of what you say here could be true, and it still be worth the FBI’s attention.
Plus, the business about the back channel.
Plus, the sheer number and variety of contacts between Trump’s campaign and Russian actors.
On these points, russell, my understanding is there is no “plus.” FBI counterintel had already investigated and found as to Flynn there was nada. The interview wasn’t about investigating these issues at all.
Plus, he lied to the FBI.
Plus, he pled guilty to that.
He lied because he lied. Others have said so, so it must be true (just not those at the interview, who thought he wasn’t lying).
At the same time, I am not overlooking the fact that if he wasn’t lying, he was not remembering some very important phone calls very well. But again, the agents there didn’t think he was lying to them.
Plus, Flynn was working for the Turks without disclosing it.
Interesting one that. Much of what I have ready is contradictory and seems based not on actual facts, but supposition. If I ever get the time to do a deep dive …But here is the deal: I’m not saying Flynn should be exonerated. I’m just talking about prosecuting based on the interview.
Don’t worry Marty, bc can be Shemp…
Why am I getting drug into your feud with Marty, lj? Or is that an actual response to something I said? How did I go from Scott Glenn to Shemp? Geesh.
But what would bc say?
Uh, read the motion to dismiss and the exhibits?
Quick look at the list on Medium and saw the Axelrods were all there. Ex-DOJ employees are entitled to their opinions, be they political or based on actually reading the facts.
All of what you say here could be true, and it still be worth the FBI’s attention.
Plus, the business about the back channel.
Plus, the sheer number and variety of contacts between Trump’s campaign and Russian actors.
On these points, russell, my understanding is there is no “plus.” FBI counterintel had already investigated and found as to Flynn there was nada. The interview wasn’t about investigating these issues at all.
Plus, he lied to the FBI.
Plus, he pled guilty to that.
He lied because he lied. Others have said so, so it must be true (just not those at the interview, who thought he wasn’t lying).
At the same time, I am not overlooking the fact that if he wasn’t lying, he was not remembering some very important phone calls very well. But again, the agents there didn’t think he was lying to them.
Plus, Flynn was working for the Turks without disclosing it.
Interesting one that. Much of what I have ready is contradictory and seems based not on actual facts, but supposition. If I ever get the time to do a deep dive …But here is the deal: I’m not saying Flynn should be exonerated. I’m just talking about prosecuting based on the interview.
Don’t worry Marty, bc can be Shemp…
Why am I getting drug into your feud with Marty, lj? Or is that an actual response to something I said? How did I go from Scott Glenn to Shemp? Geesh.
You’ll always be Scott Glenn to me.
You’ll always be Scott Glenn to me.
FBI counterintel had already investigated and found as to Flynn there was nada. The interview wasn’t about investigating these issues at all.
And yet it appears that the counterintelligence investigation wasn’t over. And they found rather more than nada. A person who didn’t know better could think we were talking about entirely different investigations. Or different universes.
Plus, he pled guilty, under oath, to lying to the FBI. Twice. There’s really no way to square that circle. Either he is indeed guilty, as he pled. Or he committed perjury twice — and from what motivation?
FBI counterintel had already investigated and found as to Flynn there was nada. The interview wasn’t about investigating these issues at all.
And yet it appears that the counterintelligence investigation wasn’t over. And they found rather more than nada. A person who didn’t know better could think we were talking about entirely different investigations. Or different universes.
Plus, he pled guilty, under oath, to lying to the FBI. Twice. There’s really no way to square that circle. Either he is indeed guilty, as he pled. Or he committed perjury twice — and from what motivation?
I’m not saying Flynn should be exonerated. I’m just talking about prosecuting based on the interview.
Fair enough. And I appreciate your thoughtful engagement on the question.
TBH I’m essentially burned out on the whole Russia 2016 thing, in all of its forms and manifestations. What is blindingly clear to me is that Trump’s campaign was in communication with Russian actors who were interested in screwing around with the election to Trump’s advantage. By “in communication with” I specifically mean collaboration, whether or not that reached the level of criminal conspiracy. FWIW, “yeah, but it wasn’t criminal conspiracy!” is an astoundingly low bar.
Flynn may or may not have been into any of that, if not him then any number of others, including the POTUS’ son, son-in-law, and campaign manager.
And, as a nation allegedly based on the rule of law and integrity of political process, we’ve never come to grips with that. By “come to grips” I mean we’ve never come to a basic collective understanding that (a) yes, it happened, and (b) it was wrong.
No small number of folks are more or less OK with with yes, it happened, they just don’t care, because Trump is their guy, so they are fine with it. See also the brisk trade in “rather be a Russian than a liberal” merch.
So, screw it. We’ve shown what we’re made of, as a country, and now we get to live with it. Read ’em and weep.
Flynn is guilty of things that ought to have disqualified him from serving as a cabinet member, let alone in a national security role. He was a very effective intelligence officer in Afghanistan, and he was also famously a loose cannon. And he was working for – as in getting paid by – other governments while working in Trump’s campaign and IIRC while actually serving in Trump’s administration.
FWIW, my own take on Flynn’s apparent breaking bad is that he wanted a lot of money, because, you know, DC. The war on terror made a lot of folks rich, why not him? And my take on his confession is that it was basically a deal to keep his kid’s @ss out of jail. The FBI is a hard-ball organization, whether scrupulously professional or not. And then, Flynn apparently changed his mind, and so here we are.
I don’t really care all that much if he goes to jail or not. I just want Trump and his whole band of jackals the hell out. They’re destroying the nation. Even when they’re out, we may never fully repair the damage.
I have no regard at all for Flynn, his kid, or his participation in the flaming trainwreck of the Trump years. Jail, no jail, I don’t really care. Just get him out of public life and keep him out of public life.
He will, no doubt, find a way to make a living. In jail or not.
I’m not saying Flynn should be exonerated. I’m just talking about prosecuting based on the interview.
Fair enough. And I appreciate your thoughtful engagement on the question.
TBH I’m essentially burned out on the whole Russia 2016 thing, in all of its forms and manifestations. What is blindingly clear to me is that Trump’s campaign was in communication with Russian actors who were interested in screwing around with the election to Trump’s advantage. By “in communication with” I specifically mean collaboration, whether or not that reached the level of criminal conspiracy. FWIW, “yeah, but it wasn’t criminal conspiracy!” is an astoundingly low bar.
Flynn may or may not have been into any of that, if not him then any number of others, including the POTUS’ son, son-in-law, and campaign manager.
And, as a nation allegedly based on the rule of law and integrity of political process, we’ve never come to grips with that. By “come to grips” I mean we’ve never come to a basic collective understanding that (a) yes, it happened, and (b) it was wrong.
No small number of folks are more or less OK with with yes, it happened, they just don’t care, because Trump is their guy, so they are fine with it. See also the brisk trade in “rather be a Russian than a liberal” merch.
So, screw it. We’ve shown what we’re made of, as a country, and now we get to live with it. Read ’em and weep.
Flynn is guilty of things that ought to have disqualified him from serving as a cabinet member, let alone in a national security role. He was a very effective intelligence officer in Afghanistan, and he was also famously a loose cannon. And he was working for – as in getting paid by – other governments while working in Trump’s campaign and IIRC while actually serving in Trump’s administration.
FWIW, my own take on Flynn’s apparent breaking bad is that he wanted a lot of money, because, you know, DC. The war on terror made a lot of folks rich, why not him? And my take on his confession is that it was basically a deal to keep his kid’s @ss out of jail. The FBI is a hard-ball organization, whether scrupulously professional or not. And then, Flynn apparently changed his mind, and so here we are.
I don’t really care all that much if he goes to jail or not. I just want Trump and his whole band of jackals the hell out. They’re destroying the nation. Even when they’re out, we may never fully repair the damage.
I have no regard at all for Flynn, his kid, or his participation in the flaming trainwreck of the Trump years. Jail, no jail, I don’t really care. Just get him out of public life and keep him out of public life.
He will, no doubt, find a way to make a living. In jail or not.
bc: Uh, read the motion to dismiss and the exhibits?
For us non-lawyers, bc might consider providing a bit more meat on that bone. As a non-lawyer, I have to assume that a perp’s lawyers will present the most favorable arguments and evidence possible without blatantly lying to the court. I also have to assume that, in an (actually) adversarial system, there would be counterarguments and other evidence presented to the judge — and to interested laymen with time on their hands.
But again, the agents there didn’t think he was lying to them.
Leaving aside Flynn’s sworn confession that he was, is it possible that a liar can fake sincerity well enough to fool his interviewers and only later be discovered to have lied?
–TP
bc: Uh, read the motion to dismiss and the exhibits?
For us non-lawyers, bc might consider providing a bit more meat on that bone. As a non-lawyer, I have to assume that a perp’s lawyers will present the most favorable arguments and evidence possible without blatantly lying to the court. I also have to assume that, in an (actually) adversarial system, there would be counterarguments and other evidence presented to the judge — and to interested laymen with time on their hands.
But again, the agents there didn’t think he was lying to them.
Leaving aside Flynn’s sworn confession that he was, is it possible that a liar can fake sincerity well enough to fool his interviewers and only later be discovered to have lied?
–TP
Why am I getting drug into your feud with Marty, lj? Or is that an actual response to something I said? How did I go from Scott Glenn to Shemp?
That’s a nice image, like I sneaked up on you, knocked you out and when you came to, you found yourself on the same side of the room as Marty in the middle of all the broken glassware from his last ‘I had to vote for Trump cause of the Kenyan usurper and Hilary’s emails’ St. Vitsu dance, but I tend to see it more that you’ve chosen the side of the room you are in and have gone to a defensible corner. That’s only reinforced by the fact that the corner you’ve exconced yourself in has turns of phrase like
Comey and McCabe were behind this (“7th Floor”) and Comey later bragged about sandbagging the incoming administration and bypassing normal protocol to interview Flynn
and
Texts between Page and Strzok (the biased lovers)
and
Flynn noted to the agents that they could just go listen to the tapes if they wanted to know exactly what was said. Based on this interview, both agents did not think Flynn was lying. And one of them was Strzok! I admit to being surprised that Strzok would state that given his bias.
Now, I’m sure that you can give me chapter and verse about the couple’s living arrangements or whether they have concrete countertops that are above their income. But when you toss that out, well, I’m lead to believe that you aren’t simply laying out the facts, ma’am, just the facts and maybe you’ve got a teensy bit of bias going on. Maybe I’m wrong and I’m just pisssed and you are unfairly being maligned. Deal.
I mean, the fact that you are here indicates that you have some desire to explain to us homogenous mass of libs/leftist communist anarchists (never sure precisely what term to use, McT has me all confused) what life is like in the real world of upright investigators who never bend the rules, but, as GftNC pointed out, suddenly goes out of kilter. Tell me it ain’s so, Joe!
It certainly does seem to me that Comey could have been pushing to get Flynn arrested so Trump’s jenga tower could come tumbling down and he could write in his memoirs how saddened he was that following the investigation created exactly the same situation that he mourned about when following Hilary’s emails. Maybe it’s totally unfair that they used the interview to get Flynn (as you say, I’m not saying Flynn should be exonerated. I’m just talking about prosecuting based on the interview. Like Flynn just accidentally got tangled up in Trump’s harpoon line and got dragged under with him. Yes, all you are worried about is this incredibly narrow question of using an interview. For me, the ground that you pick out is you handcuffing yourself to Marty, not me dragging you over to him. And I’d be a lot more interested if you could point to your writings on Martha Stewart’s brush with the law. And where you’ve discussed your previous experience in other questions about FBI interviews.
At any rate, the Scott Glenn reference is brilliant. I mean Scott Glenn’s Crawford tosses Jodie Foster’s Clarice out like a worm on a hook to try and catch Hopkins’ Hannibal off guard and ends up letting him back in the world. Of course, the movie, despite referencing Lecter’s evil, has him as an avenging angel at the end of the movie, having his ‘old friend’ Chilton for dinner. So yeah, Scott Glenn works, but it is hard to place the other three in the frame…
oh and wrs.
Why am I getting drug into your feud with Marty, lj? Or is that an actual response to something I said? How did I go from Scott Glenn to Shemp?
That’s a nice image, like I sneaked up on you, knocked you out and when you came to, you found yourself on the same side of the room as Marty in the middle of all the broken glassware from his last ‘I had to vote for Trump cause of the Kenyan usurper and Hilary’s emails’ St. Vitsu dance, but I tend to see it more that you’ve chosen the side of the room you are in and have gone to a defensible corner. That’s only reinforced by the fact that the corner you’ve exconced yourself in has turns of phrase like
Comey and McCabe were behind this (“7th Floor”) and Comey later bragged about sandbagging the incoming administration and bypassing normal protocol to interview Flynn
and
Texts between Page and Strzok (the biased lovers)
and
Flynn noted to the agents that they could just go listen to the tapes if they wanted to know exactly what was said. Based on this interview, both agents did not think Flynn was lying. And one of them was Strzok! I admit to being surprised that Strzok would state that given his bias.
Now, I’m sure that you can give me chapter and verse about the couple’s living arrangements or whether they have concrete countertops that are above their income. But when you toss that out, well, I’m lead to believe that you aren’t simply laying out the facts, ma’am, just the facts and maybe you’ve got a teensy bit of bias going on. Maybe I’m wrong and I’m just pisssed and you are unfairly being maligned. Deal.
I mean, the fact that you are here indicates that you have some desire to explain to us homogenous mass of libs/leftist communist anarchists (never sure precisely what term to use, McT has me all confused) what life is like in the real world of upright investigators who never bend the rules, but, as GftNC pointed out, suddenly goes out of kilter. Tell me it ain’s so, Joe!
It certainly does seem to me that Comey could have been pushing to get Flynn arrested so Trump’s jenga tower could come tumbling down and he could write in his memoirs how saddened he was that following the investigation created exactly the same situation that he mourned about when following Hilary’s emails. Maybe it’s totally unfair that they used the interview to get Flynn (as you say, I’m not saying Flynn should be exonerated. I’m just talking about prosecuting based on the interview. Like Flynn just accidentally got tangled up in Trump’s harpoon line and got dragged under with him. Yes, all you are worried about is this incredibly narrow question of using an interview. For me, the ground that you pick out is you handcuffing yourself to Marty, not me dragging you over to him. And I’d be a lot more interested if you could point to your writings on Martha Stewart’s brush with the law. And where you’ve discussed your previous experience in other questions about FBI interviews.
At any rate, the Scott Glenn reference is brilliant. I mean Scott Glenn’s Crawford tosses Jodie Foster’s Clarice out like a worm on a hook to try and catch Hopkins’ Hannibal off guard and ends up letting him back in the world. Of course, the movie, despite referencing Lecter’s evil, has him as an avenging angel at the end of the movie, having his ‘old friend’ Chilton for dinner. So yeah, Scott Glenn works, but it is hard to place the other three in the frame…
oh and wrs.
A person who didn’t know better could think we were talking about entirely different investigations. Or different universes.
Hard to argue with this.
Quick look at the list on Medium and saw the Axelrods were all there. Ex-DOJ employees are entitled to their opinions, be they political or based on actually reading the facts.
But also still laughing at this – bc is giving me many (hollow) laughs these days. We have an expression in the UK, “weasel words”. Do you have the same expression in the States? If not, I nominate this as an example for inclusion in 2020 dictionaries. I know I said I would renounce engagement with rightwingers, and God knows I am trying, but that was to do with the magical thinking that they might see reason. bc is a lawyer defending the DOJ’s stance on dropping the Flynn charges. I mean, come on…renouncing comment on this would be harder than that time I had to renounce the devil and all his works (sic) to be godmother to my beloved godchild.
A person who didn’t know better could think we were talking about entirely different investigations. Or different universes.
Hard to argue with this.
Quick look at the list on Medium and saw the Axelrods were all there. Ex-DOJ employees are entitled to their opinions, be they political or based on actually reading the facts.
But also still laughing at this – bc is giving me many (hollow) laughs these days. We have an expression in the UK, “weasel words”. Do you have the same expression in the States? If not, I nominate this as an example for inclusion in 2020 dictionaries. I know I said I would renounce engagement with rightwingers, and God knows I am trying, but that was to do with the magical thinking that they might see reason. bc is a lawyer defending the DOJ’s stance on dropping the Flynn charges. I mean, come on…renouncing comment on this would be harder than that time I had to renounce the devil and all his works (sic) to be godmother to my beloved godchild.
Hey, you people just don’t get it. People like Marty and bc are not biased.
What’s more, their deity-like lack of bias means that they are perfectly positioned to infallibly gauge bias in everyone else.
Sometimes the easiest answer is actually the answer. 😉
Hey, you people just don’t get it. People like Marty and bc are not biased.
What’s more, their deity-like lack of bias means that they are perfectly positioned to infallibly gauge bias in everyone else.
Sometimes the easiest answer is actually the answer. 😉
And he was working for – as in getting paid by – other governments…
It is my understanding that by law if a retired general officer does not get prior permission from the Pentagon and the Dept of State, getting paid by foreign governments results in cutting off their reserve commission and their pension. Does anyone know if those have happened to Flynn? In the past, the courts have taken a very broad view of what counts as “getting paid by.”
And he was working for – as in getting paid by – other governments…
It is my understanding that by law if a retired general officer does not get prior permission from the Pentagon and the Dept of State, getting paid by foreign governments results in cutting off their reserve commission and their pension. Does anyone know if those have happened to Flynn? In the past, the courts have taken a very broad view of what counts as “getting paid by.”
Plus, he pled guilty, under oath, to lying to the FBI. Twice. There’s really no way to square that circle.
Elementary, my dear Watson. When he pled guilty, he was lying.
Plus, he pled guilty, under oath, to lying to the FBI. Twice. There’s really no way to square that circle.
Elementary, my dear Watson. When he pled guilty, he was lying.
The future is a foreign country, so here’s a little travelogue.
It’s the winter of 2021. The right is trying out various conspiracy theories, to explain how Trump could possibly have lost. Then somebody notices something. Looking at the statistics, they see that covid-19 disproportionately hit (read killed) Trump leaning voters!
First, of course, it hit the elderly hard; older voters were the age demographic Trump did best in. Second, it hit a high number of people who had believed Trump and his fanboys’ saying it was a hoax and/or overblown. And acted accordingly, which is to say, rejected taking precautions.
Neither of which would surprise anyone with even a faint grip on reality. But no. It proves, proves, that the whole thing was a plot against Trump! You read it here first.
The future is a foreign country, so here’s a little travelogue.
It’s the winter of 2021. The right is trying out various conspiracy theories, to explain how Trump could possibly have lost. Then somebody notices something. Looking at the statistics, they see that covid-19 disproportionately hit (read killed) Trump leaning voters!
First, of course, it hit the elderly hard; older voters were the age demographic Trump did best in. Second, it hit a high number of people who had believed Trump and his fanboys’ saying it was a hoax and/or overblown. And acted accordingly, which is to say, rejected taking precautions.
Neither of which would surprise anyone with even a faint grip on reality. But no. It proves, proves, that the whole thing was a plot against Trump! You read it here first.
If only. But in fact, as it is disproportionately hitting BAME (UK usage for black and minority ethnic) folks, it’s probably an equal-opportunities killer.
If only. But in fact, as it is disproportionately hitting BAME (UK usage for black and minority ethnic) folks, it’s probably an equal-opportunities killer.
So far. But that’s because the cities got hit first. Now it’s spreading into more rural areas. Where the healthcare infrastructure is minimal. There may have been too few facilities, ventilators, etc. in the cities, but the countryside is far worse off.
That’s why I set the scenario next winter; it’s going to be a while yet before reality hits Trumpcountry. But it will.
So far. But that’s because the cities got hit first. Now it’s spreading into more rural areas. Where the healthcare infrastructure is minimal. There may have been too few facilities, ventilators, etc. in the cities, but the countryside is far worse off.
That’s why I set the scenario next winter; it’s going to be a while yet before reality hits Trumpcountry. But it will.
i don’t doubt that it will happen.
the problem with it is that Dems are all screaming at them to put on their fucking masks and stay home so they don’t die!
well… i was. now, go ahead – kill your own dumb asses.
i don’t doubt that it will happen.
the problem with it is that Dems are all screaming at them to put on their fucking masks and stay home so they don’t die!
well… i was. now, go ahead – kill your own dumb asses.
who am i to blow against the wind ?
who am i to blow against the wind ?
I mean, the fact that you are here indicates that you have some desire to explain to us homogenous mass of libs . . .
Somewhere during my long diaspora in the wilderness (i.e. being away and/or lurking) something happened, lj. It appears to have been something between you and Marty. You wouldn’t have projected like this before.
I come here to engage and to learn and widen my pitifully narrow conservative horizons. I am probably naive to think that that my good intentions, such as they are (imperfect) would be respected by everyone. But russell seems to get it. TP, bobbyp, cleek, wj etc. all remain somewhat constant in their snark and skepticism of what I might say but I’ve learned a lot from each and enjoy the feedback even when it is sometimes harsh. Hsh has chided, usually in a friendly way until that last reference (btw hsh, can I be Scott Glenn in Silverado instead?) I’m at a loss as to what changed, honestly. I’ve lost your good will and I’m sorry for that. All I got is that I’m being lumped in with this Marty feud.
Yes, all you are worried about is this incredibly narrow question of using an interview.
Using a pretextual interview as the basis to take out a national security advisor for a brand new administration is far, far from a “narrow question.”
I’ve been concerned about process for a while. Frex, I think Cohen is a low life. But I don’t like how attorney client privilege was trampled on. I don’t like false statements in FISA applications being used to spy on an incoming administration and using purchased “facts” of questionable provenance and then using those as a basis for an independent counsel. I don’t like that regardless of who is in the White House.
For me, the ground that you pick out is you handcuffing yourself to Marty, not me dragging you over to him.
Got it. I am apparently very easy to handcuff. Who knew.
As a non-lawyer, I have to assume that a perp’s lawyers will present the most favorable arguments and evidence possible without blatantly lying to the court.
TP, the motion is by the DOJ, not Flynn’s lawyers, after Barr appointed an outside prosecutor (Jensen) to review. Jensen was an FBI agent for ten years. Jensen recommended dismissal.
Flynn is guilty of things that ought to have disqualified him from serving as a cabinet member, let alone in a national security role . . .FWIW, my own take on Flynn’s apparent breaking bad is that he wanted a lot of money . . .
I somewhat see it that way too, russell, actually, more so on the former assertion than the latter.
Hey, you people just don’t get it. People like Marty and bc are not biased.
And this is how you engage on issues, people. Stick to the facts. I’m biased. End of discussion, right? Got it. FWIW, part of the reason I even come here is because I KNOW I am biased. It’s nice to learn how, exactly, but this particular way of “discussing” doesn’t work. Or claiming an entire group of people only engage in magical thinking all of the time.
Biting tongue.
Plus, he pled guilty, under oath, to lying to the FBI. Twice.
Sure. Not lost on me. And there was absolutely no pressure to do whatever it took to get a no-prison deal. No pressure at all. And we prosecute allocutions all the time for perjury, right? I’m guessing not, but actually, I don’t know. I imagine if there was something said in trial PRIOR to a plea that was so wrong, wasted so much time, etc. I could see it prosecuted. But I assume “perjury” happens all the time every day in allocution and nobody ever thinks twice about prosecuting it. I could be wrong.
bc is a lawyer defending the DOJ’s stance on dropping the Flynn charges.
Do you, GFTNC, defend the DOJ for dropping charges on Andrew McCabe after the Inspector General found he lied under oath multiple times regarding a leak he knew he caused? Was Barr doing Trump’s bidding then? Asking for a friend.
I mean, the fact that you are here indicates that you have some desire to explain to us homogenous mass of libs . . .
Somewhere during my long diaspora in the wilderness (i.e. being away and/or lurking) something happened, lj. It appears to have been something between you and Marty. You wouldn’t have projected like this before.
I come here to engage and to learn and widen my pitifully narrow conservative horizons. I am probably naive to think that that my good intentions, such as they are (imperfect) would be respected by everyone. But russell seems to get it. TP, bobbyp, cleek, wj etc. all remain somewhat constant in their snark and skepticism of what I might say but I’ve learned a lot from each and enjoy the feedback even when it is sometimes harsh. Hsh has chided, usually in a friendly way until that last reference (btw hsh, can I be Scott Glenn in Silverado instead?) I’m at a loss as to what changed, honestly. I’ve lost your good will and I’m sorry for that. All I got is that I’m being lumped in with this Marty feud.
Yes, all you are worried about is this incredibly narrow question of using an interview.
Using a pretextual interview as the basis to take out a national security advisor for a brand new administration is far, far from a “narrow question.”
I’ve been concerned about process for a while. Frex, I think Cohen is a low life. But I don’t like how attorney client privilege was trampled on. I don’t like false statements in FISA applications being used to spy on an incoming administration and using purchased “facts” of questionable provenance and then using those as a basis for an independent counsel. I don’t like that regardless of who is in the White House.
For me, the ground that you pick out is you handcuffing yourself to Marty, not me dragging you over to him.
Got it. I am apparently very easy to handcuff. Who knew.
As a non-lawyer, I have to assume that a perp’s lawyers will present the most favorable arguments and evidence possible without blatantly lying to the court.
TP, the motion is by the DOJ, not Flynn’s lawyers, after Barr appointed an outside prosecutor (Jensen) to review. Jensen was an FBI agent for ten years. Jensen recommended dismissal.
Flynn is guilty of things that ought to have disqualified him from serving as a cabinet member, let alone in a national security role . . .FWIW, my own take on Flynn’s apparent breaking bad is that he wanted a lot of money . . .
I somewhat see it that way too, russell, actually, more so on the former assertion than the latter.
Hey, you people just don’t get it. People like Marty and bc are not biased.
And this is how you engage on issues, people. Stick to the facts. I’m biased. End of discussion, right? Got it. FWIW, part of the reason I even come here is because I KNOW I am biased. It’s nice to learn how, exactly, but this particular way of “discussing” doesn’t work. Or claiming an entire group of people only engage in magical thinking all of the time.
Biting tongue.
Plus, he pled guilty, under oath, to lying to the FBI. Twice.
Sure. Not lost on me. And there was absolutely no pressure to do whatever it took to get a no-prison deal. No pressure at all. And we prosecute allocutions all the time for perjury, right? I’m guessing not, but actually, I don’t know. I imagine if there was something said in trial PRIOR to a plea that was so wrong, wasted so much time, etc. I could see it prosecuted. But I assume “perjury” happens all the time every day in allocution and nobody ever thinks twice about prosecuting it. I could be wrong.
bc is a lawyer defending the DOJ’s stance on dropping the Flynn charges.
Do you, GFTNC, defend the DOJ for dropping charges on Andrew McCabe after the Inspector General found he lied under oath multiple times regarding a leak he knew he caused? Was Barr doing Trump’s bidding then? Asking for a friend.
Well, it’s obviously the fault of all you liberals. You had to know that any right-thinking (bigoted idiot) American would refuse to do anything you tried to tell them to do, just because it was you saying it. So by telling them to do things that would keep them safe, you were actually causing them to do things that would get them sick. And killed. So it’s your fault that it happened. QED
Well, it’s obviously the fault of all you liberals. You had to know that any right-thinking (bigoted idiot) American would refuse to do anything you tried to tell them to do, just because it was you saying it. So by telling them to do things that would keep them safe, you were actually causing them to do things that would get them sick. And killed. So it’s your fault that it happened. QED
this particular way of “discussing” doesn’t work
Works fine for me.
As I’ve said to at least one other lawyer who comes here, the rest of us don’t have to play by lawyers’ rules.
this particular way of “discussing” doesn’t work
Works fine for me.
As I’ve said to at least one other lawyer who comes here, the rest of us don’t have to play by lawyers’ rules.
TP, bobbyp, cleek, wj etc. all remain somewhat constant in their snark and skepticism of what I might say but I’ve learned a lot from each and enjoy the feedback even when it is sometimes harsh
wj, you are in such good company, people are forgetting you’re an R.
What are you still an R?
It reminds me of the Don Juan in Hell scene in Man and Superman, when the statue makes his big decision to move to hell, and Don Juan departs for heaven. The Devil is so very pleased to acquire the statue for his realm! And quite relieved to see the last of Don Juan.
Come on over! The flames are fine!
TP, bobbyp, cleek, wj etc. all remain somewhat constant in their snark and skepticism of what I might say but I’ve learned a lot from each and enjoy the feedback even when it is sometimes harsh
wj, you are in such good company, people are forgetting you’re an R.
What are you still an R?
It reminds me of the Don Juan in Hell scene in Man and Superman, when the statue makes his big decision to move to hell, and Don Juan departs for heaven. The Devil is so very pleased to acquire the statue for his realm! And quite relieved to see the last of Don Juan.
Come on over! The flames are fine!
Why are you still an R….
Why are you still an R….
I’ve been concerned about process for a while.
Welcome to “the Left” …. abolitionists circa 1830 to the present. Try on some different biases, just for a refreshing change.
I’ve been concerned about process for a while.
Welcome to “the Left” …. abolitionists circa 1830 to the present. Try on some different biases, just for a refreshing change.
TP, bobbyp, cleek, wj etc. all remain somewhat constant in their snark and skepticism of what I might say
Apologies if I came across as snarky. I do try to hold back, but don’t always succeed. However, if I’m skeptical (and I am), it’s not because of who say something, but because of what has been said.
I come here to engage and to learn and widen my pitifully narrow conservative horizons.
Same reason I’m here, actually. Plus the occasional success in broadening everybody else’s horizons in a more conservative direction.
Plus, he pled guilty, under oath, to lying to the FBI. Twice.
Sure. Not lost on me. And there was absolutely no pressure to do whatever it took to get a no-prison deal. No pressure at all.
The pressure (and I don’t doubt for a minute he felt some) was to plead guilty to a single, lesser, charge. Rather than get tried on greater charges as well, for which he (and/or his lawyers) felt there was a significant probability of his being found guilty. Not really the same thing as being pressured to lie about doing something when you were innocent.
TP, bobbyp, cleek, wj etc. all remain somewhat constant in their snark and skepticism of what I might say
Apologies if I came across as snarky. I do try to hold back, but don’t always succeed. However, if I’m skeptical (and I am), it’s not because of who say something, but because of what has been said.
I come here to engage and to learn and widen my pitifully narrow conservative horizons.
Same reason I’m here, actually. Plus the occasional success in broadening everybody else’s horizons in a more conservative direction.
Plus, he pled guilty, under oath, to lying to the FBI. Twice.
Sure. Not lost on me. And there was absolutely no pressure to do whatever it took to get a no-prison deal. No pressure at all.
The pressure (and I don’t doubt for a minute he felt some) was to plead guilty to a single, lesser, charge. Rather than get tried on greater charges as well, for which he (and/or his lawyers) felt there was a significant probability of his being found guilty. Not really the same thing as being pressured to lie about doing something when you were innocent.
Why are you still an R….
A democracy needs two parties to survive. Because with just one, things go downhill to corruption and disaster. Yes, even faster (albeit not by much) than Trump has taken us there.
At the moment, the various third parties don’t have anybody I think likely to grow into a viable alternative party. (And some which would be worse than the current Republicans. If you doubt it, look again at the American Independent Party. Shudder!)
Currently, the folks running the GOP, specifically at the national level, are a disgrace. But at the local level, and sometimes at the state level (see the governors of Massachusetts and Maryland), things are more hopeful. The chances of turning the party around don’t look enormously good at this point. But a) better than the chances of a different alternative “party of government” and b) even smaller if everyone disgusted with the likes of McConnell et al leaves.
So that’s why I’m still where I am. Doesn’t mean I religiously vote for them. Never was that straight party line kind of voter, but definitely don’t now.
Why are you still an R….
A democracy needs two parties to survive. Because with just one, things go downhill to corruption and disaster. Yes, even faster (albeit not by much) than Trump has taken us there.
At the moment, the various third parties don’t have anybody I think likely to grow into a viable alternative party. (And some which would be worse than the current Republicans. If you doubt it, look again at the American Independent Party. Shudder!)
Currently, the folks running the GOP, specifically at the national level, are a disgrace. But at the local level, and sometimes at the state level (see the governors of Massachusetts and Maryland), things are more hopeful. The chances of turning the party around don’t look enormously good at this point. But a) better than the chances of a different alternative “party of government” and b) even smaller if everyone disgusted with the likes of McConnell et al leaves.
So that’s why I’m still where I am. Doesn’t mean I religiously vote for them. Never was that straight party line kind of voter, but definitely don’t now.
Meanwhile,
https://news.bloomberglaw.com/health-law-and-business/trump-mulls-made-in-u-s-order-for-vital-drugs-devices
Because God forbid someone’s life be saved using foreign drugs or devices. The utter stupidity of these guys’ xenophobia is stunning.
Meanwhile,
https://news.bloomberglaw.com/health-law-and-business/trump-mulls-made-in-u-s-order-for-vital-drugs-devices
Because God forbid someone’s life be saved using foreign drugs or devices. The utter stupidity of these guys’ xenophobia is stunning.
part of the reason I even come here is because I KNOW I am biased. It’s nice to learn how, exactly, but this particular way of “discussing” doesn’t work. Or claiming an entire group of people only engage in magical thinking all of the time.
As to the former, that speaks reasonably well of you, if true. As to the latter, I believe I am the only person here who it has been claimed was engaging in magical thinking, and it was me doing the claiming.
Regarding your question about Andrew McCabe, I had forgotten many of the details, so looked some up. I see from the NYT of 2/14/20 (or do you perhaps see the NYT as fake news/hopelessly biased, as you once did when I linked something inconvenient from Huffpost?) that:
A key witness testified that Mr. McCabe had no motive to lie because he was authorized as the F.B.I.’s deputy director to speak to the news media, so he would not have had to hide any discussions with reporters. Another important witness testified he could not immediately remember how the leak unfolded. Both would have been crucial to any prosecution.
Additionally, people who are charged with lying to the F.B.I. are typically accused of committing the offense in the course of a criminal investigation, not an administrative inquiry. For example, Mr. Horowitz determined last year that a senior Justice Department official committed wrongdoing by viewing pornography on his work computers and then providing false statements to investigators, but prosecutors declined to bring charges.
Mr. McCabe’s lawyers made the case to Mr. Rosen that other former officials were not prosecuted after they were caught lying to the inspector general’s investigators.
Mr. McCabe has been a consistent foil for Mr. Trump, who repeatedly attacked Mr. McCabe’s wife, Jill, over her failed 2015 campaign for the Virginia Senate, which received hundreds of thousands of dollars in donations from a political committee run by a longtime ally of the Clintons.
So in answer to your question, a) I think under the circumstances it was reasonable for the DOJ to drop charges against McCabe, but I would not have thought it altogether unreasonable if they had not. And Barr was presumably at that time trying to appear (or maybe even be – it’s just possible) independent of pressure by Trump. But that time is long past: the spoon Barr was using to dine with the devil may have been a reasonable length to begin with, but it is now very short indeed after (for example) the Stone case. Barr is now fully in bed with Trump, an enabler of a corrupt crook and liar, as indeed your “lowlife” Michael Cohen was for many years. Trump is a cesspit of manure, and Barr is in up to his neck.
As to your laudable attempt to check your own bias, lj is essentially right. Your apparent acceptance of the Trumpian obsession with Sztrok and his girlfriend (I can’t remember her name), and your assumption that they/he would find it almost impossible to be impartial about Flynn despite their political views is projection. It is right to question whether political views influence the carrying out of professional duties, but they do not necessarily do so. Those upright prosecutors and agents you praised in California presumably all had their various prejudices, and yet acted professionally. And the conservative willingness to buy the demonisation of lifelong Republicans like Comey, Mueller and others, in their defence of Trump, is astonishing and frankly rather disgusting. The agents who signed the letter about Barr I am sure have many different opinions too, but they have no doubt read all the material you adduce and as you say have come to a different conclusion about the Barr DOJ. It is just one more example of principled public servants objecting to the degradation of American institutions, and even worse the acceptance or even embrace of that degradation. I am astonished that, as presumably a reasonably respectable lawyer, and an officer of the court, you seek to find excuses for this degradation.
For non-lawyers, an officer of the court:
In common law jurisdictions, the generic term officer of the court is applied to all those who, in some degree in the function of their professional or similar qualifications, have a part in the legal system. Officers of the court should not be confused with court officers, the law enforcement personnel who work in courts.
Officers of the court have legal and ethical obligations. They are tasked to participate to the best of their ability in the functioning of the judicial system as a whole, in order to forge justice out of the application of the law and the simultaneous pursuit of the legitimate interests of all parties and the general good of society.
part of the reason I even come here is because I KNOW I am biased. It’s nice to learn how, exactly, but this particular way of “discussing” doesn’t work. Or claiming an entire group of people only engage in magical thinking all of the time.
As to the former, that speaks reasonably well of you, if true. As to the latter, I believe I am the only person here who it has been claimed was engaging in magical thinking, and it was me doing the claiming.
Regarding your question about Andrew McCabe, I had forgotten many of the details, so looked some up. I see from the NYT of 2/14/20 (or do you perhaps see the NYT as fake news/hopelessly biased, as you once did when I linked something inconvenient from Huffpost?) that:
A key witness testified that Mr. McCabe had no motive to lie because he was authorized as the F.B.I.’s deputy director to speak to the news media, so he would not have had to hide any discussions with reporters. Another important witness testified he could not immediately remember how the leak unfolded. Both would have been crucial to any prosecution.
Additionally, people who are charged with lying to the F.B.I. are typically accused of committing the offense in the course of a criminal investigation, not an administrative inquiry. For example, Mr. Horowitz determined last year that a senior Justice Department official committed wrongdoing by viewing pornography on his work computers and then providing false statements to investigators, but prosecutors declined to bring charges.
Mr. McCabe’s lawyers made the case to Mr. Rosen that other former officials were not prosecuted after they were caught lying to the inspector general’s investigators.
Mr. McCabe has been a consistent foil for Mr. Trump, who repeatedly attacked Mr. McCabe’s wife, Jill, over her failed 2015 campaign for the Virginia Senate, which received hundreds of thousands of dollars in donations from a political committee run by a longtime ally of the Clintons.
So in answer to your question, a) I think under the circumstances it was reasonable for the DOJ to drop charges against McCabe, but I would not have thought it altogether unreasonable if they had not. And Barr was presumably at that time trying to appear (or maybe even be – it’s just possible) independent of pressure by Trump. But that time is long past: the spoon Barr was using to dine with the devil may have been a reasonable length to begin with, but it is now very short indeed after (for example) the Stone case. Barr is now fully in bed with Trump, an enabler of a corrupt crook and liar, as indeed your “lowlife” Michael Cohen was for many years. Trump is a cesspit of manure, and Barr is in up to his neck.
As to your laudable attempt to check your own bias, lj is essentially right. Your apparent acceptance of the Trumpian obsession with Sztrok and his girlfriend (I can’t remember her name), and your assumption that they/he would find it almost impossible to be impartial about Flynn despite their political views is projection. It is right to question whether political views influence the carrying out of professional duties, but they do not necessarily do so. Those upright prosecutors and agents you praised in California presumably all had their various prejudices, and yet acted professionally. And the conservative willingness to buy the demonisation of lifelong Republicans like Comey, Mueller and others, in their defence of Trump, is astonishing and frankly rather disgusting. The agents who signed the letter about Barr I am sure have many different opinions too, but they have no doubt read all the material you adduce and as you say have come to a different conclusion about the Barr DOJ. It is just one more example of principled public servants objecting to the degradation of American institutions, and even worse the acceptance or even embrace of that degradation. I am astonished that, as presumably a reasonably respectable lawyer, and an officer of the court, you seek to find excuses for this degradation.
For non-lawyers, an officer of the court:
In common law jurisdictions, the generic term officer of the court is applied to all those who, in some degree in the function of their professional or similar qualifications, have a part in the legal system. Officers of the court should not be confused with court officers, the law enforcement personnel who work in courts.
Officers of the court have legal and ethical obligations. They are tasked to participate to the best of their ability in the functioning of the judicial system as a whole, in order to forge justice out of the application of the law and the simultaneous pursuit of the legitimate interests of all parties and the general good of society.
GftNC, to answer your previous question:
Yes, “weasel words” are indeed a common expression in the States.
BUT, we also have Weasel Stomping Day.
GftNC, to answer your previous question:
Yes, “weasel words” are indeed a common expression in the States.
BUT, we also have Weasel Stomping Day.
Not particularly fond of the ‘fixed this for you’ framing, but
All I got is that I’m being lumped in with
thisMartyfeud.I should just leave GftNC’s comment as the last word, I don’t like piling on, but in case you really are baffled by losing good will, try going back to this comment
https://obsidianwings.blogs.com/obsidian_wings/2020/05/the-future-is-a-foreign-country.html?cid=6a00d834515c2369e20263ec1827ce200c#comment-6a00d834515c2369e20263ec1827ce200c
The offhanded dismissal of a source that has been scrupulous in reporting got up my nose. ‘But it was just a throwaway line’ you may exclaim. I’m certainly more than willing (and believe I have demonstrated it in the past) to let people walk back from positions, but the casual slight was either a way to put people off balance (‘oh, you read that shit?’) or was indicative of knowing where the criticism was coming from and trying to, what is it, impeach the witness? Which suggests that you are looking at this stuff as closely as we are and playing a chess game. If that’s what you want to do, fine, but don’t be shucks and golly gee when you get pushed back on it.
If you want to stake out this corner as your place, and be the guy who is concerned about FBI interviews, be my guest. If we do a Martha Stewart retrospective or want your opinions of Guiliani’s (btw where did he go) assertions about the legal process, we will let you know. But don’t call us, we’ll call you.
I’d like to think that we tolerate a lot here (maybe too much), and where you set out your jenga pile is your decision. But if people like me bump into it from time to time, spare me the pearl clutching. As Janie said, we don’t have to argue like you and arguing like a lawyer is not the only way it is done. You can stipulate all you want while Flynn may be guilty, that interview was just so gosh darn unfair, that stipulation gets granted only to the extent that you grant other people’s stipulations. Which is how you earn my good will.
Not particularly fond of the ‘fixed this for you’ framing, but
All I got is that I’m being lumped in with
thisMartyfeud.I should just leave GftNC’s comment as the last word, I don’t like piling on, but in case you really are baffled by losing good will, try going back to this comment
https://obsidianwings.blogs.com/obsidian_wings/2020/05/the-future-is-a-foreign-country.html?cid=6a00d834515c2369e20263ec1827ce200c#comment-6a00d834515c2369e20263ec1827ce200c
The offhanded dismissal of a source that has been scrupulous in reporting got up my nose. ‘But it was just a throwaway line’ you may exclaim. I’m certainly more than willing (and believe I have demonstrated it in the past) to let people walk back from positions, but the casual slight was either a way to put people off balance (‘oh, you read that shit?’) or was indicative of knowing where the criticism was coming from and trying to, what is it, impeach the witness? Which suggests that you are looking at this stuff as closely as we are and playing a chess game. If that’s what you want to do, fine, but don’t be shucks and golly gee when you get pushed back on it.
If you want to stake out this corner as your place, and be the guy who is concerned about FBI interviews, be my guest. If we do a Martha Stewart retrospective or want your opinions of Guiliani’s (btw where did he go) assertions about the legal process, we will let you know. But don’t call us, we’ll call you.
I’d like to think that we tolerate a lot here (maybe too much), and where you set out your jenga pile is your decision. But if people like me bump into it from time to time, spare me the pearl clutching. As Janie said, we don’t have to argue like you and arguing like a lawyer is not the only way it is done. You can stipulate all you want while Flynn may be guilty, that interview was just so gosh darn unfair, that stipulation gets granted only to the extent that you grant other people’s stipulations. Which is how you earn my good will.
lj, the link doesn’t work, and I can’t seem to make linking to a comment work even if I play around outside the comments. Did you mean this one, which is on the second page of this same thread?
lj, the link doesn’t work, and I can’t seem to make linking to a comment work even if I play around outside the comments. Did you mean this one, which is on the second page of this same thread?
Ex-DOJ employees are entitled to their opinions, be they political or based on actually reading the facts.
Much of what I have ready is contradictory and seems based not on actual facts, but supposition.
And one of them was Strzok! I admit to being surprised that Strzok would state that given his bias.
Texts between Page and Strzok (the biased lovers)
Sample passages from the person ordering the rest of us (specifically me) to stick to the facts, and objecting when I snark about how s/he writes as if s/he is the only unbiased observer in the universe.
When bc asserts that someone is biased, that’s a fact, because we all know that bc lives up to his/her own standards of argument.
Heh.
Ex-DOJ employees are entitled to their opinions, be they political or based on actually reading the facts.
Much of what I have ready is contradictory and seems based not on actual facts, but supposition.
And one of them was Strzok! I admit to being surprised that Strzok would state that given his bias.
Texts between Page and Strzok (the biased lovers)
Sample passages from the person ordering the rest of us (specifically me) to stick to the facts, and objecting when I snark about how s/he writes as if s/he is the only unbiased observer in the universe.
When bc asserts that someone is biased, that’s a fact, because we all know that bc lives up to his/her own standards of argument.
Heh.
Yes, that one. Thanks and I’ll have to remember that linking to comments doesn’t seem to work. Looking at bc’s comments in this thread with that as the context, it sure seems like he’s more interested in trying to prove that we, unlike him, are sheeple who think the ends justifies the means. And to engage in a little whataboutism that I usually complain about, he wants to argue that our rule of law is NOT a joke, he can start with this.
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/political-commentary/ahmaud-arbery-georgia-killing-video-emmett-till-lynching-995458/
Where people put their attention tells a lot more than what they talk about…
Yes, that one. Thanks and I’ll have to remember that linking to comments doesn’t seem to work. Looking at bc’s comments in this thread with that as the context, it sure seems like he’s more interested in trying to prove that we, unlike him, are sheeple who think the ends justifies the means. And to engage in a little whataboutism that I usually complain about, he wants to argue that our rule of law is NOT a joke, he can start with this.
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/political-commentary/ahmaud-arbery-georgia-killing-video-emmett-till-lynching-995458/
Where people put their attention tells a lot more than what they talk about…
Graphs updated….
Graphs updated….
The stupidest thing Flynn ever did was associating himself with Trump.
He was a reasonably well thought of guy before that. Probably not executive material, but a good record as an intelligence officer. Who knows, he might even have parlayed all of that into an honest-ish dollar as a security consultant and all-around talking head.
Less worthy folks have done as much.
Maybe he felt, not without merit, that he was pushed out of the DIA in 2014. Maybe the whole Trump bandwagon thing was his idea of payback.
Unfortunately for him, everything Trump touches is degraded. Everyone who enters his circle is degraded. The Trump orbit is a freaking dead zone. However this all lands, Flynn will have an asterisk next to his name for the rest of his life. Like most of the other folks who thought Trump was their meal ticket.
Can’t say he hasn’t earned it. Honorable people don’t stand in front of a crowd yelling “Lock her up!”.
I don’t wish jail for him, but if that’s how it plays out, it will be hard for me to see it as unjust. It’s only what he wished for for others. Not only wished for, but sought, advocated, embraced.
Karma actually is kind of a bitch.
The stupidest thing Flynn ever did was associating himself with Trump.
He was a reasonably well thought of guy before that. Probably not executive material, but a good record as an intelligence officer. Who knows, he might even have parlayed all of that into an honest-ish dollar as a security consultant and all-around talking head.
Less worthy folks have done as much.
Maybe he felt, not without merit, that he was pushed out of the DIA in 2014. Maybe the whole Trump bandwagon thing was his idea of payback.
Unfortunately for him, everything Trump touches is degraded. Everyone who enters his circle is degraded. The Trump orbit is a freaking dead zone. However this all lands, Flynn will have an asterisk next to his name for the rest of his life. Like most of the other folks who thought Trump was their meal ticket.
Can’t say he hasn’t earned it. Honorable people don’t stand in front of a crowd yelling “Lock her up!”.
I don’t wish jail for him, but if that’s how it plays out, it will be hard for me to see it as unjust. It’s only what he wished for for others. Not only wished for, but sought, advocated, embraced.
Karma actually is kind of a bitch.
Last comment and I’ll go back to lurking. It’s hard to read people accurately over text. A few things:
I wasn’t being dismissive of the TPM article at all. That wasn’t my intent and it was NOT a throw away line. In fact, for the most part (IMHO) the article was just reporting the facts. And shoot, it even attached the motion to dismiss (and hence my urging to read the motion or better yet the exhibits). There were a few assertions, however, that were stated as fact that I think are open to more interpretation. Hence I simply said “If one reads TPM as the truth.” I meant that literally, as in “if you accept what TPM states as the truth,” then yes, certain of the points being made by others are supported.
I’m not telling anyone what to think. Like that would work here!
Nobody has to argue “like a lawyer” or accept my method of argument (whatever that might be). Again, I repeatedly stated people should just read the exhibits.
I don’t think of anyone here as sheeple, either individually or collectively.
GFTNC, I appreciate the reasonable, thoughtful comment at 6:42.
I don’t really know what you mean, lj, about staking out “this corner.” This issue? Some sort of conservative “flavor?” I don’t think I’m staking out anything. I certainly don’t intend to.
And I have talked every day with my college daughter at home due to COVID about Ahmaud Arbery. Deeply, deeply disturbing and I had a visceral reaction to the video. It has rocked her to the core too.
And, wrs at 9:16. To hopefully not sully russell’s excellent discussion on the subject by using it as metaphor, more often than you might think, I find each of you in the pocket. I tend to only pipe up when I think you are rushing or dragging a bit and simply can’t keep a beat to save your life. On those occasions, I feel like my director that used to carry around a big drum stick and whack a music stand when we were decidedly off. You can’t play with time if you can’t feel the pulse. Luckily he did that only rarely and he was such a musical man it was out of character. So maybe there’s that in what I sometimes say.
But most of the time, I like the music, both cultural and political. And that includes all the principals and all those that comment here.
And with that, I’ll stick to listening to the music for a while.
*russell: I played trombone in a big band in college. I almost piped up when you had that discussion about being in the pocket. My own personal definition: when I couldn’t help smiling. That didn’t work well with my embouchure, btw, but you know what I mean. I learned to smile inside.
Last comment and I’ll go back to lurking. It’s hard to read people accurately over text. A few things:
I wasn’t being dismissive of the TPM article at all. That wasn’t my intent and it was NOT a throw away line. In fact, for the most part (IMHO) the article was just reporting the facts. And shoot, it even attached the motion to dismiss (and hence my urging to read the motion or better yet the exhibits). There were a few assertions, however, that were stated as fact that I think are open to more interpretation. Hence I simply said “If one reads TPM as the truth.” I meant that literally, as in “if you accept what TPM states as the truth,” then yes, certain of the points being made by others are supported.
I’m not telling anyone what to think. Like that would work here!
Nobody has to argue “like a lawyer” or accept my method of argument (whatever that might be). Again, I repeatedly stated people should just read the exhibits.
I don’t think of anyone here as sheeple, either individually or collectively.
GFTNC, I appreciate the reasonable, thoughtful comment at 6:42.
I don’t really know what you mean, lj, about staking out “this corner.” This issue? Some sort of conservative “flavor?” I don’t think I’m staking out anything. I certainly don’t intend to.
And I have talked every day with my college daughter at home due to COVID about Ahmaud Arbery. Deeply, deeply disturbing and I had a visceral reaction to the video. It has rocked her to the core too.
And, wrs at 9:16. To hopefully not sully russell’s excellent discussion on the subject by using it as metaphor, more often than you might think, I find each of you in the pocket. I tend to only pipe up when I think you are rushing or dragging a bit and simply can’t keep a beat to save your life. On those occasions, I feel like my director that used to carry around a big drum stick and whack a music stand when we were decidedly off. You can’t play with time if you can’t feel the pulse. Luckily he did that only rarely and he was such a musical man it was out of character. So maybe there’s that in what I sometimes say.
But most of the time, I like the music, both cultural and political. And that includes all the principals and all those that comment here.
And with that, I’ll stick to listening to the music for a while.
*russell: I played trombone in a big band in college. I almost piped up when you had that discussion about being in the pocket. My own personal definition: when I couldn’t help smiling. That didn’t work well with my embouchure, btw, but you know what I mean. I learned to smile inside.
My own personal definition: when I couldn’t help smiling
Haha!
Works for me.
My own personal definition: when I couldn’t help smiling
Haha!
Works for me.
bc, I appreciate you asking for some clarification. I view this place as a local bar. People come and talk about different things. So when I say ‘stake out this corner’, I imagine going down to the neighborhood place and maybe saying gee, I’m curious about left handed wrench sets and whoever says oh, you need to talk to Sam, he does a lot with those things.
It’s also why I get really pissed when people come in and talk about this as an echo chamber or shit like that. As you may have noticed. I don’t think it is that hard, but maybe it is.
It would be nice if you were the guy who, when a question about prosecutorial procedure came up, we could say, ah, bc over there knows the ins and outs, bc, what do you think? Though, as GftNC observed, if the folks you knew were so professional, how can you claim that everything went off the rails so quickly? And if you say it’s because of Strozl’s girlfriend, well, you might see why some of us are skeptical.
I respect your desire to go back to lurking, but I’d just observe that one of the problems with lawyerly argumentation is choosing to argue against the weakest arguments and leaving the other one aside, hopefully to get forgotten or lost. Since we can’t use comment links, I requote Tony P.
bc: Uh, read the motion to dismiss and the exhibits?
For us non-lawyers, bc might consider providing a bit more meat on that bone. As a non-lawyer, I have to assume that a perp’s lawyers will present the most favorable arguments and evidence possible without blatantly lying to the court. I also have to assume that, in an (actually) adversarial system, there would be counterarguments and other evidence presented to the judge — and to interested laymen with time on their hands.
Identifying the documents, the links, sourcing it is one of the bones I tend to worry and I like to see exactly where people are getting their arguments. I look back thru this, and the number of explanatory links you provide is zero. I understand that this can be deployed like jiu-jitsu, flooding the questioner with links and links and then complaining that they didn’t notice the codicil on section 34, sub section 14 and since they hadn’t read everything, they aren’t worth debating. But I’d like to think that you have a tough, but fair audience and if you pointed to particular things and linked to them, we would consider them. But if you are going to go on about ‘the biased couple’ or elide the differences between dropping McCabe’ prosecution and Flynn’s, and not explain why, well, as Russell said, karma is a bitch.
bc, I appreciate you asking for some clarification. I view this place as a local bar. People come and talk about different things. So when I say ‘stake out this corner’, I imagine going down to the neighborhood place and maybe saying gee, I’m curious about left handed wrench sets and whoever says oh, you need to talk to Sam, he does a lot with those things.
It’s also why I get really pissed when people come in and talk about this as an echo chamber or shit like that. As you may have noticed. I don’t think it is that hard, but maybe it is.
It would be nice if you were the guy who, when a question about prosecutorial procedure came up, we could say, ah, bc over there knows the ins and outs, bc, what do you think? Though, as GftNC observed, if the folks you knew were so professional, how can you claim that everything went off the rails so quickly? And if you say it’s because of Strozl’s girlfriend, well, you might see why some of us are skeptical.
I respect your desire to go back to lurking, but I’d just observe that one of the problems with lawyerly argumentation is choosing to argue against the weakest arguments and leaving the other one aside, hopefully to get forgotten or lost. Since we can’t use comment links, I requote Tony P.
bc: Uh, read the motion to dismiss and the exhibits?
For us non-lawyers, bc might consider providing a bit more meat on that bone. As a non-lawyer, I have to assume that a perp’s lawyers will present the most favorable arguments and evidence possible without blatantly lying to the court. I also have to assume that, in an (actually) adversarial system, there would be counterarguments and other evidence presented to the judge — and to interested laymen with time on their hands.
Identifying the documents, the links, sourcing it is one of the bones I tend to worry and I like to see exactly where people are getting their arguments. I look back thru this, and the number of explanatory links you provide is zero. I understand that this can be deployed like jiu-jitsu, flooding the questioner with links and links and then complaining that they didn’t notice the codicil on section 34, sub section 14 and since they hadn’t read everything, they aren’t worth debating. But I’d like to think that you have a tough, but fair audience and if you pointed to particular things and linked to them, we would consider them. But if you are going to go on about ‘the biased couple’ or elide the differences between dropping McCabe’ prosecution and Flynn’s, and not explain why, well, as Russell said, karma is a bitch.
What lj said. bc, I asked about specific sources (expecting/hoping for links) because I really was interested to see for myself. In more detail than you could reasonably include in a blog post. I’d still be interested in seeing them.
What lj said. bc, I asked about specific sources (expecting/hoping for links) because I really was interested to see for myself. In more detail than you could reasonably include in a blog post. I’d still be interested in seeing them.
No, this place isn’t an echo chamber, it’s just *highly* curated.
If you can tolerate the opinion of one more lawyer cum lurker, what happened to Flynn is in my opinion an all too common example of prosecutorial abuse that has gone unchecked by the courts and obviously the DOJ. I don’t give two figs about Flynn (though in a reverse “apple doesn’t fall far from the tree” analysis, I probably would never have a high opinion of him), but I’d be fine with a get out of jail free card if it meant some far reaching change in law/procedure/policy that would curb these perjury based prosecutions (what happened here was not a “perjury trap” as I understand the term, but close enough).
Full disclosure: I don’t practice criminal defense, but some of my clients ended up as guests of the federal government under the category of “white collar criminal” based on innocent misrepresentations in federal loan applications. Apply reverse spin accordingly.
No, this place isn’t an echo chamber, it’s just *highly* curated.
If you can tolerate the opinion of one more lawyer cum lurker, what happened to Flynn is in my opinion an all too common example of prosecutorial abuse that has gone unchecked by the courts and obviously the DOJ. I don’t give two figs about Flynn (though in a reverse “apple doesn’t fall far from the tree” analysis, I probably would never have a high opinion of him), but I’d be fine with a get out of jail free card if it meant some far reaching change in law/procedure/policy that would curb these perjury based prosecutions (what happened here was not a “perjury trap” as I understand the term, but close enough).
Full disclosure: I don’t practice criminal defense, but some of my clients ended up as guests of the federal government under the category of “white collar criminal” based on innocent misrepresentations in federal loan applications. Apply reverse spin accordingly.
Pollo, ‘curate’ implies selected and presented. I can understand if you would say self-selected, after all, I and others are going to talk what we want to talk about, though I have posted open requests for readers to write something up and written people off list to post things. I’ve also asked people to go into more detail about their experiences.
As for ‘highly’, again, I don’t post everything that pops into my head and I don’t feel like the others do, but it seems you are either misusing curate or misunderstanding how things work.
Pollo, ‘curate’ implies selected and presented. I can understand if you would say self-selected, after all, I and others are going to talk what we want to talk about, though I have posted open requests for readers to write something up and written people off list to post things. I’ve also asked people to go into more detail about their experiences.
As for ‘highly’, again, I don’t post everything that pops into my head and I don’t feel like the others do, but it seems you are either misusing curate or misunderstanding how things work.
I was only making a friendly joke aimed more at curating participants as opposed to content.
I wouldn’t get hung up on it. ObWi is gonna ObWi and that’s fine.
I’ll go back to my closet under the stairs.
I was only making a friendly joke aimed more at curating participants as opposed to content.
I wouldn’t get hung up on it. ObWi is gonna ObWi and that’s fine.
I’ll go back to my closet under the stairs.
Hey, we’re not “curated”.
“Small batch”, yeah, that I could see.
“Free Range” also, too.
Hey, we’re not “curated”.
“Small batch”, yeah, that I could see.
“Free Range” also, too.
Free range, me likee.
Free range, me likee.
I’m pickled. Does that count?
I’m pickled. Does that count?
I stayed out of it, because defending a scum like Flynn isn’t a hill I want to die on, but I agree with bc and Pollo. It strikes me as odd that the government settled for this, um, trumped up charge. They must have thought they were going to get something useful out of it.
It is also amusing that what Flynn asked from the Russians was that they not react to our sanctions. That was a good thing. He also asked the Russians to side with Israel in a UN vote condemning settlements, but they refused. If anyone took the ridiculous Logan act seriously, that seems like what you would focus on. If Trump is overly influenced by foreign governments, it would be those of Israel and Saudi Arabia.
Speaking of which—
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/16/us/arms-deals-raytheon-yemen.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage
Way too nice to the Obama Administration. The poor dears just kind of stumbled into supporting war crimes and lying about it. Ben Rhodes didn’t say a word about it in his much praised stupid book. I am guessing he hoped the issue would go away but then Khashoggi was murdered. Samantha Power glossed over it too. But as one would expect, Trump is worse, because money is the only thing he cares about other than himself.
I stayed out of it, because defending a scum like Flynn isn’t a hill I want to die on, but I agree with bc and Pollo. It strikes me as odd that the government settled for this, um, trumped up charge. They must have thought they were going to get something useful out of it.
It is also amusing that what Flynn asked from the Russians was that they not react to our sanctions. That was a good thing. He also asked the Russians to side with Israel in a UN vote condemning settlements, but they refused. If anyone took the ridiculous Logan act seriously, that seems like what you would focus on. If Trump is overly influenced by foreign governments, it would be those of Israel and Saudi Arabia.
Speaking of which—
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/16/us/arms-deals-raytheon-yemen.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage
Way too nice to the Obama Administration. The poor dears just kind of stumbled into supporting war crimes and lying about it. Ben Rhodes didn’t say a word about it in his much praised stupid book. I am guessing he hoped the issue would go away but then Khashoggi was murdered. Samantha Power glossed over it too. But as one would expect, Trump is worse, because money is the only thing he cares about other than himself.
Two excellent editorials on Flynn:
Paul Waldman
John Gleeson, David O’Neil and Marshall Miller (more impressive legal chops than I have, for sure)
People who are taking the Justice Department’s story of Flynn’s alleged set-up at face value are incredibly hopeful to find some integrity there (being charitable). This is what we face for 2020: government prevarication to aid Trump’s hold on power. And we see in some of these comments how it works.
but I agree with bc and Pollo
Quelle surprise.
Two excellent editorials on Flynn:
Paul Waldman
John Gleeson, David O’Neil and Marshall Miller (more impressive legal chops than I have, for sure)
People who are taking the Justice Department’s story of Flynn’s alleged set-up at face value are incredibly hopeful to find some integrity there (being charitable). This is what we face for 2020: government prevarication to aid Trump’s hold on power. And we see in some of these comments how it works.
but I agree with bc and Pollo
Quelle surprise.
bc,
FWIW, i appreciate your POV here. i find it interesting (if sometimes baffling).
if there were no actual conservative voices here, we lefties would have to fight with each other. and that’s not any fun.
bc,
FWIW, i appreciate your POV here. i find it interesting (if sometimes baffling).
if there were no actual conservative voices here, we lefties would have to fight with each other. and that’s not any fun.
Shut up, cleek. You’re always wrong!
Shut up, cleek. You’re always wrong!
if there were no actual conservative voices here, we lefties would have to fight with each other. and that’s not any fun.
FWIW, and as I have often said before, I agree with this.
if there were no actual conservative voices here, we lefties would have to fight with each other. and that’s not any fun.
FWIW, and as I have often said before, I agree with this.
i know. i know.
hey look, more Tara Reade!
i remain unconvinced
i know. i know.
hey look, more Tara Reade!
i remain unconvinced
Leftist infighting is a blood sport going all the way back to the French Revolution. Like our counterparts on the right, there are traditions that shall be maintained.
As to the possible government transgressions to snare Flynn, we of the leftier persuasion see this as a feature, not a bug. I am well aware of some counterexamples trotted out from time to time (cf. Waco), but on the whole, the use of the sovereign power of the US government has traditionally come down in favor of reaction. Links provided upon request. 🙂
Leftist infighting is a blood sport going all the way back to the French Revolution. Like our counterparts on the right, there are traditions that shall be maintained.
As to the possible government transgressions to snare Flynn, we of the leftier persuasion see this as a feature, not a bug. I am well aware of some counterexamples trotted out from time to time (cf. Waco), but on the whole, the use of the sovereign power of the US government has traditionally come down in favor of reaction. Links provided upon request. 🙂
bc,
FWIW, i appreciate your POV here.
Likewise.
It’s always tough having the minority POV in any community. Always glad to see you, whenever you are inclined to jump in.
bc,
FWIW, i appreciate your POV here.
Likewise.
It’s always tough having the minority POV in any community. Always glad to see you, whenever you are inclined to jump in.
Donald: … the government settled for this, um, trumped up charge.
I know “the government” is a term of art here. But terms of art can be confusing to laymen, so:
He, Trump selected his enthusiastic early backer, Jefferson Beauregard Sessions, to run His Justice Department.
Jeff failed to meet He, Trump’s Roy Cohn standard by recusing himself from Trump-Russia matters owing to his own shady contacts during the campaign.
He, Trump’s appointee for Deputy AG, Rod Rosenstein, appointed lifelong Republican Robert Mueller as Special Counsel.
Bob Mueller took over some of the already-existing investigations into “Trump-Russia”.
Mueller’s team interviewed Flynn, who He, Trump had used as an attack dog (“Lock her up!”) in the campaign, then picked to run the NSC, then fired for “lying to the Vice President”.
Flynn admitted to having lied to the FBI, and Mueller “trumped up” a charge to which Flynn pleaded guilty in court. Mueller’s prosecutors recommended a very lenient penalty at Flynn’s sentencing hearing.
Judge Emmet Sullivan, looking at a record we mere citizens were not allowed full access to, warned Flynn that his sentence might not be quite as wrist-slappy as the sweetheart deal Mueller’s team was offering. Flynn decided to agree to a postponement and further cooperation with Mueller.
Then He, Trump picked William Barr, pardoner of the Iran-Contra perps in his first go-round as AG, to take over from the interim non-entity Matthew Whitaker, and Flynn changed lawyers. Then it was practically now and history stopped.
Which, if any, of this cast of characters do we mean by “The Government”?
–TP
Donald: … the government settled for this, um, trumped up charge.
I know “the government” is a term of art here. But terms of art can be confusing to laymen, so:
He, Trump selected his enthusiastic early backer, Jefferson Beauregard Sessions, to run His Justice Department.
Jeff failed to meet He, Trump’s Roy Cohn standard by recusing himself from Trump-Russia matters owing to his own shady contacts during the campaign.
He, Trump’s appointee for Deputy AG, Rod Rosenstein, appointed lifelong Republican Robert Mueller as Special Counsel.
Bob Mueller took over some of the already-existing investigations into “Trump-Russia”.
Mueller’s team interviewed Flynn, who He, Trump had used as an attack dog (“Lock her up!”) in the campaign, then picked to run the NSC, then fired for “lying to the Vice President”.
Flynn admitted to having lied to the FBI, and Mueller “trumped up” a charge to which Flynn pleaded guilty in court. Mueller’s prosecutors recommended a very lenient penalty at Flynn’s sentencing hearing.
Judge Emmet Sullivan, looking at a record we mere citizens were not allowed full access to, warned Flynn that his sentence might not be quite as wrist-slappy as the sweetheart deal Mueller’s team was offering. Flynn decided to agree to a postponement and further cooperation with Mueller.
Then He, Trump picked William Barr, pardoner of the Iran-Contra perps in his first go-round as AG, to take over from the interim non-entity Matthew Whitaker, and Flynn changed lawyers. Then it was practically now and history stopped.
Which, if any, of this cast of characters do we mean by “The Government”?
–TP
guests of the federal government under the category of “white collar criminal” based on innocent misrepresentations in federal loan applications.
I quite agree that the system can be, and on occasion is being, abused. But it seems like quite a stretch to equate what Flynn did with an “innocent misrepresentations in federal loan applications”. But perhaps I am not sufficiently familiar with the process used by most people filling out said applications.
guests of the federal government under the category of “white collar criminal” based on innocent misrepresentations in federal loan applications.
I quite agree that the system can be, and on occasion is being, abused. But it seems like quite a stretch to equate what Flynn did with an “innocent misrepresentations in federal loan applications”. But perhaps I am not sufficiently familiar with the process used by most people filling out said applications.
Excellent exposition and question, TonyP!
Excellent exposition and question, TonyP!
…..based on innocent misrepresentations in federal loan applications.
Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Really, I read that somewhere. Maybe you find that hard to believe, but in all innocence, I swear I did. Really.
…..based on innocent misrepresentations in federal loan applications.
Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Really, I read that somewhere. Maybe you find that hard to believe, but in all innocence, I swear I did. Really.
It strikes me as odd that the government settled for this, um, trumped up charge.
my impression in general is that prosecutors go with a charge that they can make stick, and that will be the least PITA to proceed with, and on top of that the charge they go with may be the product of negotiation with the party being charged.
They must have thought they were going to get something useful out of it.
Seems like they got a confession out of it.
It is also amusing that what Flynn asked from the Russians was that they not react to our sanctions. That was a good thing.
Don’t disagree.
He also asked the Russians to side with Israel in a UN vote condemning settlements, but they refused. If anyone took the ridiculous Logan act seriously, that seems like what you would focus on.
Don’t disagree.
Basically, I don’t really care if Flynn goes to jail or not, as long he stays the hell out of government. And dropping the charges against him is as political a stunt as anything else that’s happened in the last 4 years, and more so than most.
My 2 cents, FWIW.
It strikes me as odd that the government settled for this, um, trumped up charge.
my impression in general is that prosecutors go with a charge that they can make stick, and that will be the least PITA to proceed with, and on top of that the charge they go with may be the product of negotiation with the party being charged.
They must have thought they were going to get something useful out of it.
Seems like they got a confession out of it.
It is also amusing that what Flynn asked from the Russians was that they not react to our sanctions. That was a good thing.
Don’t disagree.
He also asked the Russians to side with Israel in a UN vote condemning settlements, but they refused. If anyone took the ridiculous Logan act seriously, that seems like what you would focus on.
Don’t disagree.
Basically, I don’t really care if Flynn goes to jail or not, as long he stays the hell out of government. And dropping the charges against him is as political a stunt as anything else that’s happened in the last 4 years, and more so than most.
My 2 cents, FWIW.
my impression in general is that prosecutors go with a charge that they can make stick, and that will be the least PITA to proceed with, and on top of that the charge they go with may be the product of negotiation with the party being charged.
Bookmark this to come back to in a discussion (if I can get my act together to draft it) of “facts,” and styles and “rules” for argumentation.
bc wants everyone to stick to “facts,” as if facts were as hard as cement and as incontrovertible, unchangeable, and finite as 2+2=4.
I say (briefly for the moment): it isn’t so.
my impression in general is that prosecutors go with a charge that they can make stick, and that will be the least PITA to proceed with, and on top of that the charge they go with may be the product of negotiation with the party being charged.
Bookmark this to come back to in a discussion (if I can get my act together to draft it) of “facts,” and styles and “rules” for argumentation.
bc wants everyone to stick to “facts,” as if facts were as hard as cement and as incontrovertible, unchangeable, and finite as 2+2=4.
I say (briefly for the moment): it isn’t so.
While there is a political aspect to dropping the charges, Flynn isnt a crook. The others who went jail are, or were, where they should be.
I think dropping the charges at this point in what could reasonably be defined as an overzealous prosecution is an acceptable step. Whatever he did, he has been appropriately chastised.
While there is a political aspect to dropping the charges, Flynn isnt a crook. The others who went jail are, or were, where they should be.
I think dropping the charges at this point in what could reasonably be defined as an overzealous prosecution is an acceptable step. Whatever he did, he has been appropriately chastised.
Since, when discussing the Flynn case, there may be an implication that some of us are anxious for Flynn to go to jail as if that is the issue, I just want to clarify why I care about this, and why the news that the DOJ had dropped the charges hit me like such a thunderbolt.
In recent years, and for reason, people have chucked around references to the US as becoming like a banana republic, and to the fact that Trump is behaving like an authoritarian strongman. And some lefties here have no doubt (and also for reason) taken it for granted that increasingly in America, money talks, and gets the talkers what they want. But the naked presentation, without pretence, that a corrupt POTUS has to do no more than make his displeasure apparent when his cronies are held to account so that then said cronies are exempt from all legal consequences looked to outsiders like a considerably more dramatic skid down the slippery slope. YMMV, but the Flynn affair symbolised to those of us who had not taken for granted that the DOJ was corrupt (after all, parts of the left have taken the opposite view) that now it obviously was. And when the administration of the law is openly, unapologetically corrupt and in the pockets of the rich and powerful, then descent into corrupt, lawless authoritarianism seems to have that much less of an obstacle to overcome.
Since, when discussing the Flynn case, there may be an implication that some of us are anxious for Flynn to go to jail as if that is the issue, I just want to clarify why I care about this, and why the news that the DOJ had dropped the charges hit me like such a thunderbolt.
In recent years, and for reason, people have chucked around references to the US as becoming like a banana republic, and to the fact that Trump is behaving like an authoritarian strongman. And some lefties here have no doubt (and also for reason) taken it for granted that increasingly in America, money talks, and gets the talkers what they want. But the naked presentation, without pretence, that a corrupt POTUS has to do no more than make his displeasure apparent when his cronies are held to account so that then said cronies are exempt from all legal consequences looked to outsiders like a considerably more dramatic skid down the slippery slope. YMMV, but the Flynn affair symbolised to those of us who had not taken for granted that the DOJ was corrupt (after all, parts of the left have taken the opposite view) that now it obviously was. And when the administration of the law is openly, unapologetically corrupt and in the pockets of the rich and powerful, then descent into corrupt, lawless authoritarianism seems to have that much less of an obstacle to overcome.
GftNC: … lawless authoritarianism seems to have that much less of an obstacle to overcome.
So does JDT’s version of “justice”.
Marty seems convinced that Hillary is a criminal and Michael “lock her up” Flynn isn’t. I have no doubt AT ALL which of those obstacle-overcoming possibilities Marty will prefer.
–TP
GftNC: … lawless authoritarianism seems to have that much less of an obstacle to overcome.
So does JDT’s version of “justice”.
Marty seems convinced that Hillary is a criminal and Michael “lock her up” Flynn isn’t. I have no doubt AT ALL which of those obstacle-overcoming possibilities Marty will prefer.
–TP
then descent into corrupt, lawless authoritarianism seems to have that much less of an obstacle to overcome
Oh, and as a side (but connected) issue, the systematic disposal of any Inspectors General actually doing their jobs….
then descent into corrupt, lawless authoritarianism seems to have that much less of an obstacle to overcome
Oh, and as a side (but connected) issue, the systematic disposal of any Inspectors General actually doing their jobs….
I appreciate the concern, GftNC, but I find the banana republic reference inappropriate. The wheels of government turn, as do the wheels of justice. More than one of Trumps “cronies” have gone to jail and remain there. He has been investigated and the charges found wanting by some people with every interest in getting rid of him constantly for 3.5 years.
The weakest of all the possible charges, the Ukraine bs, were all they could bring to the table.
He is a despicable human being but he has operated at least just within the law as far as I can tell.
The left WANTS him to be a corrupt, lawless authoritarian so they can use that against him. I do believe he is naturally authoritarian, he is used to being the boss. One of the challenges of electing someone with his lack of understanding of the role and limitations of the President who has been a CEO and business owner is their frustration at not being in control. He exhibits this daily. I’m sure he does want and expect people to just do what he says, but that isnt the reality in this country and it wont be.
It doesn’t require a big crusade to save the country, it is just a constant irritant that he chafes against those limitations, creating conflict and chaos. But he hasnt actually broken any of them down.
I appreciate the concern, GftNC, but I find the banana republic reference inappropriate. The wheels of government turn, as do the wheels of justice. More than one of Trumps “cronies” have gone to jail and remain there. He has been investigated and the charges found wanting by some people with every interest in getting rid of him constantly for 3.5 years.
The weakest of all the possible charges, the Ukraine bs, were all they could bring to the table.
He is a despicable human being but he has operated at least just within the law as far as I can tell.
The left WANTS him to be a corrupt, lawless authoritarian so they can use that against him. I do believe he is naturally authoritarian, he is used to being the boss. One of the challenges of electing someone with his lack of understanding of the role and limitations of the President who has been a CEO and business owner is their frustration at not being in control. He exhibits this daily. I’m sure he does want and expect people to just do what he says, but that isnt the reality in this country and it wont be.
It doesn’t require a big crusade to save the country, it is just a constant irritant that he chafes against those limitations, creating conflict and chaos. But he hasnt actually broken any of them down.
He is a despicable human being but he has operated at least just within the law as far as I can tell.
Just to be clear, I assume by “He” here you mean Flynn. Because there’s no way to plausibly say that about Trump.
I disagree about Flynn. But at least you can make a case there.
He is a despicable human being but he has operated at least just within the law as far as I can tell.
Just to be clear, I assume by “He” here you mean Flynn. Because there’s no way to plausibly say that about Trump.
I disagree about Flynn. But at least you can make a case there.
He has been investigated and the charges found wanting by some people with every interest in getting rid of him constantly for 3.5 years.
Marty, you rejected this very argument in the case of HRC’s career as an international master criminal! But I am determined not to argue with you – let’s wait (perhaps) til after November, and in the meantime stick to discussing e.g. Dylan’s late burst of creativity.
He has been investigated and the charges found wanting by some people with every interest in getting rid of him constantly for 3.5 years.
Marty, you rejected this very argument in the case of HRC’s career as an international master criminal! But I am determined not to argue with you – let’s wait (perhaps) til after November, and in the meantime stick to discussing e.g. Dylan’s late burst of creativity.
Let’s do avoid it,because there is a huge difference which probably wont matter after Nov.
Let’s do avoid it,because there is a huge difference which probably wont matter after Nov.
Just who are the real Dreyfusards here?
Just who are the real Dreyfusards here?
Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Really, I read that somewhere. Maybe you find that hard to believe, but in all innocence, I swear I did. Really.
Culpae poenae par esto.
But it seems like quite a stretch to equate what Flynn did with an “innocent misrepresentations in federal loan applications”.
I don’t think that I made such a comparison. I was only offering context for my comments so people could give them the proper weight.
In my case, the clients had expertise in ME languages and after 9/11 they were approached about greatly ramping up their capacity by the departments of state and defense. They were told what to put on the SBA loan applications. When SBA sicced DoT on them, that didn’t matter and a friendly audit turned into a lynching.
The bottom line is that I find DOJ tactics like this to be abhorrent. I could not care less about Flynn. Like all criminal defendants, he gets the benefit of Blackstone’s ratio from me but that’s about the extent of it. Just like I didn’t care about OJ, but his acquittal resulted in some much needed reforms at the LAPD (not enough, but better than nothing).
Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Really, I read that somewhere. Maybe you find that hard to believe, but in all innocence, I swear I did. Really.
Culpae poenae par esto.
But it seems like quite a stretch to equate what Flynn did with an “innocent misrepresentations in federal loan applications”.
I don’t think that I made such a comparison. I was only offering context for my comments so people could give them the proper weight.
In my case, the clients had expertise in ME languages and after 9/11 they were approached about greatly ramping up their capacity by the departments of state and defense. They were told what to put on the SBA loan applications. When SBA sicced DoT on them, that didn’t matter and a friendly audit turned into a lynching.
The bottom line is that I find DOJ tactics like this to be abhorrent. I could not care less about Flynn. Like all criminal defendants, he gets the benefit of Blackstone’s ratio from me but that’s about the extent of it. Just like I didn’t care about OJ, but his acquittal resulted in some much needed reforms at the LAPD (not enough, but better than nothing).
Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Really, I read that somewhere. Maybe you find that hard to believe, but in all innocence, I swear I did. Really.
Luckily, I have my handy pocket reference to the 300,000 federal laws I could be in breach of…
Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Really, I read that somewhere. Maybe you find that hard to believe, but in all innocence, I swear I did. Really.
Luckily, I have my handy pocket reference to the 300,000 federal laws I could be in breach of…
Let’s do avoid it,because there is a huge difference which probably wont matter after Nov.
Well, if you say so.
Let’s do avoid it,because there is a huge difference which probably wont matter after Nov.
Well, if you say so.
The left WANTS him to be a corrupt, lawless authoritarian so they can use that against him.
You’re entitled to your point of view, and you are welcome to state your point of view.
Give up the mind reading, you’re not good at it, and it’s annoying when you pretend to speak for other people.
Thanks.
The left WANTS him to be a corrupt, lawless authoritarian so they can use that against him.
You’re entitled to your point of view, and you are welcome to state your point of view.
Give up the mind reading, you’re not good at it, and it’s annoying when you pretend to speak for other people.
Thanks.
But he hasnt actually broken any of them down.
he’s made open bribery from the WH an acceptable practice.
just kidding. it won’t be acceptable at all, as soon as some Dem tries it.
But he hasnt actually broken any of them down.
he’s made open bribery from the WH an acceptable practice.
just kidding. it won’t be acceptable at all, as soon as some Dem tries it.
quick quiz.
guess the party of this state representative!
go on, guess.
quick quiz.
guess the party of this state representative!
go on, guess.
Hold on to your hats. It’s coming.
Hold on to your hats. It’s coming.
So bobbyp, in light of the deeply pessimistic contents of your last two links, what are you doing to get ready? If your last name was Clinton or Obama, or even let’s say Pelosi, what would you be doing to get ready?
So bobbyp, in light of the deeply pessimistic contents of your last two links, what are you doing to get ready? If your last name was Clinton or Obama, or even let’s say Pelosi, what would you be doing to get ready?
Trump is following the Bannon strategy. Flood the zone with shit. The full quote:
It’s not coming, it’s been here, for the last 4+ years. Every day, we swim in a flood of shit. Instrumental shit, designed and delivered to keep us talking about stupid nonsensical irrelevancies.
If I were Clinton or Obama or Pelosi, my suggestion would be to say “That’s a crock of shit” and then start talking about something relevant to the health of that nation.
If I were Biden, I’d do the same.
If I were just me, I’d do the same.
It’s a crock of shit. Let’s talk about something else.
No disrespect to bobbyp, I’m just tired of playing this stupid game on Trump’s terms. Fuck him and the horse he rode in on.
Trump is following the Bannon strategy. Flood the zone with shit. The full quote:
It’s not coming, it’s been here, for the last 4+ years. Every day, we swim in a flood of shit. Instrumental shit, designed and delivered to keep us talking about stupid nonsensical irrelevancies.
If I were Clinton or Obama or Pelosi, my suggestion would be to say “That’s a crock of shit” and then start talking about something relevant to the health of that nation.
If I were Biden, I’d do the same.
If I were just me, I’d do the same.
It’s a crock of shit. Let’s talk about something else.
No disrespect to bobbyp, I’m just tired of playing this stupid game on Trump’s terms. Fuck him and the horse he rode in on.
As an aside, I’ll just say that the freaking nihilism of today’s (R) party is breathtaking.
If you want any respect from me, you’re gonna have to walk the hell away from the (R) party. They’ve sold their damned souls to the devil.
I’m happy to talk with conservatives about conservative ideas. I have no interest in talking about (R) governance, because it’s non-existent. If you want to point to guys like Baker in MA, or whatever other (R) governor hasn’t utterly lost his or her mind, I’ll say that’s of interest but is so anomalous as to be noise. A freaking rounding error.
Charlie Baker couldn’t win a primary west of the Hudson. Probably west of the Connecticut.
The (R)’s sold their souls with Nixon’s southern strategy, and it’s been downhill ever since.
Not my problem, except they’re intent on taking the whole country down with them.
I used to think that it was the responsibility of conservatives with integrity to turn their party around. I don’t think that’s on offer anymore, it’s gone too far for too long.
Walk the hell away. If you feel like you need to keep that (R) in your permanent record, no worries. Whatever, it’s just a label. We can all relate to nostalgia for better times.
Walk the hell away from these guys.
If you want to talk about policy, great. If you want to talk about today’s (R) party, I’m out. Feel free, I’m sure someone else will talk to you. But I’m out.
This shit is beyond the pale.
As an aside, I’ll just say that the freaking nihilism of today’s (R) party is breathtaking.
If you want any respect from me, you’re gonna have to walk the hell away from the (R) party. They’ve sold their damned souls to the devil.
I’m happy to talk with conservatives about conservative ideas. I have no interest in talking about (R) governance, because it’s non-existent. If you want to point to guys like Baker in MA, or whatever other (R) governor hasn’t utterly lost his or her mind, I’ll say that’s of interest but is so anomalous as to be noise. A freaking rounding error.
Charlie Baker couldn’t win a primary west of the Hudson. Probably west of the Connecticut.
The (R)’s sold their souls with Nixon’s southern strategy, and it’s been downhill ever since.
Not my problem, except they’re intent on taking the whole country down with them.
I used to think that it was the responsibility of conservatives with integrity to turn their party around. I don’t think that’s on offer anymore, it’s gone too far for too long.
Walk the hell away. If you feel like you need to keep that (R) in your permanent record, no worries. Whatever, it’s just a label. We can all relate to nostalgia for better times.
Walk the hell away from these guys.
If you want to talk about policy, great. If you want to talk about today’s (R) party, I’m out. Feel free, I’m sure someone else will talk to you. But I’m out.
This shit is beyond the pale.
Janie,
At the age of 71, there’s not a lot I can effectively do to “get ready” for much of anything 🙂 Pretty much all I can do is to shout my case, contribute to my causes, show up when called, cross my fingers, and hope.
One would rationally think that Trump’s incompetence in the face of a raging pandemic would bring the American people to its senses. Sadly, the polarization that has taken over our politics has only deepened. To make matters worse, after this, the nightmare of global climate change still looms over the entire planet.
It’s almost like we are back in the 1850’s approaching the abyss. Going all John Brown seems rather pointless right now. So what did good people do then? They did what they could.
As to our Dem leaders…they need to lead us and win this election and also take the Senate. Barring that, they need be willing to “go to the mattresses” as it were and be prepared for total obstruction against the political nihilism that is today’s Republican Party.
That’s my take.
Thank you for asking. Stay safe.
Janie,
At the age of 71, there’s not a lot I can effectively do to “get ready” for much of anything 🙂 Pretty much all I can do is to shout my case, contribute to my causes, show up when called, cross my fingers, and hope.
One would rationally think that Trump’s incompetence in the face of a raging pandemic would bring the American people to its senses. Sadly, the polarization that has taken over our politics has only deepened. To make matters worse, after this, the nightmare of global climate change still looms over the entire planet.
It’s almost like we are back in the 1850’s approaching the abyss. Going all John Brown seems rather pointless right now. So what did good people do then? They did what they could.
As to our Dem leaders…they need to lead us and win this election and also take the Senate. Barring that, they need be willing to “go to the mattresses” as it were and be prepared for total obstruction against the political nihilism that is today’s Republican Party.
That’s my take.
Thank you for asking. Stay safe.
russell — well, we’ll see whether Clickbait goes beyond getting his enablers out of jail and starts actually trying to put his enemies in jail, instead of just shouting about it.
But I’m also thinking of things like this, in my own little backwater state of Maine:
Today, our idiot former governor joined protestors at the State House. He says he’s going to run against Mills next time. (Heaven forfend.) The protest wasn’t small.
The restaurant owner who has defied the state and stayed open despite having his licenses yanked, and now despite a court order, says he’ll go to jail sooner than close.
A few days ago I linked to the pastor who’s having services outside, but still in defiance of the emergency orders and a loss in Federal court.
This shit is going on all over the country.
So my question to bobbyp isn’t just about Clickbait doing a Bannon, it’s also about what’s going to happen if he continues that game to the point where these boneheads finally start shooting.
From one angle, his performance in the face of the pandemic has been so execrable that it’s easy to indulge in the wishful thinking that says it will sink him deeper than a lead anchor.
From another angle, it looks like an unexpected gift, perfect excuse to finish the job he’s started. With states “opening” again, with lots of people defying the partial closures that remain in place, the virus is going to be a very bad problem over the summer. Clickbait has done a lot to chip away at institutional structures at the Federal level; what happens when state and local governments start to falter because of the health crisis?
I dunno. It looks like Biden, Obama, et al. are doing more or less what you suggested. (Great minds think alike!) But if I were any of them, I think I’d also be making some backup plans.
Not that I’d talk about any of it in public, mind you.
*****
While I was trying to write this, russell wrote again and bobbyp too (thank you both!). I have been worried about Hillary’s safety since the last election, and now I’m worried about all of them. But I guess I have to trust to the Secret Service on that score, and to all those people being much more savvy than I am about almost everything.
bobbyp — my own “plans” are much like yours. I remember once writing on this blog, in response to some gay rights discussion or other where one of those old commenters (Jay Jerome, I believe, and I hope I don’t rouse him from the dead by mentioning his name) was being very nasty. I said I had my path drawn through the woods to Canada…..which of course was more or less metaphorical. But I still do wonder sometimes.
Stay safe back atcha.
russell — well, we’ll see whether Clickbait goes beyond getting his enablers out of jail and starts actually trying to put his enemies in jail, instead of just shouting about it.
But I’m also thinking of things like this, in my own little backwater state of Maine:
Today, our idiot former governor joined protestors at the State House. He says he’s going to run against Mills next time. (Heaven forfend.) The protest wasn’t small.
The restaurant owner who has defied the state and stayed open despite having his licenses yanked, and now despite a court order, says he’ll go to jail sooner than close.
A few days ago I linked to the pastor who’s having services outside, but still in defiance of the emergency orders and a loss in Federal court.
This shit is going on all over the country.
So my question to bobbyp isn’t just about Clickbait doing a Bannon, it’s also about what’s going to happen if he continues that game to the point where these boneheads finally start shooting.
From one angle, his performance in the face of the pandemic has been so execrable that it’s easy to indulge in the wishful thinking that says it will sink him deeper than a lead anchor.
From another angle, it looks like an unexpected gift, perfect excuse to finish the job he’s started. With states “opening” again, with lots of people defying the partial closures that remain in place, the virus is going to be a very bad problem over the summer. Clickbait has done a lot to chip away at institutional structures at the Federal level; what happens when state and local governments start to falter because of the health crisis?
I dunno. It looks like Biden, Obama, et al. are doing more or less what you suggested. (Great minds think alike!) But if I were any of them, I think I’d also be making some backup plans.
Not that I’d talk about any of it in public, mind you.
*****
While I was trying to write this, russell wrote again and bobbyp too (thank you both!). I have been worried about Hillary’s safety since the last election, and now I’m worried about all of them. But I guess I have to trust to the Secret Service on that score, and to all those people being much more savvy than I am about almost everything.
bobbyp — my own “plans” are much like yours. I remember once writing on this blog, in response to some gay rights discussion or other where one of those old commenters (Jay Jerome, I believe, and I hope I don’t rouse him from the dead by mentioning his name) was being very nasty. I said I had my path drawn through the woods to Canada…..which of course was more or less metaphorical. But I still do wonder sometimes.
Stay safe back atcha.
Oh, and besides thinking that all this “opening” is going to make the virus surge even worse than before, I think some states are going to lie about it. Too many people already believe a bunch of lies about it. So it’s not like flooding the airwaves with nonsense is cost-free.
Oh, and besides thinking that all this “opening” is going to make the virus surge even worse than before, I think some states are going to lie about it. Too many people already believe a bunch of lies about it. So it’s not like flooding the airwaves with nonsense is cost-free.
One would rationally think that Trump’s incompetence in the face of a raging pandemic would bring the American people to its senses.
Nope.
They’ll shoot you in the head for telling them they need to wear a mask.
Went to the dump today, it’s kind of a weekly ritual. Do some pruning, mow the lawn, break down the cardboard boxes from whatever UPS or FedEx delivered this week. Go to the dump, stop at the community store on the way out to swap an empty propane tank for a new one.
Probably 1 out of 3 people at the dump, no mask. I have no freaking idea why not.
Some of these folks were actually wearing mask-like stuff – bandanas or similar, or even an actual mask – they just couldn’t be bothered to use it to cover their faces. Bandana around the neck, or even a mask dangling from the ears, just not covering their face.
People’s Republic of MA.
It’s not about “coming to your senses”, it’s about giving a shit. People can’t be bothered. Not until it bites them in their own personal ass.
They consider that to be freedom.
One would rationally think that Trump’s incompetence in the face of a raging pandemic would bring the American people to its senses.
Nope.
They’ll shoot you in the head for telling them they need to wear a mask.
Went to the dump today, it’s kind of a weekly ritual. Do some pruning, mow the lawn, break down the cardboard boxes from whatever UPS or FedEx delivered this week. Go to the dump, stop at the community store on the way out to swap an empty propane tank for a new one.
Probably 1 out of 3 people at the dump, no mask. I have no freaking idea why not.
Some of these folks were actually wearing mask-like stuff – bandanas or similar, or even an actual mask – they just couldn’t be bothered to use it to cover their faces. Bandana around the neck, or even a mask dangling from the ears, just not covering their face.
People’s Republic of MA.
It’s not about “coming to your senses”, it’s about giving a shit. People can’t be bothered. Not until it bites them in their own personal ass.
They consider that to be freedom.
Once I get to this in the thread I stop reading.
Why bother.
“If you want any respect from me, you’re gonna have to walk the hell away from the (R) party. They’ve sold their damned souls to the devil.”
I can assure you I havent sold my soul to anyone.
Once I get to this in the thread I stop reading.
Why bother.
“If you want any respect from me, you’re gonna have to walk the hell away from the (R) party. They’ve sold their damned souls to the devil.”
I can assure you I havent sold my soul to anyone.
Fuck him and the horse he rode in on.
russell, for shame! That horse has to qualify as a rescue animal.
Everyone and everything around Trump gets degraded. But the people made a choice; a horse wouldn’t have that option. And it would get degraded anyway.
Fuck him and the horse he rode in on.
russell, for shame! That horse has to qualify as a rescue animal.
Everyone and everything around Trump gets degraded. But the people made a choice; a horse wouldn’t have that option. And it would get degraded anyway.
Marty, I’m sure you didn’t sell it, I just think you gave it away.
One more hint: Things aren’t always about you.
Marty, I’m sure you didn’t sell it, I just think you gave it away.
One more hint: Things aren’t always about you.
Some of these folks were actually wearing mask-like stuff – bandanas or similar, or even an actual mask – they just couldn’t be bothered to use it to cover their faces. Bandana around the neck, or even a mask dangling from the ears, just not covering their face.
Trying to picture this, and explain it, because I also went out today with a mask available, but not always on.
I had to meet some people for about 3 minutes (outside), and wore my mask, but then stepped back several feet and lowered it, because no one can understand me if I speak through a mask, and I had to explain some things (in as short a time as possible before the meeting ended).
Were you seeing people outdoors with masks dangling? That’s kind of what I do – I have the mask when I know I’m going to be close to people, but don’t wear it constantly. It got to 90 degrees today in C’ville. I wear a mask when I’m going to be interacting with someone, unless I can step far enough away (outside) that a mask seems unnecessary. Indoors, I always wear a mask. Outdoors, having a mask dangling seems okay to me, if people wear it when they get close.
If that’s not appropriate, let me know, because I might be doing it wrong.
Some of these folks were actually wearing mask-like stuff – bandanas or similar, or even an actual mask – they just couldn’t be bothered to use it to cover their faces. Bandana around the neck, or even a mask dangling from the ears, just not covering their face.
Trying to picture this, and explain it, because I also went out today with a mask available, but not always on.
I had to meet some people for about 3 minutes (outside), and wore my mask, but then stepped back several feet and lowered it, because no one can understand me if I speak through a mask, and I had to explain some things (in as short a time as possible before the meeting ended).
Were you seeing people outdoors with masks dangling? That’s kind of what I do – I have the mask when I know I’m going to be close to people, but don’t wear it constantly. It got to 90 degrees today in C’ville. I wear a mask when I’m going to be interacting with someone, unless I can step far enough away (outside) that a mask seems unnecessary. Indoors, I always wear a mask. Outdoors, having a mask dangling seems okay to me, if people wear it when they get close.
If that’s not appropriate, let me know, because I might be doing it wrong.
Editing my previous comment to say that indoors, not in my home, I always wear a mask.
Editing my previous comment to say that indoors, not in my home, I always wear a mask.
After giving them everything, thus enabling them to tilt the playing field even more in their favor, all they can now think of is getting out.
It’s the kind of thinking you’d expect to encounter in 1791 Versailles or 1916 St. Petersburg.
It is a portender of social calamity.
After giving them everything, thus enabling them to tilt the playing field even more in their favor, all they can now think of is getting out.
It’s the kind of thinking you’d expect to encounter in 1791 Versailles or 1916 St. Petersburg.
It is a portender of social calamity.
Marty, I’m sure you didn’t sell it, I just think you gave it away.
Tax cuts, deregulation, judges.
Enjoy it.
Were you seeing people outdoors with masks dangling?
Yes
Marty, I’m sure you didn’t sell it, I just think you gave it away.
Tax cuts, deregulation, judges.
Enjoy it.
Were you seeing people outdoors with masks dangling?
Yes
Were you seeing people outdoors with masks dangling?
To expand:
Yes. Some far apart, some not.
Were you seeing people outdoors with masks dangling?
To expand:
Yes. Some far apart, some not.
all they can now think of is getting out.
Sayonara
all they can now think of is getting out.
Sayonara
Yes. Some far apart, some not.
I feel that we should agree on on a protocol for mask practices, and on acceptable behavior in general, because this is going to last for a long time. The safest thing to do is to stay at home. That can’t last for much longer.
Let me describe my day:
I had to meet some people for a work project for 3 minutes outside today. I greeted them with a mask on, but told them that I had to step back at a greater distance, so that I could lower my mask because I had to give them some information, and they would need to be able to understand me. I did that. This happened outside. Meeting adjourned afterwards.
Later on: This was the first really hot day I went out in public. Because I had a zoom cocktail party, and there was something to celebrate, I picked up some hors d’oeuvres from a local restaurant (which was providing grab and go. Although our governor has allowed restaurants to serve outdoors, with social distancing as of yesterday, this restaurant and many other establishments are not doing that yet, which is fine – I wanted to grab and go.)
So I waited in my car until I was texted, then got out of my car senza mask because it was clear that I could be 15 feet away to tell the restaurant staff person that I was me. She put the stuff on a table, and I waved, said thank you, waited until she was far enough away, and grabbed my food. I delivered it to my friends’ front doors. No mask.
This weekend would have been graduation weekend at UVA, but that was cancelled. However, my delivery journey took me into student housing neighborhoods where I saw subdued (but more than 10 people) celebrations happening. I saw two people on the sidewalk, without masks, one of whom was donning a mortar board, run to each other for a great big hug. I was driving, so not sure what the nature of the celebrations really were about.
On my zoom call, one of the participants reported that he went on a hike and a group of [Asian – just so we were all clear – he assumed Chinese] people, about 20 of them, approached him, where none were wearing masks. [Just so everyone knows, I am fully aware that most people who actually come from China wear masks as a matter of course when they’re sick, so I was really uncomfortable with this depiction of events, and said so. Still frazzled.]
So this is my thing: I will wear a mask at a store, or other indoor environment that is not my home. I am not going to wear a mask outside unless I’m likely to be less than 6 feet away from someone. I’ll have a mask dangling in case that comes about. I’ll be angry at people who resist social distancing as a matter of politics.
I think people aren’t really sure of the rules. I’m not saying this to be snide – Virginia is opening up (in a very conservative and reasonable way, IMO), and other states will do the same. We all need to figure out a way to behave. Also, let’s dispense with the racial whatever. And not sure, if I’m out on a hike, what to think of people I encounter who don’t have masks. It’s really hot in Virginia, and it’s less likely (I think?) that Covid is spread outdoors.
Yes. Some far apart, some not.
I feel that we should agree on on a protocol for mask practices, and on acceptable behavior in general, because this is going to last for a long time. The safest thing to do is to stay at home. That can’t last for much longer.
Let me describe my day:
I had to meet some people for a work project for 3 minutes outside today. I greeted them with a mask on, but told them that I had to step back at a greater distance, so that I could lower my mask because I had to give them some information, and they would need to be able to understand me. I did that. This happened outside. Meeting adjourned afterwards.
Later on: This was the first really hot day I went out in public. Because I had a zoom cocktail party, and there was something to celebrate, I picked up some hors d’oeuvres from a local restaurant (which was providing grab and go. Although our governor has allowed restaurants to serve outdoors, with social distancing as of yesterday, this restaurant and many other establishments are not doing that yet, which is fine – I wanted to grab and go.)
So I waited in my car until I was texted, then got out of my car senza mask because it was clear that I could be 15 feet away to tell the restaurant staff person that I was me. She put the stuff on a table, and I waved, said thank you, waited until she was far enough away, and grabbed my food. I delivered it to my friends’ front doors. No mask.
This weekend would have been graduation weekend at UVA, but that was cancelled. However, my delivery journey took me into student housing neighborhoods where I saw subdued (but more than 10 people) celebrations happening. I saw two people on the sidewalk, without masks, one of whom was donning a mortar board, run to each other for a great big hug. I was driving, so not sure what the nature of the celebrations really were about.
On my zoom call, one of the participants reported that he went on a hike and a group of [Asian – just so we were all clear – he assumed Chinese] people, about 20 of them, approached him, where none were wearing masks. [Just so everyone knows, I am fully aware that most people who actually come from China wear masks as a matter of course when they’re sick, so I was really uncomfortable with this depiction of events, and said so. Still frazzled.]
So this is my thing: I will wear a mask at a store, or other indoor environment that is not my home. I am not going to wear a mask outside unless I’m likely to be less than 6 feet away from someone. I’ll have a mask dangling in case that comes about. I’ll be angry at people who resist social distancing as a matter of politics.
I think people aren’t really sure of the rules. I’m not saying this to be snide – Virginia is opening up (in a very conservative and reasonable way, IMO), and other states will do the same. We all need to figure out a way to behave. Also, let’s dispense with the racial whatever. And not sure, if I’m out on a hike, what to think of people I encounter who don’t have masks. It’s really hot in Virginia, and it’s less likely (I think?) that Covid is spread outdoors.
Just want to clarify that the racial description by my fellow zoom party-goer was really disconcerting. I don’t even know what to say.
Just want to clarify that the racial description by my fellow zoom party-goer was really disconcerting. I don’t even know what to say.
sapient – I have noticed, when I’m walking/hiking, that the mask can warm air enough to make breathing deeply more difficult. So I wouldn’t wear a mask if engaged in vigorous physical activity – and therefore, would only engage in such activity if no one else is nearby.
On my hikes, I did, and saw many other people do, the same thing you mentioned: pull the mask off/down, and put it back on in a hurry if someone else comes near them.
sapient – I have noticed, when I’m walking/hiking, that the mask can warm air enough to make breathing deeply more difficult. So I wouldn’t wear a mask if engaged in vigorous physical activity – and therefore, would only engage in such activity if no one else is nearby.
On my hikes, I did, and saw many other people do, the same thing you mentioned: pull the mask off/down, and put it back on in a hurry if someone else comes near them.
On my hikes, I did, and saw many other people do, the same thing you mentioned: pull the mask off/down, and put it back on in a hurry if someone else comes near them.
Thanks. I hope this is enough!
On my hikes, I did, and saw many other people do, the same thing you mentioned: pull the mask off/down, and put it back on in a hurry if someone else comes near them.
Thanks. I hope this is enough!
Mask etiquette is going to be tough, not only because you have people who think it is an affront to their individuality (and often, sadly, their masculinity), but because there has not been time to have the etiquette socially evolve. I’m as baffled as anyone as to why Japan is doing so much better despite their really lackadasical approach.
But the mask advantage for Japan is pretty pronounced, in part because it has a long history.
https://www.japanesestudies.org.uk/ejcjs/vol14/iss2/horii.html
This is why simple invocations about West=individuality East=groupthink are so misleading.
So, in response to sapient, it’s good to talk about what sort of rules to decide on, but it has to be integrated and tried out over the long haul to see what is practical and what is not.
btw, there are three ways to avoid glasses fogging up when you wear a mask. First is to wash your classes with soapy water and let them airdry rather than rinsing them off, this cuts down on the condensation. Alternatively, you can fold a tissue over the top of the mask, which absorbs the moisture. The third way is to wear the mask so that the upper edge is partly behind the bottom of the glasses. The first one is best, but I have a coating on my lenses, so I’m worried that doing that will degrade them. The other two alternatives, I find uncomfortable, so I usually just deal with foggy glasses.
Mask etiquette is going to be tough, not only because you have people who think it is an affront to their individuality (and often, sadly, their masculinity), but because there has not been time to have the etiquette socially evolve. I’m as baffled as anyone as to why Japan is doing so much better despite their really lackadasical approach.
But the mask advantage for Japan is pretty pronounced, in part because it has a long history.
https://www.japanesestudies.org.uk/ejcjs/vol14/iss2/horii.html
This is why simple invocations about West=individuality East=groupthink are so misleading.
So, in response to sapient, it’s good to talk about what sort of rules to decide on, but it has to be integrated and tried out over the long haul to see what is practical and what is not.
btw, there are three ways to avoid glasses fogging up when you wear a mask. First is to wash your classes with soapy water and let them airdry rather than rinsing them off, this cuts down on the condensation. Alternatively, you can fold a tissue over the top of the mask, which absorbs the moisture. The third way is to wear the mask so that the upper edge is partly behind the bottom of the glasses. The first one is best, but I have a coating on my lenses, so I’m worried that doing that will degrade them. The other two alternatives, I find uncomfortable, so I usually just deal with foggy glasses.
The material in most masks stops viruses about as well as chain-link fences stop mosquitos. Mostly, a mask protects other people from the wearer. Of course, there’s mutual protection if everyone is wearing one.
Outside, if there’s a breeze and two people stand a few feet cross breeze from each other, there’s about zero possibility of transmitting the virus from one to the other.
The material in most masks stops viruses about as well as chain-link fences stop mosquitos. Mostly, a mask protects other people from the wearer. Of course, there’s mutual protection if everyone is wearing one.
Outside, if there’s a breeze and two people stand a few feet cross breeze from each other, there’s about zero possibility of transmitting the virus from one to the other.
The material in most masks stops viruses about as well as chain-link fences stop mosquitos.
It’s interesting that folks fixate on the virus stopping power of the mask. If it does work, it is because it prevents the aerosolization that carries the virus. I don’t know if it works, but the incidences of spread at choir groups
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/05/13/us/coronavirus-washington-choir-outbreak-trnd/index.html
Japanese who teach various traditional arts to foreigners often comment on how foreigners have to ask questions about everything while Japanese just seem to get on with it. This leads to an unfortunate confusion of form and function, but in this case, it paid off.
The material in most masks stops viruses about as well as chain-link fences stop mosquitos.
It’s interesting that folks fixate on the virus stopping power of the mask. If it does work, it is because it prevents the aerosolization that carries the virus. I don’t know if it works, but the incidences of spread at choir groups
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/05/13/us/coronavirus-washington-choir-outbreak-trnd/index.html
Japanese who teach various traditional arts to foreigners often comment on how foreigners have to ask questions about everything while Japanese just seem to get on with it. This leads to an unfortunate confusion of form and function, but in this case, it paid off.
The main reason given over here for not constantly taking the mask on and off (or adjusting it every few seconds) is that this usually means touching your face. One radical view is that the main purpose of the simple masks (i.e. those not certified to keep the virus particles from coming in) is to keep people from uncounsciously touching their face. So, this would mean that the mask is to keep your possibly virus-carrying hands apart from the main entry ways of the virus into your body.
Fortunately it’s still cool enough around here not to sweat too much under the masks but I dread the coming summer. It will also be my first summer with a CPAP machine and I do not know, whether I’ll be able to cope (the first tests were last summer and I had to take off the nose piece mid-night because subjectively it was filling with water).
The main reason given over here for not constantly taking the mask on and off (or adjusting it every few seconds) is that this usually means touching your face. One radical view is that the main purpose of the simple masks (i.e. those not certified to keep the virus particles from coming in) is to keep people from uncounsciously touching their face. So, this would mean that the mask is to keep your possibly virus-carrying hands apart from the main entry ways of the virus into your body.
Fortunately it’s still cool enough around here not to sweat too much under the masks but I dread the coming summer. It will also be my first summer with a CPAP machine and I do not know, whether I’ll be able to cope (the first tests were last summer and I had to take off the nose piece mid-night because subjectively it was filling with water).
From what I understand, good mask protocol:
* if you’re indoors in a public space, wear a mask
* if you’re outdoors in a public space and you’re within about 10 feet of other people, wear a mask.
And yes, the rules generally say six feet, not ten. That assumes nobody coughs or sneezes, nobody is breathing heavily due to physical exertion, nobody is talking loudly or singing or having a belly laugh.
Wearing masks can be uncomfortable, can make it hard for some people to breathe, can make it hard to understand what people are saying.
The virus sucks. Everything single thing about the virus is, at a minimum, inconvenient.
We’ll all get to the other side of this, eventually. In the meantime, please wear a mask.
From what I understand, good mask protocol:
* if you’re indoors in a public space, wear a mask
* if you’re outdoors in a public space and you’re within about 10 feet of other people, wear a mask.
And yes, the rules generally say six feet, not ten. That assumes nobody coughs or sneezes, nobody is breathing heavily due to physical exertion, nobody is talking loudly or singing or having a belly laugh.
Wearing masks can be uncomfortable, can make it hard for some people to breathe, can make it hard to understand what people are saying.
The virus sucks. Everything single thing about the virus is, at a minimum, inconvenient.
We’ll all get to the other side of this, eventually. In the meantime, please wear a mask.
Mostly, a mask protects other people from the wearer.
Yes, a simple cloth mask does more to protect other folks from the wearer than the other way around.
Which is a very good reason to wear one.
Mostly, a mask protects other people from the wearer.
Yes, a simple cloth mask does more to protect other folks from the wearer than the other way around.
Which is a very good reason to wear one.
Our experience has been that a well-fitting metal bridge across the nose does a lot to help with fogging. Of the things we had around the house, a length of 18-gauge solid copper wire seems to do the best job. It’s flexible enough that you can press down on it gently to fit it (each time you put the mask on if necessary) but stiff enough to hold that shape. Any air that’s going to leak seems to leak from other places when the bridge is fitted.
Our experience has been that a well-fitting metal bridge across the nose does a lot to help with fogging. Of the things we had around the house, a length of 18-gauge solid copper wire seems to do the best job. It’s flexible enough that you can press down on it gently to fit it (each time you put the mask on if necessary) but stiff enough to hold that shape. Any air that’s going to leak seems to leak from other places when the bridge is fitted.
Possibly worth noting that the N95 masks with a valve to make it easy to exhale greatly reduce the “protect other people from you” effect. The air (and aerosols) are not being filtered when they go through the valve instead of the mask material.
Possibly worth noting that the N95 masks with a valve to make it easy to exhale greatly reduce the “protect other people from you” effect. The air (and aerosols) are not being filtered when they go through the valve instead of the mask material.
Air will leak around any mask that doesn’t have a rubber seal all around the periphery. No matter what the filter material may be, it has to present some resistance to air flow. Any gap(s) around the edge(s) big enough to fit a soda straw through can be an easier flow path. That goes for inhaling as well as exhaling.
AFAIK, we’re not worried about free-floating virus particles, but virus particles hitching a ride on moisture droplets — like the ones that fog our glasses. To elaborate on CharlesWT’s analogy where the filter fabric is a chain link fence and the viruses are mosquitoes, what we’re trying to stop is snowballs that the mosquitoes are attached to. But I could be totally wrong about that.
Unless the viruses degrade when airborne as isolated particles, they can’t just disappear. And I doubt they settle out of the air like snowflakes, or even dead mosquitoes. To virus-size objects, air is water and water is glue. Filter fabric is basically something for the glue to stick to.
FWIW, the cleanrooms I have known in the semiconductor, disk drive, and medical device worlds, all had downward, laminar airflow to drive airborne particles down to the floor as quickly as possible, and the floors were porous. It would be hard to ventilate supermarkets that way, of course.
Michael, I didn’t know about N95 mask valves. Thanks!
–TP
Air will leak around any mask that doesn’t have a rubber seal all around the periphery. No matter what the filter material may be, it has to present some resistance to air flow. Any gap(s) around the edge(s) big enough to fit a soda straw through can be an easier flow path. That goes for inhaling as well as exhaling.
AFAIK, we’re not worried about free-floating virus particles, but virus particles hitching a ride on moisture droplets — like the ones that fog our glasses. To elaborate on CharlesWT’s analogy where the filter fabric is a chain link fence and the viruses are mosquitoes, what we’re trying to stop is snowballs that the mosquitoes are attached to. But I could be totally wrong about that.
Unless the viruses degrade when airborne as isolated particles, they can’t just disappear. And I doubt they settle out of the air like snowflakes, or even dead mosquitoes. To virus-size objects, air is water and water is glue. Filter fabric is basically something for the glue to stick to.
FWIW, the cleanrooms I have known in the semiconductor, disk drive, and medical device worlds, all had downward, laminar airflow to drive airborne particles down to the floor as quickly as possible, and the floors were porous. It would be hard to ventilate supermarkets that way, of course.
Michael, I didn’t know about N95 mask valves. Thanks!
–TP
Sharing the difficulties of not really recovering.
For the “I ain’t gonna wear a mask, don’t tread on me” crowd, the virus doesn’t give a damn about your liberty. You’ll be lucky, once you’re done passing it around to each other (if only it were only to each other), if you don’t lose your liberty in a different way for weeks, months, or years as you “recover.”
Oh wait, I forgot, all those people in the article are just paid actors, lying to get their names in the paper.
Sharing the difficulties of not really recovering.
For the “I ain’t gonna wear a mask, don’t tread on me” crowd, the virus doesn’t give a damn about your liberty. You’ll be lucky, once you’re done passing it around to each other (if only it were only to each other), if you don’t lose your liberty in a different way for weeks, months, or years as you “recover.”
Oh wait, I forgot, all those people in the article are just paid actors, lying to get their names in the paper.
I commented on the no-politics covid thread, but got too close to politics, so I’ll finish my thought here.
I’m willing to live in partial isolation for a while longer. I’m an old person, so it’s really easy for me. At some point, I want to know what the goal post is, and it can’t be “a vaccine” because we don’t know if that’s possible.
We need to decide what the endgame looks like, otherwise people aren’t going to stay the course. And, yes, for now it’s easy to wear your mask when inside, or when you think you’re going to be closer than 6 (or a few more) feet away from people outdoors. Everybody can be doing that for the coming weeks or maybe months. Years? Not sure about that.
I commented on the no-politics covid thread, but got too close to politics, so I’ll finish my thought here.
I’m willing to live in partial isolation for a while longer. I’m an old person, so it’s really easy for me. At some point, I want to know what the goal post is, and it can’t be “a vaccine” because we don’t know if that’s possible.
We need to decide what the endgame looks like, otherwise people aren’t going to stay the course. And, yes, for now it’s easy to wear your mask when inside, or when you think you’re going to be closer than 6 (or a few more) feet away from people outdoors. Everybody can be doing that for the coming weeks or maybe months. Years? Not sure about that.
sapient, this is not to attack you, but the language of ‘deciding’ an endgame is problematic to me. We have to ‘develop’ an endgame. One of the things about this pandemic is that we have lurched from idea to idea. Part of it is leadership of course, but part of it is a desire for quick fixes and panaceas. This is not to denigrate people working on these things, but I see that ‘deciding’ as being part of the problem.
The whole mask thing is, at least to me, indicative of this. There was a whole wave of people laughing off masks as meaningless (look at CharlesWT’s comment for an example). Because that rhetoric, if it’s not effective to protect me, why should I emasculate myself, things may be a lot worse than they might have been. I’m not really sure how to get from there to a point where we are thinking about others. The NYTimes Science writer David McNeill was interviewed by Christine Amanpour and he made what I thought was a telling point that I’ll probably screw up in the retelling, but it was that the health system in the US is very good for treating the individual but it does very poorly in treating ‘us’.
So on the smaller point, I don’t know why people can’t keep wearing masks for the next year or getting it to a point where it is like underwear. Sure, it is uncomfortable, but we wear a lot of uncomfortable things.
Not trying to pick a fight and I’ve got three classes today, so not sure how much I can respond, but just wanted to toss that out before I go to school. Stay safe.
sapient, this is not to attack you, but the language of ‘deciding’ an endgame is problematic to me. We have to ‘develop’ an endgame. One of the things about this pandemic is that we have lurched from idea to idea. Part of it is leadership of course, but part of it is a desire for quick fixes and panaceas. This is not to denigrate people working on these things, but I see that ‘deciding’ as being part of the problem.
The whole mask thing is, at least to me, indicative of this. There was a whole wave of people laughing off masks as meaningless (look at CharlesWT’s comment for an example). Because that rhetoric, if it’s not effective to protect me, why should I emasculate myself, things may be a lot worse than they might have been. I’m not really sure how to get from there to a point where we are thinking about others. The NYTimes Science writer David McNeill was interviewed by Christine Amanpour and he made what I thought was a telling point that I’ll probably screw up in the retelling, but it was that the health system in the US is very good for treating the individual but it does very poorly in treating ‘us’.
So on the smaller point, I don’t know why people can’t keep wearing masks for the next year or getting it to a point where it is like underwear. Sure, it is uncomfortable, but we wear a lot of uncomfortable things.
Not trying to pick a fight and I’ve got three classes today, so not sure how much I can respond, but just wanted to toss that out before I go to school. Stay safe.
We have to ‘develop’ an endgame.
I’ll agree with that.
So on the smaller point, I don’t know why people can’t keep wearing masks for the next year or getting it to a point where it is like underwear. Sure, it is uncomfortable, but we wear a lot of uncomfortable things.
Maybe. But it needs to be towards something. I think of myself in periods of my life when I wanted to have non-socially distant relationships with people. I wanted to look nice, and smile at people, and have a physical presence. It’s unrealistic to expect people to stop having physical contact, or whispering, or do other things that people do. Constant masks are fine for awhile, but, yes, we have to develop an endgame.
There isn’t a place in the world that isn’t struggling with this. Close proximity with others is a human need. I’m fine with putting a stop to it for awhile, but not for some never-ending Friedman unit.
Northam, the Virginia governor, has set some reasonable guidelines for a conservative first step. People in my social circle are embracing that in a cautious way, maybe not immediately going to the hair dresser. Maybe having a socially distant party in their large backyard. Maybe having a drink on the terrace at an outdoor restaurant space.
If there’s no vaccine, we need to realize that we’re all going to get sick, but we have to do it slowly and with the hope that hospitals will have room for us, if necessary, and will be learning what to do with us in worst cases. I think that’s better than changing our entire culture forever. But I’m totally interested whether other people think otherwise. (We, here, tend towards introversion. If we needed a lot of direct human contact, we would have been out in some bar or Elk’s Club or whatever. I believe that we’re temperamentally more suited to this world. generally speaking.)
We have to ‘develop’ an endgame.
I’ll agree with that.
So on the smaller point, I don’t know why people can’t keep wearing masks for the next year or getting it to a point where it is like underwear. Sure, it is uncomfortable, but we wear a lot of uncomfortable things.
Maybe. But it needs to be towards something. I think of myself in periods of my life when I wanted to have non-socially distant relationships with people. I wanted to look nice, and smile at people, and have a physical presence. It’s unrealistic to expect people to stop having physical contact, or whispering, or do other things that people do. Constant masks are fine for awhile, but, yes, we have to develop an endgame.
There isn’t a place in the world that isn’t struggling with this. Close proximity with others is a human need. I’m fine with putting a stop to it for awhile, but not for some never-ending Friedman unit.
Northam, the Virginia governor, has set some reasonable guidelines for a conservative first step. People in my social circle are embracing that in a cautious way, maybe not immediately going to the hair dresser. Maybe having a socially distant party in their large backyard. Maybe having a drink on the terrace at an outdoor restaurant space.
If there’s no vaccine, we need to realize that we’re all going to get sick, but we have to do it slowly and with the hope that hospitals will have room for us, if necessary, and will be learning what to do with us in worst cases. I think that’s better than changing our entire culture forever. But I’m totally interested whether other people think otherwise. (We, here, tend towards introversion. If we needed a lot of direct human contact, we would have been out in some bar or Elk’s Club or whatever. I believe that we’re temperamentally more suited to this world. generally speaking.)
look at CharlesWT’s comment for an example
Masks are certainly better than nothing. What I object to is people who put their magic mask on and then crowd me in public places. Wear a mask. But behave as though it doesn’t make a difference.
look at CharlesWT’s comment for an example
Masks are certainly better than nothing. What I object to is people who put their magic mask on and then crowd me in public places. Wear a mask. But behave as though it doesn’t make a difference.
At some point, I want to know what the goal post is, and it can’t be “a vaccine” because we don’t know if that’s possible.
We need to decide what the endgame looks like
I think we all want to know what the goal post is, and what the endgame looks like. And, nobody knows what the goal post is, or what the endgame looks like.
The virus is… a virus. It’s not biddable. Our decisions are not binding on it.
Our choices are going to be based on some kind of calculus involving how dangerous the virus is, how communicable it is, what the vectors of transmission are, what costs we are willing to pay, and in what form.
We don’t really know how dangerous the virus is at this point. Only old people die, except some young people have strokes and drop dead in an instant. It brings on pneumonia and the best treatment is intubation, except it’s nothing like pneumonia and intubation is a really bad idea. Kids never get it and can’t transmit it, except some kids have died from it. If you survive it, you’re immune, except maybe you aren’t. If the respiratory thing doesn’t kill you you’ll be OK, unless you have life-long damage to other organs or bodily symptoms.
That seems to be the state of the art of our understanding of COVID at the moment. That’s mine, at least. But I’m not an expert.
Our understanding of how communicable it is ranges from an R0 of about 2.5, up to somewhere north of 5. Which is a very, very, very broad range. Our understanding of the vectors of transmission seem pretty good, though. As far as we know.
There is virtually no consensus about what cost we are willing to pay, or in what form.
It seems like COVID has been with us forever, but it’s actually only been a few months. We just don’t know a lot. Over time, we’ll know more, and our decisions will be better informed.
Posted this on the other thread. It may be of interest in terms of understanding what a path forward might look like.
In the United States, our ability to address COVID is hampered by a profound distrust of government and expert knowledge, and a deep belief that we all are entitled, by right, to do what we want.
The distrust in expert knowledge is problematic because expertise – genuine honest-to-got specialist domain knowledge – is needed to understand what will and will not be an effective response.
Distrust in government and the general sense that nobody is the boss of us is problematic because consistent compliance with public health protocols are probably going to be necessary to make headway.
Absent those things, we’re going to bounce back and forth between lockdown restrictions that restrict the actions of healthy people along with not-healthy people, and relaxation of those restrictions, with the tempo of that oscillation being driven by… people getting sick and dying.
Every protocol I’m aware of that enables a return to, not the status quo ante necessarily, but a stable and sustainable “new normal”, involves testing at levels much greater than what we have at present, contact tracing to let public health actors understand who is realistically at risk, and then quarantine for folks who are at risk.
If you can identify and isolate people who are at risk, people who are not at risk can carry on relatively freely, without undue risk of illness and loss of life.
If you can’t do those two things, your choices are the kind of universal lockdown protocols we have now, or increased rates of illness and death.
Basically three choices, we get to pick which we prefer. Or, just default to whatever happens, happens.
At some point, I want to know what the goal post is, and it can’t be “a vaccine” because we don’t know if that’s possible.
We need to decide what the endgame looks like
I think we all want to know what the goal post is, and what the endgame looks like. And, nobody knows what the goal post is, or what the endgame looks like.
The virus is… a virus. It’s not biddable. Our decisions are not binding on it.
Our choices are going to be based on some kind of calculus involving how dangerous the virus is, how communicable it is, what the vectors of transmission are, what costs we are willing to pay, and in what form.
We don’t really know how dangerous the virus is at this point. Only old people die, except some young people have strokes and drop dead in an instant. It brings on pneumonia and the best treatment is intubation, except it’s nothing like pneumonia and intubation is a really bad idea. Kids never get it and can’t transmit it, except some kids have died from it. If you survive it, you’re immune, except maybe you aren’t. If the respiratory thing doesn’t kill you you’ll be OK, unless you have life-long damage to other organs or bodily symptoms.
That seems to be the state of the art of our understanding of COVID at the moment. That’s mine, at least. But I’m not an expert.
Our understanding of how communicable it is ranges from an R0 of about 2.5, up to somewhere north of 5. Which is a very, very, very broad range. Our understanding of the vectors of transmission seem pretty good, though. As far as we know.
There is virtually no consensus about what cost we are willing to pay, or in what form.
It seems like COVID has been with us forever, but it’s actually only been a few months. We just don’t know a lot. Over time, we’ll know more, and our decisions will be better informed.
Posted this on the other thread. It may be of interest in terms of understanding what a path forward might look like.
In the United States, our ability to address COVID is hampered by a profound distrust of government and expert knowledge, and a deep belief that we all are entitled, by right, to do what we want.
The distrust in expert knowledge is problematic because expertise – genuine honest-to-got specialist domain knowledge – is needed to understand what will and will not be an effective response.
Distrust in government and the general sense that nobody is the boss of us is problematic because consistent compliance with public health protocols are probably going to be necessary to make headway.
Absent those things, we’re going to bounce back and forth between lockdown restrictions that restrict the actions of healthy people along with not-healthy people, and relaxation of those restrictions, with the tempo of that oscillation being driven by… people getting sick and dying.
Every protocol I’m aware of that enables a return to, not the status quo ante necessarily, but a stable and sustainable “new normal”, involves testing at levels much greater than what we have at present, contact tracing to let public health actors understand who is realistically at risk, and then quarantine for folks who are at risk.
If you can identify and isolate people who are at risk, people who are not at risk can carry on relatively freely, without undue risk of illness and loss of life.
If you can’t do those two things, your choices are the kind of universal lockdown protocols we have now, or increased rates of illness and death.
Basically three choices, we get to pick which we prefer. Or, just default to whatever happens, happens.
I think we all want to know what the goal post is, and what the endgame looks like. And, nobody knows what the goal post is, or what the endgame looks like.
The virus is… a virus. It’s not biddable. Our decisions are not binding on it.
I agree with a lot of what you said in your 9:29, but we do decide what risks we will take, just as we decide that with other hazards. I want to emphasize that I’m not a person who is in favor of going to a public space without a mask and touching strangers.
We need to make it possible [at least for awhile, and we need to figure out what that is] for anyone who is afraid to go to work to be able to stay home and not become homeless and/or starve. I’m way more worried about that than about seeing someone with a mask dangling who should instead have it on.
I think we all want to know what the goal post is, and what the endgame looks like. And, nobody knows what the goal post is, or what the endgame looks like.
The virus is… a virus. It’s not biddable. Our decisions are not binding on it.
I agree with a lot of what you said in your 9:29, but we do decide what risks we will take, just as we decide that with other hazards. I want to emphasize that I’m not a person who is in favor of going to a public space without a mask and touching strangers.
We need to make it possible [at least for awhile, and we need to figure out what that is] for anyone who is afraid to go to work to be able to stay home and not become homeless and/or starve. I’m way more worried about that than about seeing someone with a mask dangling who should instead have it on.
At some point, I want to know what the goal post is, and it can’t be “a vaccine” because we don’t know if that’s possible.
We need to decide what the endgame looks like.
I’d say the endgame is known already. But unacknowledged.
Unless a vaccine turns up, and it may well not:
The critical point: the end comes when we’ve all gotten sick and recovered. Whatever steps you are taking now have one, and only one, goal: to put off getting sick until there are medical facilities available if you need them.
At some point, I want to know what the goal post is, and it can’t be “a vaccine” because we don’t know if that’s possible.
We need to decide what the endgame looks like.
I’d say the endgame is known already. But unacknowledged.
Unless a vaccine turns up, and it may well not:
The critical point: the end comes when we’ve all gotten sick and recovered. Whatever steps you are taking now have one, and only one, goal: to put off getting sick until there are medical facilities available if you need them.
What I object to is people who put their magic mask on and then crowd me in public places.
So explaining that a mask is like a chain link fence that does nothing to stop viruses accomplishes what? Like a lot of those Reason articles you quote,I feel like there is an ‘I’m smarter than everyone else’ vibe. Maybe you are, but unfortunately, dumb people with the virus can still get you sick, no matter how smart you are.
What I object to is people who put their magic mask on and then crowd me in public places.
So explaining that a mask is like a chain link fence that does nothing to stop viruses accomplishes what? Like a lot of those Reason articles you quote,I feel like there is an ‘I’m smarter than everyone else’ vibe. Maybe you are, but unfortunately, dumb people with the virus can still get you sick, no matter how smart you are.
Responding to wj, from the other thread, because my comment there was veering into politics, and I cut some of it out, and am pasting it here.
Our parents did lay an educational foundation for us. It wasn’t perfect, but our universities have been the envy of the world. Although our public school systems are mixed, our parents’ generation gave them potential. To the extent that they’ve failed, we’ve been the culprits. Not to say that our parents were perfect: they weren’t savvy to the environment, for sure. And education isn’t everything: there are a lot of well-educated, wealthy, privileged people who are ruining the world right now. It’s easy to point fingers at the crowds of people who are gullible and clueless, but there’s money behind that, and the people who have sponsored the hate movement know what they’re doing, and have ticked off all the boxes.
I don’t want to give up hope (although I’ve fallen into despair at times, as everyone here has witnessed). In the past, events have turned on a dime, and we need to make that happen now, at the same time building a foundation to do better in the long run. Not sure how to lead the unwilling horse to drink though.
Responding to wj, from the other thread, because my comment there was veering into politics, and I cut some of it out, and am pasting it here.
Our parents did lay an educational foundation for us. It wasn’t perfect, but our universities have been the envy of the world. Although our public school systems are mixed, our parents’ generation gave them potential. To the extent that they’ve failed, we’ve been the culprits. Not to say that our parents were perfect: they weren’t savvy to the environment, for sure. And education isn’t everything: there are a lot of well-educated, wealthy, privileged people who are ruining the world right now. It’s easy to point fingers at the crowds of people who are gullible and clueless, but there’s money behind that, and the people who have sponsored the hate movement know what they’re doing, and have ticked off all the boxes.
I don’t want to give up hope (although I’ve fallen into despair at times, as everyone here has witnessed). In the past, events have turned on a dime, and we need to make that happen now, at the same time building a foundation to do better in the long run. Not sure how to lead the unwilling horse to drink though.
The critical point: the end comes when we’ve all gotten sick and recovered.
The problem with this is we do not, in fact, KNOW this.
There’s the rub.
The critical point: the end comes when we’ve all gotten sick and recovered.
The problem with this is we do not, in fact, KNOW this.
There’s the rub.
Our parents did lay an educational foundation for us. It wasn’t perfect, but our universities have been the envy of the world.
Indeed they have been. And are. But while they are awesome at teaching things (and researching to find out new stuff), they do less well at imparting why those things are important. Perhaps because, to those involved, it seemed self-evident — but clearly it wasn’t.
And perhaps more critically, the time to teach why science is important and why international institutions are needed isn’t university. It’s more like grammar school, high school at the latest. Because we need to have the whole population understand if we are to avoid (next time) losing critical memories of the polity entire.
Our parents did lay an educational foundation for us. It wasn’t perfect, but our universities have been the envy of the world.
Indeed they have been. And are. But while they are awesome at teaching things (and researching to find out new stuff), they do less well at imparting why those things are important. Perhaps because, to those involved, it seemed self-evident — but clearly it wasn’t.
And perhaps more critically, the time to teach why science is important and why international institutions are needed isn’t university. It’s more like grammar school, high school at the latest. Because we need to have the whole population understand if we are to avoid (next time) losing critical memories of the polity entire.
The problem with this is we do not, in fact, KNOW this.
That’s the only end point I can see. But I’m quite willing to consider alternative suggestions. What possible end point would you propose? And what assumptions are required for it?
The problem with this is we do not, in fact, KNOW this.
That’s the only end point I can see. But I’m quite willing to consider alternative suggestions. What possible end point would you propose? And what assumptions are required for it?
we do decide what risks we will take, just as we decide that with other hazards.
Yes, I understand. I guess my point is that we don’t know enough about the virus at this point to make well-informed choices about the risks. It’s therefore hard to predict what goalposts and endpoints look like.
That’s the only end point I can see.
Based on my newly acquired status of armchair epidemiologist, I think it’s possible to imagine an end point where every single person isn’t required to get COVID. Kindly note the caveats.
As I understand it, once we reach the magical land of herd immunity, the virus will more or less fizzle out. Or, at least become manageable without extraordinary measures.
Again, as I understand it, herd immunity is defined as a certain percentage of the population being immune, either through vaccination or having survived the virus or simply some as-yet-undiscovered natural immunity in some parts of the population. And, that percentage is a function of the R0 value.
Maths here.
If COVID’s R0 is around 2.5, herd immunity should be around 60% of the population.
If COVID’s R0 is something like 5, herd immunity will be somewhere around 80%.
Among other things, we need to discover an accurate estimate of COVID’s R0.
we do decide what risks we will take, just as we decide that with other hazards.
Yes, I understand. I guess my point is that we don’t know enough about the virus at this point to make well-informed choices about the risks. It’s therefore hard to predict what goalposts and endpoints look like.
That’s the only end point I can see.
Based on my newly acquired status of armchair epidemiologist, I think it’s possible to imagine an end point where every single person isn’t required to get COVID. Kindly note the caveats.
As I understand it, once we reach the magical land of herd immunity, the virus will more or less fizzle out. Or, at least become manageable without extraordinary measures.
Again, as I understand it, herd immunity is defined as a certain percentage of the population being immune, either through vaccination or having survived the virus or simply some as-yet-undiscovered natural immunity in some parts of the population. And, that percentage is a function of the R0 value.
Maths here.
If COVID’s R0 is around 2.5, herd immunity should be around 60% of the population.
If COVID’s R0 is something like 5, herd immunity will be somewhere around 80%.
Among other things, we need to discover an accurate estimate of COVID’s R0.
The economy in Europe may get hit less hard than in the US but some double plus ungood political tendencies got quite some boost. Those trying to undermine the European project have a field day and even actions that are at a closer look actually pro-Europe and pro-democracy (the decision by the German high court to declare the European high court’s decision on Euro (corona) bonds in violation of the constitution because it violates the system of checks and balances in their view) are used by other actors as a validation of their own anti-democratic and anti-European policies (Poland and Hungary to name the two most prominent cases).
In Germany the trust in our government has significantly increased since the beginning of the crisis and that despite increasing weariness of the imposed restrictions. We may hate them but apart from a vocal minority we still have the impression that they are useful and that the government is acting in good faith and with basic competence.
Looking from afar to the US my prediction is that this crisis will have effects similar to the big financial crisis under the lesser Bush: mega corporations will massively profit and increase in size by gobbling up bankrupt rivals, and they have the unconditional support from one party and far too much still from the other. That will not change even if there is a landslide in November (which I do not believe).
One would wish that the display of callousness* and incompetence would doom GOPism for generations to come but it will most likely not (or even do the opposite).
I see this whole crisis as a major setback with the medical part maybe not even the largest.
*and outright malice in many cases
The economy in Europe may get hit less hard than in the US but some double plus ungood political tendencies got quite some boost. Those trying to undermine the European project have a field day and even actions that are at a closer look actually pro-Europe and pro-democracy (the decision by the German high court to declare the European high court’s decision on Euro (corona) bonds in violation of the constitution because it violates the system of checks and balances in their view) are used by other actors as a validation of their own anti-democratic and anti-European policies (Poland and Hungary to name the two most prominent cases).
In Germany the trust in our government has significantly increased since the beginning of the crisis and that despite increasing weariness of the imposed restrictions. We may hate them but apart from a vocal minority we still have the impression that they are useful and that the government is acting in good faith and with basic competence.
Looking from afar to the US my prediction is that this crisis will have effects similar to the big financial crisis under the lesser Bush: mega corporations will massively profit and increase in size by gobbling up bankrupt rivals, and they have the unconditional support from one party and far too much still from the other. That will not change even if there is a landslide in November (which I do not believe).
One would wish that the display of callousness* and incompetence would doom GOPism for generations to come but it will most likely not (or even do the opposite).
I see this whole crisis as a major setback with the medical part maybe not even the largest.
*and outright malice in many cases
The economy in Europe may get hit less hard than in the US
Along the lines of losing one limb rather than two ?
The economy in Europe may get hit less hard than in the US
Along the lines of losing one limb rather than two ?
Is there a reason why we should expect herd immunity to stop Covid-19 any more than it stops flu or the common cold?
Is there a reason why we should expect herd immunity to stop Covid-19 any more than it stops flu or the common cold?
Herd immunity works fine on flu virus, particularly when people get that immunity via vaccination.
Too, too, many cold viruses to get immunity to all (or most), and not clear that the immunity lasts for more than a year or two.
Worst? Dengue-like: several major variants, and having ‘immunity’ to one variant (catch+recover or vaccination) makes your response to another variant MUCH worse. (That might include a bad reaction for ‘immune from variant A, so vaccine for variant B kills you’; that’s where my super-shallow knowledge of the subject hits bottom)
Silver linings: humanity is going to learn MUCH more about viruses. Painfully.
Herd immunity works fine on flu virus, particularly when people get that immunity via vaccination.
Too, too, many cold viruses to get immunity to all (or most), and not clear that the immunity lasts for more than a year or two.
Worst? Dengue-like: several major variants, and having ‘immunity’ to one variant (catch+recover or vaccination) makes your response to another variant MUCH worse. (That might include a bad reaction for ‘immune from variant A, so vaccine for variant B kills you’; that’s where my super-shallow knowledge of the subject hits bottom)
Silver linings: humanity is going to learn MUCH more about viruses. Painfully.
Eric Trump, sounding just like his father.
apologists, to your stations!
Eric Trump, sounding just like his father.
apologists, to your stations!
Is there a reason why we should expect herd immunity to stop Covid-19 any more than it stops flu or the common cold?
with all the standard disclaimers and caveats in place – my understanding is not so much that herd immunity makes it go away, but that it prevents epidemic spread.
it makes it manageable without extraordinary measures, allowing a return to some sustainable version of normal life.
i’m not an epidemiologist, just trying to keep up.
Is there a reason why we should expect herd immunity to stop Covid-19 any more than it stops flu or the common cold?
with all the standard disclaimers and caveats in place – my understanding is not so much that herd immunity makes it go away, but that it prevents epidemic spread.
it makes it manageable without extraordinary measures, allowing a return to some sustainable version of normal life.
i’m not an epidemiologist, just trying to keep up.
apologists, to your stations!
LOL.
apologists, to your stations!
LOL.
Flu mutates so quickly that there is no lasting immunity for individuals, and hence no lasting herd immunity. Vaccines are usually only partially efficacious.
Not sure whether COVID will be different on either front, but my reading gives me a sense that experts are somewhat optimistic.
Flu mutates so quickly that there is no lasting immunity for individuals, and hence no lasting herd immunity. Vaccines are usually only partially efficacious.
Not sure whether COVID will be different on either front, but my reading gives me a sense that experts are somewhat optimistic.
Is there a reason why we should expect herd immunity to stop Covid-19 any more than it stops flu or the common cold?
I wrote a too-long comment based on the time I once spent sitting next to an evolutionary biologist on an airplane, who delivered an hour-long lecture on the characteristics of successful and unsuccessful viruses (one direct quote that has stuck with me: “Ebola is terrible at being a virus.”). Instead I’ll just boil the results down to a few points.
We regard ~40,000 influenza deaths per year in the US from influenza as acceptable. That is, we (collectively, 330M of us) do not bewail the tragedy of influenza, track the deaths on the front page of papers, demand universal testing, require people to be vaccinated, etc, etc.
Suppose steady-state herd immunity to the Covid-19 virus means ~100,000 deaths per year in the US. Will that be regarded as acceptable? My own guess would be yes, after a few years it will be just one of those things.
More than that will die this year. Perhaps an order of magnitude more.
There are at least several reasons to believe a steady-state of 100,000 per year in the US is more likely than, say, a steady-state of 1,000,000.
Is there a reason why we should expect herd immunity to stop Covid-19 any more than it stops flu or the common cold?
I wrote a too-long comment based on the time I once spent sitting next to an evolutionary biologist on an airplane, who delivered an hour-long lecture on the characteristics of successful and unsuccessful viruses (one direct quote that has stuck with me: “Ebola is terrible at being a virus.”). Instead I’ll just boil the results down to a few points.
We regard ~40,000 influenza deaths per year in the US from influenza as acceptable. That is, we (collectively, 330M of us) do not bewail the tragedy of influenza, track the deaths on the front page of papers, demand universal testing, require people to be vaccinated, etc, etc.
Suppose steady-state herd immunity to the Covid-19 virus means ~100,000 deaths per year in the US. Will that be regarded as acceptable? My own guess would be yes, after a few years it will be just one of those things.
More than that will die this year. Perhaps an order of magnitude more.
There are at least several reasons to believe a steady-state of 100,000 per year in the US is more likely than, say, a steady-state of 1,000,000.
i’m not sure we’d be cool with C19 hanging around.
because it’s not just feeling like crap for several weeks, like the flu. C19 apparently causes permanent damage – from the Kawasaki-like stuff in kids, to permanent lung damage, lasting blood-clotting issues, heart damage, neurological damage, etc..
that’s not something we’re going to be nonchalant about.
not me, anyway.
i’m not sure we’d be cool with C19 hanging around.
because it’s not just feeling like crap for several weeks, like the flu. C19 apparently causes permanent damage – from the Kawasaki-like stuff in kids, to permanent lung damage, lasting blood-clotting issues, heart damage, neurological damage, etc..
that’s not something we’re going to be nonchalant about.
not me, anyway.
“You watch, they’ll milk it every single day between now and November 3,” the younger Trump said. “And guess what, after November 3, coronavirus will magically, all of a sudden, go away and disappear and everybody will be able to reopen.”
Looks like SOMEONE remembers how the GOP used Ebola for midterm elections, and expects that this pandemic is just more of the same.
Sorry, Trumper, just because you luvv you some fucking of rats, doesn’t mean that anyone else shares your kinks.
“You watch, they’ll milk it every single day between now and November 3,” the younger Trump said. “And guess what, after November 3, coronavirus will magically, all of a sudden, go away and disappear and everybody will be able to reopen.”
Looks like SOMEONE remembers how the GOP used Ebola for midterm elections, and expects that this pandemic is just more of the same.
Sorry, Trumper, just because you luvv you some fucking of rats, doesn’t mean that anyone else shares your kinks.
i’m not sure we’d be cool with C19 hanging around.
Which is one of the reasons to be optimistic about what the steady-state numbers will be: we’ll be willing to spend more on it than we do on the flu. Not outlandishly when “spend” is used broadly — people may feel like money for vaccines and treatments is one thing, but no more casual vacations in Europe may be another.
I suppose full disclosure requires me to say that yesterday we pretty much committed to moving this summer. We had been planning it, then putting it off because of the virus, but have decided to go ahead because (a) we’re not getting any younger and (b) the granddaughters are getting older. We will have more social contact because of this than we would ordinarily have.
i’m not sure we’d be cool with C19 hanging around.
Which is one of the reasons to be optimistic about what the steady-state numbers will be: we’ll be willing to spend more on it than we do on the flu. Not outlandishly when “spend” is used broadly — people may feel like money for vaccines and treatments is one thing, but no more casual vacations in Europe may be another.
I suppose full disclosure requires me to say that yesterday we pretty much committed to moving this summer. We had been planning it, then putting it off because of the virus, but have decided to go ahead because (a) we’re not getting any younger and (b) the granddaughters are getting older. We will have more social contact because of this than we would ordinarily have.
From the other thread:
Since I’m one of the peple who has been saying something like that, here’s some background on why.
From the Portland paper a few days ago:
Some background:
Lots of people in Maine have already been challenging and ignoring COVID-19 measures, egged on by the previous governor, who says he’s going to run again next time.
And once things open up further, it’s hardly going to be a piece of cake to shut them down again. Unlike New Brunswick, we can’t station the State Police at the borders and keep everyone out, even if we wanted to try.
Maybe it will be a piece of cake in North Carolina. I don’t think it’s going to be a piece of cake in Maine.
From the other thread:
Since I’m one of the peple who has been saying something like that, here’s some background on why.
From the Portland paper a few days ago:
Some background:
Lots of people in Maine have already been challenging and ignoring COVID-19 measures, egged on by the previous governor, who says he’s going to run again next time.
And once things open up further, it’s hardly going to be a piece of cake to shut them down again. Unlike New Brunswick, we can’t station the State Police at the borders and keep everyone out, even if we wanted to try.
Maybe it will be a piece of cake in North Carolina. I don’t think it’s going to be a piece of cake in Maine.
Maybe it will be a piece of cake in North Carolina. I don’t think it’s going to be a piece of cake in Maine.
no, it won’t be. we’ve got the same demands for re-opening here – protests and all. and just for reference… in raw dollars, NC’s coastal tourism sector is about 15x the size of ME’s ($25.3B vs $1.7B per yr).
the coastal beaches were opened this past week, and they were packed, from what i hear. tourist home rentals are apparently open. no thanks!
we have a deposit on a beach house for a week end-of-Sept., like we always do. but we’re pretty sure we’re not going to go. not because we or our friends might be sick, but because we don’t trust that the people in the house the week before us won’t be sick.
Maybe it will be a piece of cake in North Carolina. I don’t think it’s going to be a piece of cake in Maine.
no, it won’t be. we’ve got the same demands for re-opening here – protests and all. and just for reference… in raw dollars, NC’s coastal tourism sector is about 15x the size of ME’s ($25.3B vs $1.7B per yr).
the coastal beaches were opened this past week, and they were packed, from what i hear. tourist home rentals are apparently open. no thanks!
we have a deposit on a beach house for a week end-of-Sept., like we always do. but we’re pretty sure we’re not going to go. not because we or our friends might be sick, but because we don’t trust that the people in the house the week before us won’t be sick.
It’s a brutal question, but it needs to be asked: What is the value of Maine’s summer tourist economy – not in dollars, but in human lives?
It’s particularly fraught because you not only need to ask how many people will die of the virus in order to open up the tourist industry. You also have to ask the other side: how many lives will be lost if the economy is trashed by the lack of said economy? Because there’s not just a financial cost there.
I think the balance still falls on the side of being cautious about opening up. But it’s not a simple, one sided, question.
It’s a brutal question, but it needs to be asked: What is the value of Maine’s summer tourist economy – not in dollars, but in human lives?
It’s particularly fraught because you not only need to ask how many people will die of the virus in order to open up the tourist industry. You also have to ask the other side: how many lives will be lost if the economy is trashed by the lack of said economy? Because there’s not just a financial cost there.
I think the balance still falls on the side of being cautious about opening up. But it’s not a simple, one sided, question.
From what I’ve heard, the Jersey shore has been a madhouse on weekends already, pre-Memorial Day. If you’ve never been on a busy boardwalk in a town like Ocean City or Wildwood, I can tell you it’s not a place where social distancing is really possible. It’s crowded, and I’ve heard that many/most people aren’t wearing masks. It’s not the kind of controlled environment that a single place of business is.
This is all hearsay, I suppose, but I don’t have reason to doubt it much. Assuming it’s true, I hope that the fact that these people are outdoors means they are far less likely to infect each other.
From what I’ve heard, the Jersey shore has been a madhouse on weekends already, pre-Memorial Day. If you’ve never been on a busy boardwalk in a town like Ocean City or Wildwood, I can tell you it’s not a place where social distancing is really possible. It’s crowded, and I’ve heard that many/most people aren’t wearing masks. It’s not the kind of controlled environment that a single place of business is.
This is all hearsay, I suppose, but I don’t have reason to doubt it much. Assuming it’s true, I hope that the fact that these people are outdoors means they are far less likely to infect each other.
Another country heard from (metaphorically speaking). A bunch of Maine small business owners speak up and ask the governor to go slow. Nice to see some people on that side of the question get their voices heard.
*****
wj: But it’s not a simple, one sided, question.
No, absolutely not. A big problem, as russell summarized earlier, or yesterday (time is all mushed together for me these days), is that so far we have very little of what we would need to even try to answer the question.
Leana Wen on taking it slow, and parameters for doing it sensibly.
I read a very good article in the last few days about this, and now can’t find the link. But the suggestions in the article were things we can never possibly try, because of who’s in charge in this country, and the megaphone that has been given to looney-tunes conspiracy theories, armed “liberty” buffs, et al.
Another country heard from (metaphorically speaking). A bunch of Maine small business owners speak up and ask the governor to go slow. Nice to see some people on that side of the question get their voices heard.
*****
wj: But it’s not a simple, one sided, question.
No, absolutely not. A big problem, as russell summarized earlier, or yesterday (time is all mushed together for me these days), is that so far we have very little of what we would need to even try to answer the question.
Leana Wen on taking it slow, and parameters for doing it sensibly.
I read a very good article in the last few days about this, and now can’t find the link. But the suggestions in the article were things we can never possibly try, because of who’s in charge in this country, and the megaphone that has been given to looney-tunes conspiracy theories, armed “liberty” buffs, et al.
I think the balance still falls on the side of being cautious about opening up. But it’s not a simple, one sided, question.
Me too, and I agree with the rest of what you said in the comment.
In addition to the non-financial cost of the economic devastation, there’s domestic abuse and other side-effects of semi-isolation.
I am not suffering at all, other than feeling a bit restless. But this isn’t easy for a lot of people whose circumstances aren’t as simple as mine.
I think the balance still falls on the side of being cautious about opening up. But it’s not a simple, one sided, question.
Me too, and I agree with the rest of what you said in the comment.
In addition to the non-financial cost of the economic devastation, there’s domestic abuse and other side-effects of semi-isolation.
I am not suffering at all, other than feeling a bit restless. But this isn’t easy for a lot of people whose circumstances aren’t as simple as mine.
But the suggestions in the article were things we can never possibly try, because of who’s in charge in this country, and the megaphone that has been given to looney-tunes conspiracy theories, armed “liberty” buffs, et al.
it’s astounding how unfit Trump is in general. but in a situation like this, his unfitness for the task is, well, breathtaking.
But the suggestions in the article were things we can never possibly try, because of who’s in charge in this country, and the megaphone that has been given to looney-tunes conspiracy theories, armed “liberty” buffs, et al.
it’s astounding how unfit Trump is in general. but in a situation like this, his unfitness for the task is, well, breathtaking.
When the guy in charge is incompetent, things start going downhill. But if there isn’t a crisis, they just mosey downhill. When a crisis hits is when you finally see just how massively horrible he is. (At least, those who refrain from hiding their heads in the sand do.)
When the guy in charge is incompetent, things start going downhill. But if there isn’t a crisis, they just mosey downhill. When a crisis hits is when you finally see just how massively horrible he is. (At least, those who refrain from hiding their heads in the sand do.)
Speaking of unfitness…
Famed germophobe doses himself with unproven, risky drug.
Speaking of unfitness…
Famed germophobe doses himself with unproven, risky drug.
what kind of lunatic doctor would give him an immuno-suppressant in this climate?
er, i mean, carry on, Mr President.
what kind of lunatic doctor would give him an immuno-suppressant in this climate?
er, i mean, carry on, Mr President.
what kind of lunatic doctor would give him an immuno-suppressant in this climate?
The kind who writes a health report that says he’s the healthiest President ever. Regardless of what his actual condition is.
what kind of lunatic doctor would give him an immuno-suppressant in this climate?
The kind who writes a health report that says he’s the healthiest President ever. Regardless of what his actual condition is.
The Trump quotes at JanieM’s link read like an Onion article. There’s something terribly wrong with him. (Not big news, of course. It just needs noting sometimes.)
The Trump quotes at JanieM’s link read like an Onion article. There’s something terribly wrong with him. (Not big news, of course. It just needs noting sometimes.)
It never occurred to me that he might be lying (why not? It’s Trump), but discussing it with a very cynical but rather insightful friend, she said that personally she doubted he was actually doing it, because of fear of possible side-effects, but that he just wanted to give credence to all his previous claims. I still think he’s stupid enough to actually do it, but I guess her theory is also credible.
It never occurred to me that he might be lying (why not? It’s Trump), but discussing it with a very cynical but rather insightful friend, she said that personally she doubted he was actually doing it, because of fear of possible side-effects, but that he just wanted to give credence to all his previous claims. I still think he’s stupid enough to actually do it, but I guess her theory is also credible.
The kind who writes a health report that says he’s the healthiest President ever.
Or the kind with enough nerve to feed the POTUS placebos.
The kind who writes a health report that says he’s the healthiest President ever.
Or the kind with enough nerve to feed the POTUS placebos.
I had thought of the possibility that he was lying (I mean, when does he not lie?), but not that his doctor might be lying to him.
That’s even more fun, depending on what you’re hoping for.
I had thought of the possibility that he was lying (I mean, when does he not lie?), but not that his doctor might be lying to him.
That’s even more fun, depending on what you’re hoping for.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/feb/25/trump-doctor-white-house-ronny-jackson
cauliflower to hydroxychloroquine. whouda thunk it was so close?
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/feb/25/trump-doctor-white-house-ronny-jackson
cauliflower to hydroxychloroquine. whouda thunk it was so close?
Didn’t read all of lj’s link but LOL-ed at this:
In terms familiar to harassed parents of toddlers worldwide, Jackson said that work included “making the ice cream less accessible” and “putting cauliflower into the mashed potatoes”.
And — Ronny Jackson was a rear admiral? SRSLY? Is that a rank they just automatically give physicians who are in the navy for a certain length of time?
Didn’t read all of lj’s link but LOL-ed at this:
In terms familiar to harassed parents of toddlers worldwide, Jackson said that work included “making the ice cream less accessible” and “putting cauliflower into the mashed potatoes”.
And — Ronny Jackson was a rear admiral? SRSLY? Is that a rank they just automatically give physicians who are in the navy for a certain length of time?
PS I meant to add, on a different topic, that I’ve taken a couple of days off from the graphs, because I’m trying to decide whether to keep on with them, and/or write a post about the numbers, or what.
Summary: they’re going down. It would be great if they would stay that way. Tuesday often being the day for a bump back up, tomorrow will be informative.
PS I meant to add, on a different topic, that I’ve taken a couple of days off from the graphs, because I’m trying to decide whether to keep on with them, and/or write a post about the numbers, or what.
Summary: they’re going down. It would be great if they would stay that way. Tuesday often being the day for a bump back up, tomorrow will be informative.
In the foreign country that is the present, I sit with my wife on the bench on our front porch. It was a wedding gift from my in-laws, who are now gone for some years. We like to sit out there in the evening before dinner, or else just before bedtime, and catch up on the day.
My wife is from northeast Ohio, from a town called Stow, which is next to a town called Kent, where there is a state university. 50 years ago this week she was an undergraduate there when the Ohio National Guard shot a number of people, killing four and wounding several others. She knew one of the young women killed, they had been in and English class together.
Her aunt, who still lives in Stow, sent her a local paper commemorating the shootings on the 50th anniversary, and she’s been reading through those over the past week.
Tonight, the past and the present all caught up with her, and we spent some time with her crying, and me sitting with her while she did so.
Things just aren’t any better, she said.
I found it hard to argue the point.
I’m glad to see the COVID numbers start to come down.
Good night all.
In the foreign country that is the present, I sit with my wife on the bench on our front porch. It was a wedding gift from my in-laws, who are now gone for some years. We like to sit out there in the evening before dinner, or else just before bedtime, and catch up on the day.
My wife is from northeast Ohio, from a town called Stow, which is next to a town called Kent, where there is a state university. 50 years ago this week she was an undergraduate there when the Ohio National Guard shot a number of people, killing four and wounding several others. She knew one of the young women killed, they had been in and English class together.
Her aunt, who still lives in Stow, sent her a local paper commemorating the shootings on the 50th anniversary, and she’s been reading through those over the past week.
Tonight, the past and the present all caught up with her, and we spent some time with her crying, and me sitting with her while she did so.
Things just aren’t any better, she said.
I found it hard to argue the point.
I’m glad to see the COVID numbers start to come down.
Good night all.
I still think he’s stupid enough to actually do it
Don’t forget that close aides have become infected in the last fortnight.
I find it entirely credible that he’s taking it as a prophylactic (and indeed there is still some medical argument, though no actual evidence, that it might have some utility in this respect).
I still think he’s stupid enough to actually do it
Don’t forget that close aides have become infected in the last fortnight.
I find it entirely credible that he’s taking it as a prophylactic (and indeed there is still some medical argument, though no actual evidence, that it might have some utility in this respect).
And for a complete change, here’s a very good article which is bang on topic.
What Kind of Regime Does China Have?
FRANCIS FUKUYAMA
https://www.the-american-interest.com/2020/05/18/what-kind-of-regime-does-china-have/
… What Americans need to keep in mind is that their enemy and rival right now is not China, but a Chinese Communist Party that has shifted into high-totalitarian mode. We are not dealing with the China of the 1990s or even the 2000s, but a completely different animal that represents a clear challenge to our democratic values. We need to hold it at bay until some point in the future when it returns to being a more normal authoritarian country, or indeed is on its way to being a liberal country. That will not necessarily eliminate the challenge that China represents; a more liberal China could easily be more nationalistic. But it will nonetheless be easier to deal with in many ways.
Unfortunately, over the past three and a half years, the United States has been doing everything it can to weaken itself. It has elected a leader who revels in demonizing his domestic opponents far more than his foreign rivals, who has blithely thrown away the moral high ground that used to be the foundation of American global power, and who has governed the country with such incompetence during the largest crisis of the past three generations that it is no longer taken seriously by either friends or enemies. While democracies as a group have not done worse than authoritarian governments in controlling the crisis, China is able to present itself as having outperformed the United States, and that bilateral comparison is the one that people are paying attention to around the world right now….
And for a complete change, here’s a very good article which is bang on topic.
What Kind of Regime Does China Have?
FRANCIS FUKUYAMA
https://www.the-american-interest.com/2020/05/18/what-kind-of-regime-does-china-have/
… What Americans need to keep in mind is that their enemy and rival right now is not China, but a Chinese Communist Party that has shifted into high-totalitarian mode. We are not dealing with the China of the 1990s or even the 2000s, but a completely different animal that represents a clear challenge to our democratic values. We need to hold it at bay until some point in the future when it returns to being a more normal authoritarian country, or indeed is on its way to being a liberal country. That will not necessarily eliminate the challenge that China represents; a more liberal China could easily be more nationalistic. But it will nonetheless be easier to deal with in many ways.
Unfortunately, over the past three and a half years, the United States has been doing everything it can to weaken itself. It has elected a leader who revels in demonizing his domestic opponents far more than his foreign rivals, who has blithely thrown away the moral high ground that used to be the foundation of American global power, and who has governed the country with such incompetence during the largest crisis of the past three generations that it is no longer taken seriously by either friends or enemies. While democracies as a group have not done worse than authoritarian governments in controlling the crisis, China is able to present itself as having outperformed the United States, and that bilateral comparison is the one that people are paying attention to around the world right now….
so, I guess the end of history hasn’t actually arrived, has it?
so, I guess the end of history hasn’t actually arrived, has it?
so, I guess the end of history hasn’t actually arrived, has it?
LOL.
so, I guess the end of history hasn’t actually arrived, has it?
LOL.
And — Ronny Jackson was a rear admiral? SRSLY? Is that a rank they just automatically give physicians who are in the navy for a certain length of time?
Jackson was also physician to the president for Obama. Obama put Jackson on the promotion list for one star (rear admiral, lower half). Jackson’s predecessor as physician to the president was a one-star general, so it’s apparently not unusual. And it’s the US military, where there’s a lot of up-or-out for career officers.
And — Ronny Jackson was a rear admiral? SRSLY? Is that a rank they just automatically give physicians who are in the navy for a certain length of time?
Jackson was also physician to the president for Obama. Obama put Jackson on the promotion list for one star (rear admiral, lower half). Jackson’s predecessor as physician to the president was a one-star general, so it’s apparently not unusual. And it’s the US military, where there’s a lot of up-or-out for career officers.
Rank rank inflation…
Rank rank inflation…
It’s unfortunate that Fukuyama fails to note how many of the things he deplores about China are things that they are adopting from the west. The instruments of ‘totalitarian control’ are the same things that Facebook Amazon and others have monetized. The desire to go beyond their borders, again, whose model are they following?
And this kills me
It is possible to look back at the years from 1978 to 2012 with a certain nostalgia, since the Chinese people for the first time since the Revolution were given a degree of personal freedom
Thank god that Americans don’t look with nostalgia on a past that had lots of problematic aspects.
We have met the enemy and he is us…
It’s unfortunate that Fukuyama fails to note how many of the things he deplores about China are things that they are adopting from the west. The instruments of ‘totalitarian control’ are the same things that Facebook Amazon and others have monetized. The desire to go beyond their borders, again, whose model are they following?
And this kills me
It is possible to look back at the years from 1978 to 2012 with a certain nostalgia, since the Chinese people for the first time since the Revolution were given a degree of personal freedom
Thank god that Americans don’t look with nostalgia on a past that had lots of problematic aspects.
We have met the enemy and he is us…
That was very poignant, russell. I’m sorry for that sadness, and thank you for telling us about that personal loss, reminding us of our collective loss.
I’ve been reading old books lately. Many of us, by now, have had a lot of acquaintance with death. But I don’t think that it has been as much with us as with the folks from previous generations. Death wasn’t a surprise event. It was a constant hum. I’m not offering this to encourage us to accept it with more enthusiasm. I just feel quite fortunate that when relatives, friends and close acquaintances died, those years were significant and way fewer than when I just got on with whatever else was doing otherwise, which was most of the time.
I’ve been thinking lately about years that someone important in my life died, and how my life was different because of their going. How I remember my grandmothers, and didn’t know my grandfathers. What they were like, and why they were like that. I’m not surprised, now that I’m older, that the world has changed in a way that I don’t understand. I’m just perplexed by the fact that it’s people older than me, people from a generation after my parents, but before me, that are the worst culprits.
That was very poignant, russell. I’m sorry for that sadness, and thank you for telling us about that personal loss, reminding us of our collective loss.
I’ve been reading old books lately. Many of us, by now, have had a lot of acquaintance with death. But I don’t think that it has been as much with us as with the folks from previous generations. Death wasn’t a surprise event. It was a constant hum. I’m not offering this to encourage us to accept it with more enthusiasm. I just feel quite fortunate that when relatives, friends and close acquaintances died, those years were significant and way fewer than when I just got on with whatever else was doing otherwise, which was most of the time.
I’ve been thinking lately about years that someone important in my life died, and how my life was different because of their going. How I remember my grandmothers, and didn’t know my grandfathers. What they were like, and why they were like that. I’m not surprised, now that I’m older, that the world has changed in a way that I don’t understand. I’m just perplexed by the fact that it’s people older than me, people from a generation after my parents, but before me, that are the worst culprits.
China is able to present itself as having outperformed the United States
If Trump gets a second term Burkina Faso will be able present itself as having outperformed the United States.
China is able to present itself as having outperformed the United States
If Trump gets a second term Burkina Faso will be able present itself as having outperformed the United States.
We have met the enemy and he is us…
I truly hope not.
I still have some hopes of western societies avoiding the totalitarian outcome:
…The “social credit” system combines all of the methods of artificial intelligence, big data, and pervasive sensors, and puts them in the hands of the (Chinese) state….
Though of course the current regime is a little too disorganised for that.
We have met the enemy and he is us…
I truly hope not.
I still have some hopes of western societies avoiding the totalitarian outcome:
…The “social credit” system combines all of the methods of artificial intelligence, big data, and pervasive sensors, and puts them in the hands of the (Chinese) state….
Though of course the current regime is a little too disorganised for that.
The US is arguably close to this stage…
…Most early states were what Max Weber labeled “patrimonial”—that is, the state grew out of the household of the ruler and was based on personal relationships between the ruler and his friends and family….
The US is arguably close to this stage…
…Most early states were what Max Weber labeled “patrimonial”—that is, the state grew out of the household of the ruler and was based on personal relationships between the ruler and his friends and family….
The US is arguably close to this stage…
Yes, except in our case it’s a regression.
The US is arguably close to this stage…
Yes, except in our case it’s a regression.
lj, what do you know/think about this? It’s from a comment at CT by David J. Littleboy, who I believe lives in Japan:
That thread has a lot of good stuff in it.
lj, what do you know/think about this? It’s from a comment at CT by David J. Littleboy, who I believe lives in Japan:
That thread has a lot of good stuff in it.
““Don’t collapse the health system” became a new non-arbitrary target, even though it is a rather high target.”
In some respects it was an entirely arbitrary target.
It led, for example, to the large scale discharge of elderly patients, many of whom were infected, into care homes.
““Don’t collapse the health system” became a new non-arbitrary target, even though it is a rather high target.”
In some respects it was an entirely arbitrary target.
It led, for example, to the large scale discharge of elderly patients, many of whom were infected, into care homes.
Yes, Trump is an astoundingly horrible person in terms of pure character: If you were to rank the 44 men who have been president of the United States in terms of the half dozen most important character traits that a president should have, he would rank dead last in every single one, usually by a mile. But he also represents a horrible ideology. Indeed the only “good” thing about him is that his complete degeneracy as a human being interferes with the efficient advancement of that ideology.
The Republican party is an eschatological death cult being exploited by various laissez faire looters, who aim to steal everything that’s not nailed down before the opening of the Seventh Seal. That Donald Trump is currently astride this rough beast is not exactly bad luck.
Apologies. I couldn’t resist.
Yes, Trump is an astoundingly horrible person in terms of pure character: If you were to rank the 44 men who have been president of the United States in terms of the half dozen most important character traits that a president should have, he would rank dead last in every single one, usually by a mile. But he also represents a horrible ideology. Indeed the only “good” thing about him is that his complete degeneracy as a human being interferes with the efficient advancement of that ideology.
The Republican party is an eschatological death cult being exploited by various laissez faire looters, who aim to steal everything that’s not nailed down before the opening of the Seventh Seal. That Donald Trump is currently astride this rough beast is not exactly bad luck.
Apologies. I couldn’t resist.
The future of public spaces — how much like the past will it be?
The future of public spaces — how much like the past will it be?
bobbyp, I also liked this, even though the phrase in bold would of course no longer apply (if it ever did):
“We put a malevolent imbecile in charge and nothing bad has happened yet” is, in fact, the way really stupid people think about things.
bobbyp, I also liked this, even though the phrase in bold would of course no longer apply (if it ever did):
“We put a malevolent imbecile in charge and nothing bad has happened yet” is, in fact, the way really stupid people think about things.
That thread has a lot of good stuff in it.
On the whataboutery discussed, I’ve seen exactly the arguments described (i.e. “What about all these other causes of death we tolerate?”) seemingly coming independently from individual people. But it has to be parroting of arguments coming from a few prominent RW sources.
Anyway, a bit off topic, but on the deaths from car accidents, why do we have street-legal cars that aren’t mandated to be mechanically incapable of exceeding, say, 85 MPH? And if you’re caught exceeding that speed in a car, presumably because it was modified to get around whatever governing method was used in its manufacture, your car gets impounded and you face a prison sentence. Or whatever. I’m just riffing. It just seems that road deaths could be greatly reduced if cars simply couldn’t go as fast as they now can.
(Also, too, I drive kind of fast under the right conditions, but I’d actually prefer that something other than my own restraint kept me in check. Sometimes, I’m not that aware of how fast I’m going on a wide, straight, open road with good visibility and a dry surface.)
That thread has a lot of good stuff in it.
On the whataboutery discussed, I’ve seen exactly the arguments described (i.e. “What about all these other causes of death we tolerate?”) seemingly coming independently from individual people. But it has to be parroting of arguments coming from a few prominent RW sources.
Anyway, a bit off topic, but on the deaths from car accidents, why do we have street-legal cars that aren’t mandated to be mechanically incapable of exceeding, say, 85 MPH? And if you’re caught exceeding that speed in a car, presumably because it was modified to get around whatever governing method was used in its manufacture, your car gets impounded and you face a prison sentence. Or whatever. I’m just riffing. It just seems that road deaths could be greatly reduced if cars simply couldn’t go as fast as they now can.
(Also, too, I drive kind of fast under the right conditions, but I’d actually prefer that something other than my own restraint kept me in check. Sometimes, I’m not that aware of how fast I’m going on a wide, straight, open road with good visibility and a dry surface.)
Even then, it was more “nothing bad enough that it can’t be ignored, albeit with effort, has happened yet”
That, as a political matter, is the significance of covid-19: it is something bad enough to make ignoring it far harder. Sort of like the difference between a war in Somalia or Yemen, and a war where American soldiers are coming home badly wounded or in body bags. It’s when it’s people you actually know who are severely impacted that something becomes real for most people.
Even then, it was more “nothing bad enough that it can’t be ignored, albeit with effort, has happened yet”
That, as a political matter, is the significance of covid-19: it is something bad enough to make ignoring it far harder. Sort of like the difference between a war in Somalia or Yemen, and a war where American soldiers are coming home badly wounded or in body bags. It’s when it’s people you actually know who are severely impacted that something becomes real for most people.
hsh — on my once or twice a year visits to Ohio, I see a lot of TV (mostly sports) that I don’t see ordinarily, since ordinarily I see none at all.
Relevantly to your thought train, my brother was for many years an ardent NASCAR fan. He’s a very good mechanic; I used to think his happiest career would have been as par of a pit crew.
I was bemused to learn about restrictor plates, i.e. in races where, to an ignorant person like myself, part of the point was to go faster than everyone else, there were reasons why all the cars had to be prevented from going as fast as they otherwise could have.
It actually still bemuses me, but I guess I can see why, on the one hand, people would want to see if they could keep developing ever more powerful engines, and on the other, ever more powerful engines would wreck racing if they were allowed to proliferate unrestricted and unrestrictedly.
(Word play, on the other hand, is unrestrictable.)
hsh — on my once or twice a year visits to Ohio, I see a lot of TV (mostly sports) that I don’t see ordinarily, since ordinarily I see none at all.
Relevantly to your thought train, my brother was for many years an ardent NASCAR fan. He’s a very good mechanic; I used to think his happiest career would have been as par of a pit crew.
I was bemused to learn about restrictor plates, i.e. in races where, to an ignorant person like myself, part of the point was to go faster than everyone else, there were reasons why all the cars had to be prevented from going as fast as they otherwise could have.
It actually still bemuses me, but I guess I can see why, on the one hand, people would want to see if they could keep developing ever more powerful engines, and on the other, ever more powerful engines would wreck racing if they were allowed to proliferate unrestricted and unrestrictedly.
(Word play, on the other hand, is unrestrictable.)
Supporting our boys in uniform. And the heroes of the war on the virus:
Words fail me. The utter pettiness is unbelievable.
Supporting our boys in uniform. And the heroes of the war on the virus:
Words fail me. The utter pettiness is unbelievable.
Another group on the front lines, not that underpaying and undervaluing them is new in the COVID-19 era.
Subhead of the article: “Direct care workers are already living paycheck to paycheck,” a researcher said. “Now they are being asked to put their lives on the line for $13 an hour.”
Another group on the front lines, not that underpaying and undervaluing them is new in the COVID-19 era.
Subhead of the article: “Direct care workers are already living paycheck to paycheck,” a researcher said. “Now they are being asked to put their lives on the line for $13 an hour.”
I don’t want my comment about nursing home workers to deflect attention from wj’s 12:12.
I’m sure it’s pie in the sky, but I hope someone in some quiet government office somewhere is quietly keeping track of all this
pettinessviciousness, so that we have a chance of righting some of the wrongs when we vote these people into oblivion.Or however they’re going to get there.
I don’t want my comment about nursing home workers to deflect attention from wj’s 12:12.
I’m sure it’s pie in the sky, but I hope someone in some quiet government office somewhere is quietly keeping track of all this
pettinessviciousness, so that we have a chance of righting some of the wrongs when we vote these people into oblivion.Or however they’re going to get there.
wj’s comment @12.12 must go on resonating until this is all over and, as Janie says, perhaps some of it can be put right.
But since the future is a foreign country, and we must therefore always be aware of the past, I would be remiss, yet again, if I didn’t point out that for the first time since the year after the battle of Agincourt, storks are nesting and raising chicks in these islands.
wj’s comment @12.12 must go on resonating until this is all over and, as Janie says, perhaps some of it can be put right.
But since the future is a foreign country, and we must therefore always be aware of the past, I would be remiss, yet again, if I didn’t point out that for the first time since the year after the battle of Agincourt, storks are nesting and raising chicks in these islands.
GftNC: as to the storks: wow.
How quickly would they take the whole thing back from us if we disappeared altogether? Tho’ you don’t say whether this development has anything to do with human activity having quieted down lately.
To an American, or at least to this one, it’s haunting to think of having the stories of your land go back that far.
****
Speaking of your land, I just picked up 1066 and All That and read the first 10 or 12 pages. For the first few pages I was laughing so hard I thought I was going to lose my lunch. After that I calmed down a little, but I don’t know whether that was because there were more references that I just wasn’t getting, or because they just couldn’t sustain that density of nonsense for longer than a few pages. But for anyone who might pick the book up, be sure to read the front matter, don’t just skip to the first actual chapter. Everything except the copyright page is hilarious.
The style of humor brought to mind Nick Hornby’s “Ten Years in a Tub” — a collection of his book reviews. Several years ago I read about half that book, leaving the rest for later because I got too flooded with titles that he made me desperately want to read.
That book too triggers belly laughs, in part because of droll repetitions that go on from one review to the next, like referring to us Americans as “you lot.”
Here’s a question about 1066: who would have gotten all the jokes when the book was written? I mean, Eton and Harrow are referenced….but what about everyone else? What about now? I find it hard to believe that anyone is still taught about Boadicea and woad and Alfred and the cakes, but maybe I’m wrong about that.
GftNC: as to the storks: wow.
How quickly would they take the whole thing back from us if we disappeared altogether? Tho’ you don’t say whether this development has anything to do with human activity having quieted down lately.
To an American, or at least to this one, it’s haunting to think of having the stories of your land go back that far.
****
Speaking of your land, I just picked up 1066 and All That and read the first 10 or 12 pages. For the first few pages I was laughing so hard I thought I was going to lose my lunch. After that I calmed down a little, but I don’t know whether that was because there were more references that I just wasn’t getting, or because they just couldn’t sustain that density of nonsense for longer than a few pages. But for anyone who might pick the book up, be sure to read the front matter, don’t just skip to the first actual chapter. Everything except the copyright page is hilarious.
The style of humor brought to mind Nick Hornby’s “Ten Years in a Tub” — a collection of his book reviews. Several years ago I read about half that book, leaving the rest for later because I got too flooded with titles that he made me desperately want to read.
That book too triggers belly laughs, in part because of droll repetitions that go on from one review to the next, like referring to us Americans as “you lot.”
Here’s a question about 1066: who would have gotten all the jokes when the book was written? I mean, Eton and Harrow are referenced….but what about everyone else? What about now? I find it hard to believe that anyone is still taught about Boadicea and woad and Alfred and the cakes, but maybe I’m wrong about that.
It’s an interesting question, JanieM.
I have to confess that, though familiar with quite a number of quotes form the book, I have never read it. (Perhaps because adults told me it was funny, when I was a child, and I was perversely resistant to overenthusiastic book recommendations, despite being a voracious reader.)
The authors’ note that “America was thus clearly Top Nation, and history came to a .” was strangely disconcerting, too.
Noting that it was written in 1930, I now must read it….
It’s an interesting question, JanieM.
I have to confess that, though familiar with quite a number of quotes form the book, I have never read it. (Perhaps because adults told me it was funny, when I was a child, and I was perversely resistant to overenthusiastic book recommendations, despite being a voracious reader.)
The authors’ note that “America was thus clearly Top Nation, and history came to a .” was strangely disconcerting, too.
Noting that it was written in 1930, I now must read it….
A splendidly (and rightly) paranoid article:
Since I Met Edward Snowden, I’ve Never Stopped Watching My Back
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/06/edward-snowden-operation-firstfruits/610573/
Recommended long read, and I shall buy the book.
A splendidly (and rightly) paranoid article:
Since I Met Edward Snowden, I’ve Never Stopped Watching My Back
https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/06/edward-snowden-operation-firstfruits/610573/
Recommended long read, and I shall buy the book.
Nigel — in case it’s not obvious from hints, “top nation” is a recurring theme in the book.
Also, I’m pretty sure that when I first read it at about age 18, I had no idea that “you lot” called that little dot a “full stop.” That was only one of the many jokes that surely went right past me, and even so I remember thinking the book was about the funniest thing I had ever read.
*****
perversely resistant to overenthusiastic… _____
Fill in the blank with any number of things and we could start a support group. I didn’t give it up with childhood, to be honest. 😉
Nigel — in case it’s not obvious from hints, “top nation” is a recurring theme in the book.
Also, I’m pretty sure that when I first read it at about age 18, I had no idea that “you lot” called that little dot a “full stop.” That was only one of the many jokes that surely went right past me, and even so I remember thinking the book was about the funniest thing I had ever read.
*****
perversely resistant to overenthusiastic… _____
Fill in the blank with any number of things and we could start a support group. I didn’t give it up with childhood, to be honest. 😉
What joy to have something to talk about that isn’t pure misery.
The storks are back partly as a result of rewilding, a certain amount of which is going on in the estates etc of sympathetic landowners. Several adults were reintroduced a few years ago, but this is the first year they have successfully bred: two nests and six chicks altogether. As for whether the general quietening down has anything to do with it, rather hard to tell. It is in a rather rural place, so possibly not. The landowner was interviewed, and said: beavers next! (They have already been reintroduced in a few places, with excellent results in e.g. flood amelioration.) He did, however, say that bears and wolves might have to wait til people were ready for it – I’m guessing to North Americans, neither of those is nearly as inconceivable as it would be to us! And speaking of North Americans, I confess I often think of you as “you lot”.
On 1066, you inspire me to look at it again. I haven’t done so for ages. My memory says that by the time I was 18 or so (and leaving high school) I probably got most of the references, and I also remember that the more you knew the funnier it was. I went to a very academic public school (your equivalent of a prep school), so not that different from a girls’ version of Eton or Harrow, and of course there were lots of excellent state schools too, so I think most of what the book covers was still on the then high school curriculum, and the authors were after all history teachers. I don’t really know about now, although I think Boadicea is still taught (but now she is, apparently more authentically, called Boudicca). I do remember that the “Test papers” were a brilliant parody of the real thing, even in my time, despite having been written in the 30s. But the version of history being lampooned has been out of fashion now for decades, so who knows. I left school in 1973, and by the mid 80s, or maybe the 90s, I think it was already different.
Thanks for pointing me to “Ten Years in a Tub”, I seriously need book recommendations at the moment.
Off to find 1066 And All That….given the state of my flat, I might, like Captain Oates, be some time….
What joy to have something to talk about that isn’t pure misery.
The storks are back partly as a result of rewilding, a certain amount of which is going on in the estates etc of sympathetic landowners. Several adults were reintroduced a few years ago, but this is the first year they have successfully bred: two nests and six chicks altogether. As for whether the general quietening down has anything to do with it, rather hard to tell. It is in a rather rural place, so possibly not. The landowner was interviewed, and said: beavers next! (They have already been reintroduced in a few places, with excellent results in e.g. flood amelioration.) He did, however, say that bears and wolves might have to wait til people were ready for it – I’m guessing to North Americans, neither of those is nearly as inconceivable as it would be to us! And speaking of North Americans, I confess I often think of you as “you lot”.
On 1066, you inspire me to look at it again. I haven’t done so for ages. My memory says that by the time I was 18 or so (and leaving high school) I probably got most of the references, and I also remember that the more you knew the funnier it was. I went to a very academic public school (your equivalent of a prep school), so not that different from a girls’ version of Eton or Harrow, and of course there were lots of excellent state schools too, so I think most of what the book covers was still on the then high school curriculum, and the authors were after all history teachers. I don’t really know about now, although I think Boadicea is still taught (but now she is, apparently more authentically, called Boudicca). I do remember that the “Test papers” were a brilliant parody of the real thing, even in my time, despite having been written in the 30s. But the version of history being lampooned has been out of fashion now for decades, so who knows. I left school in 1973, and by the mid 80s, or maybe the 90s, I think it was already different.
Thanks for pointing me to “Ten Years in a Tub”, I seriously need book recommendations at the moment.
Off to find 1066 And All That….given the state of my flat, I might, like Captain Oates, be some time….
Bears we have, wolves, in the eastern US, not so much unless you want to include the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, northern Wisconsin and northern Minnesota as “east”. Their historic range did not include the southeast.
Coyotes, on the other hand, are everywhere now. Deer as well. Was startled a couple years ago late one evening as I was driving down a multi-lane (two travel lanes in each direction plus multiple turn lanes) road in a developed suburban area, had to slow as an at-least 12-point buck ambled across the road towards the giant parking lot of a big-box home improvement store.
Bears we have, wolves, in the eastern US, not so much unless you want to include the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, northern Wisconsin and northern Minnesota as “east”. Their historic range did not include the southeast.
Coyotes, on the other hand, are everywhere now. Deer as well. Was startled a couple years ago late one evening as I was driving down a multi-lane (two travel lanes in each direction plus multiple turn lanes) road in a developed suburban area, had to slow as an at-least 12-point buck ambled across the road towards the giant parking lot of a big-box home improvement store.
I was just reading an article that mentioned “rewildinging” in England, introducing such things as moose.
Which reminded me of the story of a Scotsman touring a museum in the US, where he saw a stuffed moose:
“wha critter be tha?”
“A moose”
“Och! If that’s a moose, they mus have RATS the size of elephants!”
I was just reading an article that mentioned “rewildinging” in England, introducing such things as moose.
Which reminded me of the story of a Scotsman touring a museum in the US, where he saw a stuffed moose:
“wha critter be tha?”
“A moose”
“Och! If that’s a moose, they mus have RATS the size of elephants!”
Sorry, I missed Janie’s comment about the CT comment. I always have difficult following CT comment threads, partly because of my own preferences but also because there seems to be so much devil’s advocate arguments and the goal sometimes doesn’t seen to be clarity but more like winning arguments. So just focussing on David’s comment, my city, which has 700,000+ people, only has 9 ICU beds. I read a journal article about the 1919 pandemic in Japan and it noted that the hospital stats in Japan were quite different than in the rest of the world, so there seems to be some cultural aspect about the way Japanese use hospitals vs the way Westerners do. So from that point, it’s true, but I can’t follow the line of argument about whether not collapsing the health system is an important point to keep in mind or if, because it can’t be quantified, is meaningless.
Sorry, I missed Janie’s comment about the CT comment. I always have difficult following CT comment threads, partly because of my own preferences but also because there seems to be so much devil’s advocate arguments and the goal sometimes doesn’t seen to be clarity but more like winning arguments. So just focussing on David’s comment, my city, which has 700,000+ people, only has 9 ICU beds. I read a journal article about the 1919 pandemic in Japan and it noted that the hospital stats in Japan were quite different than in the rest of the world, so there seems to be some cultural aspect about the way Japanese use hospitals vs the way Westerners do. So from that point, it’s true, but I can’t follow the line of argument about whether not collapsing the health system is an important point to keep in mind or if, because it can’t be quantified, is meaningless.
I mean, when John Quiggen write
“The virus is exactly similar to car crashes – risky behavior endangers yourself and others”
Well, yeah, but no. ‘Exactly similar’? I mean it is possible for a drunk driver to cause the death of a number of people and emerge unscathed, but for the virus, someone can do that and then go on with their life as if nothing happened. Or is he being ironic? I love sarcasm, but when it creates a situation where you don’t know what is actually being said, it can really cause problems. Or is this one of those taking the arguments as far as they will go? I dunno.
I mean, when John Quiggen write
“The virus is exactly similar to car crashes – risky behavior endangers yourself and others”
Well, yeah, but no. ‘Exactly similar’? I mean it is possible for a drunk driver to cause the death of a number of people and emerge unscathed, but for the virus, someone can do that and then go on with their life as if nothing happened. Or is he being ironic? I love sarcasm, but when it creates a situation where you don’t know what is actually being said, it can really cause problems. Or is this one of those taking the arguments as far as they will go? I dunno.
Huh, I can’t find it. I have just ordered another copy from Abebooks. I must have lent it years ago, and never got it back. It’s one of those books you have to lend when you encounter people of similar sensibilities: another two examples (and wonders both, although of very different kinds) are Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas and The Thirteen Clocks
Huh, I can’t find it. I have just ordered another copy from Abebooks. I must have lent it years ago, and never got it back. It’s one of those books you have to lend when you encounter people of similar sensibilities: another two examples (and wonders both, although of very different kinds) are Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas and The Thirteen Clocks
lj — I thought that JQ comment was weird too, but I don’t comment there hardly ever, so I left it alone. I also read their threads very randomly — mostly just certain commenters, or to follow an exchange that catches my eye.
Also, there like here, I think there are ongoing “rivalries” (?), and not being familiar with them makes it harder to interpret comments like that JQ one.
I mostly flagged Littleboy’s comment because I wondered about your take on Japan. He rarely comments, but I believe he’s an alum of my college, so I tend to notice.
lj — I thought that JQ comment was weird too, but I don’t comment there hardly ever, so I left it alone. I also read their threads very randomly — mostly just certain commenters, or to follow an exchange that catches my eye.
Also, there like here, I think there are ongoing “rivalries” (?), and not being familiar with them makes it harder to interpret comments like that JQ one.
I mostly flagged Littleboy’s comment because I wondered about your take on Japan. He rarely comments, but I believe he’s an alum of my college, so I tend to notice.
Tara Reade!
or, we can take the word of someone who claimed to earn a degree that she didn’t earn in a degree program that never existed.
Tara Reade!
or, we can take the word of someone who claimed to earn a degree that she didn’t earn in a degree program that never existed.
Just try, if you can, to imagine the hair-on-fire outrage over something like this if Hillary Clinton had done it when she was SoS.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/pompeo-s-elite-taxpayer-funded-dinners-raise-new-concerns-n1210746
Oh, well.
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/01/hillary-clinton-justice-department-investigation-results
Just try, if you can, to imagine the hair-on-fire outrage over something like this if Hillary Clinton had done it when she was SoS.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/pompeo-s-elite-taxpayer-funded-dinners-raise-new-concerns-n1210746
Oh, well.
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/01/hillary-clinton-justice-department-investigation-results
Thanks to my wife and cleek, my Tara Reade Credibility Index has been trending downward.
Thanks to my wife and cleek, my Tara Reade Credibility Index has been trending downward.
When I see these high profile, and very convenient, charges I incline to skepticism. Of the “innocent until proven guilty” variety, not the “she must be lying” variety. Whether they are about sexual harrassment or theft or anything else.
In which vein, I observe this
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-52733886
Apparently the super high profile change of heart by the woman in Roe v Wade was just a paid performance. Up to $500,000 per appearance before the cameras.
When I see these high profile, and very convenient, charges I incline to skepticism. Of the “innocent until proven guilty” variety, not the “she must be lying” variety. Whether they are about sexual harrassment or theft or anything else.
In which vein, I observe this
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-52733886
Apparently the super high profile change of heart by the woman in Roe v Wade was just a paid performance. Up to $500,000 per appearance before the cameras.
wearing a mask, washing your hands….just another chapter in the culture wars.
wearing a mask, washing your hands….just another chapter in the culture wars.
Oh, well.
i’m sure they’re just very busy editing audio in order to accuse Job Biden of doing his job w/r/t Ukraine.
Oh, well.
i’m sure they’re just very busy editing audio in order to accuse Job Biden of doing his job w/r/t Ukraine.
Job Biden.
his stuttering is contagious.
Job Biden.
his stuttering is contagious.
Have you read his book? It’s full of wisdom.
Have you read his book? It’s full of wisdom.
An expressed desire to do things in a strictly proper manner must mean that you were doing the opposite. Well, at least if you were in the Obama administration.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/05/19/michael-flynn-full-susan-rice-email-sent-on-trumps-inauguration-day-267998
An expressed desire to do things in a strictly proper manner must mean that you were doing the opposite. Well, at least if you were in the Obama administration.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/05/19/michael-flynn-full-susan-rice-email-sent-on-trumps-inauguration-day-267998
An expressed desire to do things in a strictly proper manner must mean that you were doing the opposite. Well, at least if you were in the Obama administration.
This makes sense, if you think about it. Someone who reflexively lies about pretty much anything and everything is naturally going to expect that whatever anyone else says is a lie. So of course he’s going to assume that this must have been a lie as well. Because he can’t imagine someone who is actually honest or ethical — just not part of his world.
An expressed desire to do things in a strictly proper manner must mean that you were doing the opposite. Well, at least if you were in the Obama administration.
This makes sense, if you think about it. Someone who reflexively lies about pretty much anything and everything is naturally going to expect that whatever anyone else says is a lie. So of course he’s going to assume that this must have been a lie as well. Because he can’t imagine someone who is actually honest or ethical — just not part of his world.
hsh’s link.
why, it’s almost as if the whole thing is a non-falsifiable matter of faith, to the GOP laity.
the clergy know better. but they also know what’s most important.
hsh’s link.
why, it’s almost as if the whole thing is a non-falsifiable matter of faith, to the GOP laity.
the clergy know better. but they also know what’s most important.
They are just trying to flip the script again. If something was used against Kavanaugh, then anything that could put Biden in the same frame is going to get play. The Rice email is their attempt to make an Obama/Biden exchange look enough like the “no quid pro quo” declarations in the Ukraine affair that they can relieve any lingering values dissonance from their supporters with a little tu quoque.
They are just trying to flip the script again. If something was used against Kavanaugh, then anything that could put Biden in the same frame is going to get play. The Rice email is their attempt to make an Obama/Biden exchange look enough like the “no quid pro quo” declarations in the Ukraine affair that they can relieve any lingering values dissonance from their supporters with a little tu quoque.
one big difference between this and “no quid pro quo” is that nobody doubts Rice knows what the words “by the book” mean, and wasn’t just repeating a phrase she’d heard her lawyer repeating to her over and over.
one big difference between this and “no quid pro quo” is that nobody doubts Rice knows what the words “by the book” mean, and wasn’t just repeating a phrase she’d heard her lawyer repeating to her over and over.
hey Republicans, clean up your party becfore it’s too late.
Perkins is the GOP nominee for Senate in Oregon.
hey Republicans, clean up your party becfore it’s too late.
Perkins is the GOP nominee for Senate in Oregon.
“History repeats itself, first as tragedy, then as farce.” – Karl Marx
I’m not sure what we’re repeating, or which episode was the tragic one. Probably a few to pick from.
But farce has been achieved.
“History repeats itself, first as tragedy, then as farce.” – Karl Marx
I’m not sure what we’re repeating, or which episode was the tragic one. Probably a few to pick from.
But farce has been achieved.
Great Depression — history
Great Recession — tragedy
Today’s economy* — farce
* name still TBD. Trump’s Chasm comes to mind, but we might do better.
Great Depression — history
Great Recession — tragedy
Today’s economy* — farce
* name still TBD. Trump’s Chasm comes to mind, but we might do better.
but who will guard the potatos?
but who will guard the potatos?
But where is the “e”?
But where is the “e”?
Real men don’t bother with “e”. That’s why they’re mal. 😉
Real men don’t bother with “e”. That’s why they’re mal. 😉
On Fukuyama’s article, China is exporting its social control model:
https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/04/23/coronavirus-pandemic-china-eurasia-russia-influence/
..Secondly, there is huge appetite among insecure leaders across Eurasia to emulate China’s model of societal control and surveillance. Chinese companies including Hikvision and Huawei have been aggressively pushing their products to authoritarian leaders in the region long before the pandemic. Moscow’s city government was an early adopter of this technology, relying on Chinese vendors like Hikvision. In Central Asia, Huawei and other Chinese companies have been building similar systems throughout the last decade. For the Kremlin, the pandemic has been the best possible justification for the rapid embrace of Chinese-style monitoring systems, such as the surveillance cameras equipped with facial recognition technology that are starting to appear on city streets. Now it is increasingly likely that other Russian cities will roll out similar systems, and the Kremlin will no doubt turn to China for technical assistance…
On Fukuyama’s article, China is exporting its social control model:
https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/04/23/coronavirus-pandemic-china-eurasia-russia-influence/
..Secondly, there is huge appetite among insecure leaders across Eurasia to emulate China’s model of societal control and surveillance. Chinese companies including Hikvision and Huawei have been aggressively pushing their products to authoritarian leaders in the region long before the pandemic. Moscow’s city government was an early adopter of this technology, relying on Chinese vendors like Hikvision. In Central Asia, Huawei and other Chinese companies have been building similar systems throughout the last decade. For the Kremlin, the pandemic has been the best possible justification for the rapid embrace of Chinese-style monitoring systems, such as the surveillance cameras equipped with facial recognition technology that are starting to appear on city streets. Now it is increasingly likely that other Russian cities will roll out similar systems, and the Kremlin will no doubt turn to China for technical assistance…