Right and Wrong

by publius

Kevin Drum weighs in on the recent back and forth about whether anti-war liberals were right for the wrong reasons:

If anti-war liberals were right about the war from the start, how come they don’t get more respect? Here’s the nickel version of the answer from liberal hawks: It’s because they don’t deserve it. Sure, the war has gone badly, but not for the reasons the doves warned of.

His post is already generating some testy responses and I’m sure this debate will — like a bad strain of herpes — be with us for a long time to come.  I’m not terribly interested in continuing this debate, but I do think that people shouldn’t lose the forest for the trees in assessing the “reasons” people opposed the war.

The logic of the pro-war liberals’ argument is:  (1) the anti-war people opposed the war for Reason X; (2) Reason X turned out to be wrong or unjustified; (3) therefore, their judgment isn’t any better than ours; and (4) they should shut their hippy traps.  But opposition to the war can’t be completely reduced to individual fact-specific arguments — you also have to factor in the larger environment in which the debate played out.  Speaking for myself, I opposed the war not so much because I was dead certain I had all the facts right, but because of my increasingly-intense skepticism of the broader context in which the pro-war argument was being made.

In other words, something just smelled funny about the whole thing — and I think this “smell” should have had right-thinking people jumping off the bus by March 2003.  More after the jump (my very first by the way).

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The Beauty of ‘Fairness’

by Andrew "There’s no two things on Earth are equal or have an equal chance." Sergeant Buster Kilrain, Gettysburg Via Captain’s Quarters, I see that Representative Dennis Kucinich, in between Presidential runs, has decided to resurrect the Fairness Doctrine. For those unfamiliar with the Fairness Doctrine, the basic idea was that if a station ran … Read more

Just What Baghdad Needed…

by hilzoy From IRINNews: “Residents of Iraq’s capital, Baghdad, are at risk of contracting a range of waterborne diseases as the city’s sewage system has collapsed after four days of heavy rain, the country’s health ministry said on Monday. For nearly a week now, 45-year-old teacher Jassim Abdullah has been forced to buy bottled water … Read more

A Gang Apart

by von

I thought, given all the changes that have been made to ObWi’s line-up since its inception and the woefully out-of-date state of ObWi’s "About Me," a short "cast of characters" might be helpful for the readers to ferret out exactly who-is-what-and-why among the front-pagers. …. 

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Martin Luther King

by hilzoy “Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. Hate multiplies hate, violence multiplies violence, and toughness multiplies toughness in a descending spiral of destruction.” (cite) … Read more

Padilla 3: A Feature, Not A Bug

by hilzoy

In the first part of this series, I described the torture of Jose Padilla, and started to try to explain it. I began by describing the “mosaic theory” of intelligence gathering, according to which one should try to collect little bits of intelligence and fit them together into a bigger picture. In the second part, I described the KUBARK manual, a 1963 CIA handbook that has been described as the ‘Bible of interrogation’, and argued that the techniques of interrogation it recommends have been used on Padilla and others.

The KUBARK manual recommends that interrogators first try to produce ‘regression’ in detainees, and then provide a rationalization that will allow them to escape by cooperating. The manual describes interrogations that have a clear endpoint: the subject cooperates. In my last post, I argued that since 9/11, interrogation has been freed from the constraints that normally circumscribe it: the legal system in the US, and the difficulty of holding detainees for long periods of time abroad. Under these conditions, merging the KUBARK approach to interrogation with the mosaic theory will produce an effort to induce more and more regression, without any clear end at all. In this post I want to try to explain what this means. Specifically, I want to argue for the following thesis:

That our government designed a system of interrogation whose express purpose was to inflict serious psychological damage on people we were interrogating.

Think about that.

Moreover: since this was a CIA manual, the people the CIA was trying to drive insane would have been kidnapped, not arrested and convicted. Therefore, as Publius notes, they might, for all we know, be completely innocent. (Especially since this was during the period when the very same CIA was hatching plans to kill Fidel Castro with an exploding conch shell, and to give him a diving suit “infected with a fungus that would cause a chronic and debilitating skin disease.” Hardly their soberest moment.)

Anyways: let’s start with the term ‘regression’.

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First, Accuse All the Lawyers of Treason

by publius [Before I weigh in on Stimson’s attacks on law firms, I should disclose that my firm (though not me personally) represents some Guantanamo detainees.  So take that for what it’s worth.] Other than its obnoxiousness, the thing that really stands out about Stimson’s critique is the basic conceptual error that we’ve seen again … Read more

Enormous Progress

by hilzoy Think Progress informs us that Vice President Cheney has gone stark raving mad: “CHENEY: If you look at what’s transpired in Iraq, Chris, we have in fact made enormous progress.” Gosh. Wow. I mean, what to say? Which Historical Lunatic Are You?From the fecund loins of Rum and Monkey. Back here on planet … Read more

Uh-Oh

by hilzoy

From the NYT:

“Deep into an updated Army manual, the deletion of 10 words has left some national security experts wondering whether government lawyers are again asserting the executive branch’s right to wiretap Americans without a court warrant.

The manual, described by the Army as a “major revision” to intelligence-gathering guidelines, addresses policies and procedures for wiretapping Americans, among other issues.

The original guidelines, from 1984, said the Army could seek to wiretap people inside the United States on an emergency basis by going to the secret court set up by the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, known as FISA, or by obtaining certification from the attorney general “issued under the authority of section 102(a) of the Act.”

That last phrase is missing from the latest manual, which says simply that the Army can seek emergency wiretapping authority pursuant to an order issued by the FISA court “or upon attorney general authorization.” It makes no mention of the attorney general doing so under FISA.

Bush administration officials said that the wording change was insignificant, adding that the Army would follow FISA requirements if it sought to wiretap an American.”

You have to love that last part. I mean, why shouldn’t we trust them on this point?

You might be asking yourself: what, exactly, does section 102(a) of FISA say? I gather that it’s 50 U.S.C. 1802(a) (and, for the record, why don’t they make it easy for us non-lawyers and cite the section of the US Code, not the section of the original act?) I’ve pasted it below the fold. Short version: it puts a lot of restrictions on when, exactly, the President, through the Attorney General, can conduct a warrantless wiretap. Among other things, it requires the Attorney General to certify in writing that “there is no substantial likelihood that the surveillance will acquire the contents of any communication to which a United States person is a party,” and it also requires that s/he transmit this certification to the FISA court.

It doesn’t sound like a minor deletion to me, especially since it fits what we know about the warrantless wiretap program so neatly.

I wish we had an administration we could trust to obey the law. You’d think that it would help that all those godfearing people swear oaths to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution, which, last time I checked, includes a requirement that the President take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed. Apparently not.

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Disbar Him

by hilzoy Actually, I don’t know what the rules governing disbarment are. But if one of the grounds for disbarment is revealing a total lack of the most basic knowledge of our legal system and its values, then Charles Stimson, deputy assistant secretary of defense for detainee affairs, should be disbarred: “In a repellent interview … Read more

Happier Birthday!

by hilzoy Lawyers, Guns and Money notes that it’s Rush Limbaugh’s birthday, and Ann Althouse’s too. Feh. Why note these annoying birthdays when there’s a much better cause for conservative celebration? Do you know whose birthday it is? Edmund Burke’s! Ah, for the good old days, when conservatives were conservative, and wonderfully perceptive students of … Read more

You Can’t Take the Sky From Me

by Andrew If memory serves, when my taste for Babylon 5 was first revealed here at ObWings, there was some discussion of another sci-fi show called Firefly. As luck would have it, I received both Firefly and Serenity as Christmas gifts, and Amanda and I had time to watch the full series and the film … Read more

I Welcome My New Hilzoyian Overlords

by publius So after a night of heavy drinking, Hilzoy apparently got on the computer and started inviting random people to join Obsidian Wings (Justin Timberlake was on the email I received for some reason).  So before she could revoke the offer, I accepted.  And you people are now, for better or worse, stuck with … Read more

Bad Television

by von Television, it is said, thrives on conflict; debate; dispute.  Let us hope that the same does not apply to blogs — at least, not this day. I agree with Hilzoy and Andrew that President Bush’s push for more troops in Iraq should be opposed.  I do not say this because I believe that … Read more

Protecting Soldiers is Number One(?)

by Andrew This is really hilzoy’s shtick, but I’ll hope she’ll forgive me for jumping in on it. While IEDs are the biggest killer of our troops in Iraq, RPGs remain a significant threat and will do so for the foreseeable future. The DoD, to its credit, went looking for a way to protect troops … Read more

A Proposal for the Democrats

by Andrew I should first note that I am in complete agreement with hilzoy’s proposal (and that my agreement is solely my own and does not represent an endorsement by my employer). And I sympathize with the Democrats who are gun shy about being unfairly accused of being against the troops because they want to … Read more

Support The Troops. Block The Surge.

by hilzoy To no one’s surprise, President Bush announced that he plans to send 21,500 more troops to Iraq. There are lots of good responses to Bush’s speech. I’m not going to add one. I’m just going to say this: As I said yesterday, more or less no one outside the administration and the American … Read more

The Abyss

by hilzoy First, Gary needs your help. See here. Second, and apologies to Gary for placing him in this company: if Josh Trevino could be said to have left any sharks unjumped and any depths unplumbed, he has jumped and plumbed them now: “I have stated previously that I endorse cruel things in war — … Read more

A Christmas Story

–by Sebastian Personal anecdote open thread. I went to Denver for Christmas to visit my family.  As you may have heard, there was a bit of snow in Denver around that time.  Fortunately I was traveling on Saturday–two days after the Denver airport reopened.  There was a warming trend while I was there.  It got … Read more

Nothing New

—by Sebastian Well now that we have heard the president’s speech on the troop surge, I can safely say what I strongly suspected:  Bush’s strategy is unchanged from the stragedy he has played out since the beginning.  He has no explanation for why we have done so poorly thus far, and thus can offer no … Read more

Padilla 2: Interrogation Terminable And Interminable

by hilzoy

In the first part of this series, I described the torture of Jose Padilla, and started to answer the question: why is this happening? I described the “mosaic theory” of intelligence gathering — the view that one should try to collect tiny pieces of intelligence and fit them together into a bigger picture.

As I said in that post, the mosaic theory is fine in itself, but it does provide a reason to hold people indefinitely, since one can never know when they might produce some tiny snippet of information whose importance they might not even be aware of. And I quoted an FBI affidavit that suggested that the government regarded the mosaic theory in that way.

Nonetheless, the FBI’s use of the mosaic theory has always been limited. The FBI operates within the United States, and both the information it gathers and its treatment of prisoners, have to stand up in court. For this reason it can neither detain prisoners indefinitely, nor violate their rights while they are in custody.

The CIA is in a different situation entirely. It normally operates outside the US, and its goal is normally not criminal prosecution but intelligence gathering. For this reason it is not subject to the same strictures as the FBI or domestic police forces. It does not need to justify its detention of people to US courts, or to interrogate them in ways that would stand up in a court of law. It would be surprising if its interrogation procedures did not reflect these differences.

However, there are practical limits on what the CIA can do. One of the most important, for our purposes, is that it is hard for it to detain prisoners indefinitely. It would have to do so outside the US in order to avoid the requirements of the US legal system, and this means that its detentions either exist at the sufferance of other governments, whose continued acquiescence cannot be counted on, or rely heavily on secrecy, which cannot be counted on either. In either case, it’s hard to see how the CIA could count on being able to detain people — especially large numbers of people — indefinitely. Possibly the CIA has detained some people for long stretches of time, but these would have to be a small number of exceptional cases.

This means that the CIA has also had to operate within certain practical limits. I imagine that there are many fewer limits on what the CIA can do in a particular case than there are for the FBI — to my knowledge, the President cannot order the FBI to assassinate someone, for instance. But the CIA cannot detain any significant number of people for long stretches of time without risking discovery and the compromise of its operations. And that means that, for very different reasons, neither our domestic law enforcement agencies nor our intelligence services could seriously consider the possibility of detaining people in perpetuity.

After 9/11, however, the administration decided that this had changed, and it came up with several ways of detaining people indefinitely: prisons in Afghanistan, Guantanamo, and elsewhere, and the idea of designating people as ‘unlawful enemy combatants’ to avoid both US law and the Geneva Conventions. In so doing, it created enough of a legal rationale that agencies that had always seen themselves as bound by the law had some reason for thinking that they could go along with things like the indefinite detention of a US citizen against whom no charges had been filed, and who had no access to counsel.

This created a possibility that neither domestic law enforcement agencies nor the intelligence community had needed to take seriously before: the possibility of detaining large numbers of people for as long as necessary, without having to answer to the US courts, foreign governments, or anyone else. I suspect that the fact that they had not needed to take this possibility seriously before meant that they had not thought it through seriously: earlier, the question how one would handle the indefinite detention of large numbers of people would have been just idle speculation.

Moreover, the point of this detention, after 9/11, was partly to get dangerous people into custody and off the street, but also, and importantly, to gather intelligence. And this fact, I think, meant that the interrogations used on detainees would have been based on practices used in the intelligence community, not domestic law enforcement. This is the kind of interrogation that the intelligence community has always done, and it stands to reason that its procedure would have been adopted. (Anyone remember all those news stories about the FBI scrambling to adjust to the post-9/11 world of intelligence gathering as opposed to law enforcement?)

So: what were those CIA procedures?

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More Troops? Check. More Armor? Oops.

by hilzoy From the Baltimore Sun (via dKos): “The thousands of troops that President Bush is expected to order to Iraq will join the fight largely without the protection of the latest armored vehicles that withstand bomb blasts far better than the Humvees in wide use, military officers said. Vehicles such as the Cougar and … Read more

Surge Support: Down To Bush And Barney

by hilzoy From the Washington Post: “When President Bush goes before the American people tonight to outline his new strategy for Iraq, he will be doing something he has avoided since the invasion of Iraq in March 2003: ordering his top military brass to take action they initially resisted and advised against. Bush talks frequently … Read more

The Torture of Jose Padilla: Part One

by hilzoy

Some stories are hard for me to write about. One appeared last month, and then again last week: the story of the torture of Jose Padilla. Much of the description of his treatment comes from a brief (pdf) filed by Padilla’s attorneys last October. I’ve transcribed the part of the brief that describes Padilla’s treatment below the fold, along with some further remarks.

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Bye Bye!

by hilzoy From the AP: “In a concession to the Senate’s new Democratic majority, President Bush won’t rename four controversial federal appeals court nominees whose confirmations were blocked last year, Republican officials said Tuesday. William Haynes, William G. Myers III and Michael Wallace all asked to have their appointments withdrawn, these officials said. Judge Terrence … Read more

Joe Klein

by hilzoy Joe Klein has offered a challenge to the left blogosphere and all its “illiberal leftists and reactionary progressives” who inhabit it. He writes: “Listening to the leftists, though, it’s easy to assume that they are rooting for an American failure. And so a challenge to those who slagged me in their comments. Can … Read more

Another Brilliant Decision…

by hilzoy Every so often, when I hear some judicious-sounding person say that s/he wants to wait and hear what Bush has to say about his plans for a surge before deciding whether or not it’s a good idea, I wonder: shouldn’t I be that magnanimous? I’m normally generous to people, even people I don’t … Read more

Mother Of Exiles? Not Anymore.

by hilzoy From the Washington Post: “Conservatives who supported President Bush’s reelection have joined liberal groups in expressing outrage over his administration’s broad use of anti-terrorism laws to reject asylum for thousands of people seeking refuge from religious, ethnic and political persecution. The critics say the administration’s interpretation of provisions mandating denial of asylum to … Read more

Open Thread: Manhole Covers!

by hilzoy I’m basically stealing this entire post from Effect Measure, where revere asked: why are manhole covers round? and answered: so that they can’t fall into the manhole, as they might if they were, say, rectangular. There are other shapes with this property, but circles are the simplest. I love this sort of factoid. … Read more

It Was My Understanding There Would Be No Math

by Andrew Responding to hilzoy’s post on discrimination, in which I end up making a case quite different to what I expected. For those who don’t recall, the study hilzoy referenced sent virtually identical candidates to interview for jobs, the one variable being ethnicity: each job was applied for by white, hispanic, and black applicants. … Read more

At The Expense Of Real Content

by hilzoy

Via LGM: today, the LATimes devotes a largish chunk of its op ed space to yet another column noting the astonishing fact that some college courses have silly names, and some go so far as to study silly topics. There have been innumerable versions of this column, all of which take the same form: go through the catalogs of various colleges (or, in this case, report that someone else has), pick the courses that sound silliest, and make fun of them. Thus far, there’s nothing particularly wrong with the genre, except that by now it has become a bit stale. The problem comes when the people who write these columns try to justify their efforts by pretending that the existence of course with silly names has some broader significance.

News flash: it doesn’t.

Here, for instance, is a bit from today’s column (by one Charlotte Allen):

“The problem that the Young America’s Foundation list, first issued in 1995, highlights isn’t simply the hollowing-out of the traditional humanities and social sciences disciplines at colleges and their replacement by crude indoctrination sessions in whatever is ideologically fashionable — although that’s a serious issue. At Occidental, for instance, it seems nearly impossible to study any field, save for the hard sciences, that doesn’t include “race, class and gender” among its topics. Even the Shakespeare course at Occidental this semester focuses on “cultural anxieties over authority, race, colonialism and religion” during the age of the Bard.

The bigger problem is that too much of American higher education has lost any notion of what its students ought to know about the ideas and people and movements that created the civilization in which they live: Who Plato was or what happened at Appomattox.”

Let’s see: is it really true that the humanities have been hollowed out and replaced by crude indoctrination sessions?

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Interesting Stem Cell Development

by hilzoy From the Washington Post: “A type of cell that floats freely in the amniotic fluid of pregnant women has been found to have many of the same traits as embryonic stem cells, including an ability to grow into brain, muscle and other tissues that could be used to treat a variety of diseases, … Read more

Job Discrimination

by hilzoy Via Brad Plumer, here’s a study (a little over a year old) in which white, Latino, and black applicants with matched (fictitious) resumes were sent to apply for real jobs. About the testers: “The testers were well-spoken young men, aged 22 to 26; most were college-educated, between 5 feet 10 inches and 6 … Read more

Another Good Day (Go Team Go!)

by hilzoy From the NYT: “The House voted on Friday to pull the shadowy tradition of Congressional earmarking into the daylight, requiring lawmakers to attach their names to the pet items they slip into spending or tax bills and certify that they have no financial interest in the provisions. More than any of several ethics … Read more